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Old 11-01-2011, 11:33 AM
 
11,110 posts, read 9,028,955 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonChick View Post
She means, if the son/daughter is 16, would you allow him/her to date someone who was 25?
Can someone tell me if there is ANYTHING wholesome that a 25 year old would want with a 16 year old? There is such a world of maturity difference between those ages.
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Old 11-01-2011, 11:39 AM
 
11,603 posts, read 19,452,538 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopes View Post
Bolded part is bad advice, IMO. You don't entrust that important responsibility to anyone else. YOU look after your drink. You take your drink with you wherever you go.
Friends should look out for one another. Sure we should all be 100% vigilant 100% of the time, but if that fails it never hurts to have friends look out for one another.
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Old 11-01-2011, 11:41 AM
 
Location: Western Washington
8,004 posts, read 9,515,423 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopes View Post
Bolded part is bad advice, IMO. You don't entrust that important responsibility to anyone else. YOU look after your drink. You take your drink with you wherever you go.
You slam that baby before you go to the bathroom! Don't leave anything in it to spike. That was always MY MO.....
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Old 11-01-2011, 11:43 AM
 
Location: Western Washington
8,004 posts, read 9,515,423 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by somebodynew View Post
Can someone tell me if there is ANYTHING wholesome that a 25 year old would want with a 16 year old? There is such a world of maturity difference between those ages.
Not in MY opinion. No way in hell would I let my 16 yo date a 25 yo. No way, no how! I'd be chasing his arse off my property with a garden tool......preferable a potato fork/cultivater!
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Old 11-01-2011, 12:03 PM
 
Location: Grosse Ile Michigan
24,244 posts, read 58,499,261 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopes View Post
That's strange. My father had all girls. He chose to teach us how to take care of ourselves. He didn't want us depending on a guy for safety. He knew better than that. Teaching things like "make sure you always have money to take a cab home" ensured his daughters were empowered, capable women.

Even if you teach your daughter safety, lecturing a date like you suggest sends the message to your daughter that you don't trust that she can protect herself. Here you have this beauitful girl who you have known her whole life and you trust a stranger to protect her more than you trust her to protect herself. That engrains a victim mentality in women.

Every single one of those "basic rules" you listed are things girls should be taught to do for themselves. Why make a girl think that a guy should be in charge of protecting her drink? He could be the one who does something to her drink! It's the daughter who should never let the drink out of her sight!

If you don't teach daughters how to protect themselves and constantly send the message that you expect dates to protect them, they won't know how to protect themselves when they move away to another city when they're adults.

I teach my daughters to take care of themselves, but they are not physically as capable as their dates. Besides he is the one making decisions on where they will go and what they will do. Sometimes they will have input, but they expect a guy to have a date plan and not pick them up and say "What would you like to do?" Besides, if he does not have a precises plan where they will be and when and how they are getting there, he is not getting out the door with her.

Finally I expect that in a crises he would lay down his life for her if necessary. If he takes her out, he is taking responsibility to bring her back safe and sound. That is and always will be his obligation. Sorry, just how I am. Women are precious and men have an obligation to protect them at all costs.

My daughters know how to protect themselves to an extent. However more importantly they know that in many cases, they cannot protect themselves. They know how to avoid a problem situation, how to recognize a bad area, and how and when to find help. The people who think that pepper spray or karate is going to keep them safe in a nasty situation have never had a taste of a real crises situation. Unless of course you mean carrying and knowing how to use a handgun. However i am not going to send a 16 or 17 year old out with a handgun. Besides people who use a gun at a range, or shooting at a distant animal generally have no idea whether they could effectively use a weapon in a crises (not to mention that unless you are carrying the gun around in your hand and have the safety off, it is usually not going to do you a bit of good. The concept of the bad guy mysteriously stalking someone and leaving plenty of time to get out and prepare a weapon is great for movies. Reality is the guy comes out of nowhere and you have one or two seconds to react.). So how is a 110 pound girl going to protect herself from the 200 pound drunk? She is going to run for help while her date flings himself at the 200 pound drunk. The 110 pound karate girl tossing around the 200 pound muscleman only happens in action movies. I make certain that my girls understand that life is not an action movie - run and get help is how your take care of yourself. Your date's job is to slow the guy down while you get away.

I do not trust a guy to protect her as much as I expect him to protect her. I make it clear that if something happens to her, he is going to answer to me and that will be worse than anything that could happen to him in trying to protect her. If she goes out on her own or with friends, it is up to her to stay out of trouble. But if he takes her somewhere there is trouble, it is up to him to get her out of the trouble, no matter what it is. I expect above all else that he not take her anyplace where they will get into trouble. However if he does, whether inadvertently, through stupidity, or just chance, then it is his responsibility. If his car goes into the river and she does not get out, he darn well better dive back in and go get her. If you are not willing to give up your life if necessary when she is with you, then simply do not take her out.

Last edited by Coldjensens; 11-01-2011 at 12:13 PM..
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Old 11-01-2011, 12:05 PM
 
Location: The Hall of Justice
25,907 posts, read 34,480,643 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by somebodynew View Post
Can someone tell me if there is ANYTHING wholesome that a 25 year old would want with a 16 year old? There is such a world of maturity difference between those ages.
Unless you're Laura Ingalls being escorted through the snow by Almanzo Wilder so that you can get safely to your teaching job, no.
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Old 11-01-2011, 12:28 PM
 
32,538 posts, read 28,830,266 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coldjensens View Post
So how is a 110 pound girl going to protect herself from the 200 pound drunk? She is going to run for help while her date flings himself at the 200 pound drunk. The 110 pound karate girl tossing around the 200 pound muscleman only happens in action movies. I make certain that my girls understand that life is not an action movie - run and get help is how your take care of yourself. Your date's job is to slow the guy down while you get away.
See, now my daddy taught me that after my date threw himself on the 200 pound drunk and the guys were thrashing around on the floor, that's when I was to kick the big drunk guy but good. Right in the nuts. (Can we say that word?) Then when big drunk guy was grabbing the family jewels I was to place my dainty size seven foot right on top of his throat, put my weight into it and cut off his oxygen supply.

Daddy didn't raise no helpless little wimpette.
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Old 11-01-2011, 12:34 PM
 
43,012 posts, read 87,762,544 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coldjensens View Post
I teach my daughters to take care of themselves, but they are not physically as capable as their dates. Besides he is the one making decisions on where they will go and what they will do. Sometimes they will have input, but they expect a guy to have a date plan and not pick them up and say "What would you like to do?" Besides, if he does not have a precises plan where they will be and when and how they are getting there, he is not getting out the door with her.

Finally I expect that in a crises he would lay down his life for her if necessary. If he takes her out, he is taking responsibility to bring her back safe and sound. That is and always will be his obligation. Sorry, just how I am. Women are precious and men have an obligation to protect them at all costs.

My daughters know how to protect themselves to an extent. However more importantly they know that in many cases, they cannot protect themselves. They know how to avoid a problem situation, how to recognize a bad area, and how and when to find help. The people who think that pepper spray or karate is going to keep them safe in a nasty situation have never had a taste of a real crises situation. Unless of course you mean carrying and knowing how to use a handgun. However i am not going to send a 16 or 17 year old out with a handgun. Besides people who use a gun at a range, or shooting at a distant animal generally have no idea whether they could effectively use a weapon in a crises (not to mention that unless you are carrying the gun around in your hand and have the safety off, it is usually not going to do you a bit of good. The concept of the bad guy mysteriously stalking someone and leaving plenty of time to get out and prepare a weapon is great for movies. Reality is the guy comes out of nowhere and you have one or two seconds to react.). So how is a 110 pound girl going to protect herself from the 200 pound drunk? She is going to run for help while her date flings himself at the 200 pound drunk. The 110 pound karate girl tossing around the 200 pound muscleman only happens in action movies. I make certain that my girls understand that life is not an action movie - run and get help is how your take care of yourself. Your date's job is to slow the guy down while you get away.

I do not trust a guy to protect her as much as I expect him to protect her. I make it clear that if something happens to her, he is going to answer to me and that will be worse than anything that could happen to him in trying to protect her. If she goes out on her own or with friends, it is up to her to stay out of trouble. But if he takes her somewhere there is trouble, it is up to him to get her out of the trouble, no matter what it is. I expect above all else that he not take her anyplace where they will get into trouble. However if he does, whether inadvertently, through stupidity, or just chance, then it is his responsibility. If his car goes into the river and she does not get out, he darn well better dive back in and go get her. If you are not willing to give up your life if necessary when she is with you, then simply do not take her out.
This is so sad. You're failing to realize that the date himself is the greatest risk to your daughters.

You have white knight syndrome---the need to be viewed as the protector and savior of weak little women. But that isn't going to help your daughters when they no longer live with you. You're doing your daughters a disservice by instilling a weak victim mentality into them.

Threatening dates and making them accountable to you is worthless! You need to teach your daughters now how to manage when you are no longer around. You're not going to live forever! Your view is so short sighted!

You're concerned less about your daughters and more about about your own self importance. It's all about you, you, you. It's all about macho men, men, men.

Sure, men are important in women's lives, but women should know how to take care of themselves. Part of protecting themselves is not putting themselves into a position where they have to match physical strength. And knowing what to do if they are.

It's foolish of you to teach them that they are weak and need a man for protection. You're setting them up to be potential victims of domestic abuse later in life. It's such a shame that your need to feel manly is defining your daughters as weak.
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Old 11-01-2011, 12:47 PM
 
Location: The Hall of Justice
25,907 posts, read 34,480,643 times
Reputation: 42339
My 15-year-old doesn't go places where I have to worry about 200-lb drunks endangering her life. I don't let her that far out into the world yet.

Another rule I have--well, it's not so much a rule as a promise that her father and I made to her--is that no matter where she is, no matter what she is doing or whom she is with, she can always call us if she needs to get home. We told that we couldn't promise to not ever get mad, but we would put that aside if she needed us to come get her, and we would deal with that later. I don't ever want my kids to find themselves in a bad situation and not call for help because they were afraid of what we would say. I don't want her getting in the car with someone who's been drinking because it's late and she doesn't want to ask us to drive her home, or stay somewhere she is uncomfortable because she doesn't want us to know she is there. Teenagers can get themselves into predicaments, and she knows that she always has a way out.
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Old 11-01-2011, 12:59 PM
 
47,576 posts, read 57,994,888 times
Reputation: 22124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopes View Post
That's strange. My father had all girls. He chose to teach us how to take care of ourselves. He didn't want us depending on a guy for safety. He knew better than that. Teaching things like "make sure you always have money to take a cab home" ensured his daughters were empowered, capable women.

Even if you teach your daughter safety, lecturing a date like you suggest sends the message to your daughter that you don't trust that she can protect herself. Here you have this beauitful girl who you have known her whole life and you trust a stranger to protect her more than you trust her to protect herself. That engrains a victim mentality in women.

Every single one of those "basic rules" you listed are things girls should be taught to do for themselves. Why make a girl think that a guy should be in charge of protecting her drink? He could be the one who does something to her drink! It's the daughter who should never let the drink out of her sight!

If you don't teach daughters how to protect themselves and constantly send the message that you expect dates to protect them, they won't know how to protect themselves when they move away to another city when they're adults.
Obviously your way isn't working for all those girls that have been date raped and been drugged at a party or club and found themselves raped.

If my daughter goes out with a guy, I expect him to watch out for her safety, not take her to places where she would HAVE to protect herself and certainly not be the kind of boy she would need to protect herself from.

Date rape is more prevalent than ever. Girls are not protecting themselves.

Yes I also teach all my kids about protecting their drinks, not drinking from a glass or can they left unattended, AND I remind their friends of the same thing. Including any boys that want to date my daughter. But I would also tell a group of boys or girls going out the same thing.
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