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Old 12-18-2018, 08:54 AM
 
Location: Wherever life takes me.
6,072 posts, read 6,482,734 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jilly9244 View Post
Pop him in the mouth
Thatís the worst idea ever.
My mom use to slap me in the face any time I ever disagreed with her.
Now if my boyfriend goes to do something sweet like move the hair out of my face I flinch or if people put their hands near my face I flinch and move away.

Iím super sensitive about things things my face and people touching my face.

Itís made me weird about it. Donít make your kids weirdos too.
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Old 12-18-2018, 08:58 AM
 
Location: NY>FL>VA>NC>IN
2,174 posts, read 819,914 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txtqueen View Post
That’s the worst idea ever.
My mom use to slap me in the face any time I ever disagreed with her.
Now if my boyfriend goes to do something sweet like move the hair out of my face I flinch or if people put their hands near my face I flinch and move away.

I’m super sensitive about things things my face and people touching my face.

It’s made me weird about it. Don’t make your kids weirdos too.
I was horrifically abused in childhood by a sadistic Mother and I too flinch/startle if anyone approaches my head or face esp if I don't expect the touch and if someone comes up behind me I jump a mile and panic BUT all 4 of mine who were slapped never did/do. The context/backdrop to the slap is everything. Mine were slapped not in anger nor to cause pain (as was done to me) and only when well deserved.
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Old 12-18-2018, 09:08 AM
 
11,569 posts, read 9,426,875 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VexedAndSolitary View Post
I was horrifically abused in childhood by a sadistic Mother and I too flinch/startle if anyone approaches my head or face esp if I don't expect the touch and if someone comes up behind me I jump a mile and panic BUT all 4 of mine who were slapped never did/do. The context/backdrop to the slap is everything. Mine were slapped not in anger nor to cause pain (as was done to me) and only when well deserved.
How does a small, inexperienced, clueless human deserve to be slapped?
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Old 12-18-2018, 09:13 AM
 
Location: NY>FL>VA>NC>IN
2,174 posts, read 819,914 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by somebodynew View Post
How does a small, inexperienced, clueless human deserve to be slapped?
When they refuse to cease a behavior that Mother/any adult has told them to stop engaging in, or the reverse, refuse to heed a directive from an adult, or for disrespectful behavior/speech, that's how.

Physical chastisement was not applied due to "cluelessness" in my household; it was meted out appropriate to age/degree of understanding of child of its own behavior vs what was expected of it.

Last edited by VexedAndSolitary; 12-18-2018 at 09:22 AM..
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Old 12-18-2018, 09:50 AM
 
11,569 posts, read 9,426,875 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VexedAndSolitary View Post
When they refuse to cease a behavior that Mother/any adult has told them to stop engaging in, or the reverse, refuse to heed a directive from an adult, or for disrespectful behavior/speech, that's how.

Physical chastisement was not applied due to "cluelessness" in my household; it was meted out appropriate to age/degree of understanding of child of its own behavior vs what was expected of it.
When kids do the things you describe, they are exhibiting inexperience and cluelessness. They are humans trying to learn, not tv's to respond to adult remote control.
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Old 12-18-2018, 09:56 AM
 
Location: NY>FL>VA>NC>IN
2,174 posts, read 819,914 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by somebodynew View Post
When kids do the things you describe, they are exhibiting inexperience and cluelessness. They are humans trying to learn, not tv's to respond to adult remote control.
I reared my 4 old school. It worked; all are successful productive (relative to age and station; two are mid thirties married w/kids and youngest 19 and 20 both uni students) adults who would tell you they were grateful for their upbringing, honestly. They are all scornful of more permissive childrearing methods as am I.

Even as teens they were appalled at behaviors they witnessed in their peers and would tell me of this with amazement that so and so got away with thus and such; a strict upbringing that includes physical chastisement (and I called it that when they were children; they joke about that now with their spouses) is not to be confused with an abusive rearing. They are distinctly different.

Last edited by VexedAndSolitary; 12-18-2018 at 10:07 AM..
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Old 12-18-2018, 09:58 AM
 
11,569 posts, read 9,426,875 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VexedAndSolitary View Post
I reared my 4 old school. It worked; all are successful productive (relative to age and station; two are mid thrties married w/kids and youngest 19 and 20 both uni students) adults who would tell you they were grateful for their upbringing, honestly. They are all scornful of more permissive childrearing methods as am I.

Sigh. We have not come far if the dialog remains hit kids or be permissive. Your kids grew up to his their kids. What fun.
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Old 12-18-2018, 10:08 AM
 
Location: Winterpeg
696 posts, read 254,027 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by somebodynew View Post
Sigh. We have not come far if the dialog remains hit kids or be permissive. Your kids grew up to his their kids. What fun.
Indeed.

People who hit children don't seem to see any other way of teaching than hitting and fear, is what I've learned from discussions like this. And no matter how often they are told that not hitting does not equal permissive, they refuse to see it. That would require thinking, and reflexive responses like hitting don't require thinking.

I teach dog obedience classes and work in animal behaviour, and it's the same in dog world. Those who physically punish dogs often see no other way to do it, and are scornful of people who have figured out a more effective and less negative way to teach.

Slapping another human in the face is purposely a humiliating and painful move, and I can't for the life of me figure out why someone would do that to their small child. Like using a sledgehammer to put in a finishing nail.

Eye rolling is a physical expression of an emotion. My job was to teach my daughter to control that expression. I did it by pointing out that it was not helping her case when she did so. I used the steely stare that others have mentioned, and said things like "well now that I saw that, you've just lost your case". And it worked, she learned.
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Old 12-18-2018, 10:51 AM
 
11,569 posts, read 9,426,875 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bondaroo View Post
Indeed.

People who hit children don't seem to see any other way of teaching than hitting and fear, is what I've learned from discussions like this. And no matter how often they are told that not hitting does not equal permissive, they refuse to see it. That would require thinking, and reflexive responses like hitting don't require thinking.
The other oft ignored thing abut teaching is what, exactly, one is teaching. A child will often seem to absorb the right lessons, how to behave under certain circumstances. But they learn other things as well. Feelings are to be squashed. Behaving according to the code of another authority is more important than critical thinking. Conformance is important. Even right and wrong are based on some code exposed and enforced by some "other" authority, not themselves.

Quote:
I teach dog obedience classes and work in animal behaviour, and it's the same in dog world. Those who physically punish dogs often see no other way to do it, and are scornful of people who have figured out a more effective and less negative way to teach.
With both dogs and humans, positive disciplinary teaching is not just less negative but I highlight your statement that it is FAR more effective. I won't lie. I think this sort of transition of thinking is very difficult among people who were, themselves, raised with authoritarian discipline.

Quote:
Slapping another human in the face is purposely a humiliating and painful move, and I can't for the life of me figure out why someone would do that to their small child. Like using a sledgehammer to put in a finishing nail.

Eye rolling is a physical expression of an emotion. My job was to teach my daughter to control that expression. I did it by pointing out that it was not helping her case when she did so. I used the steely stare that others have mentioned, and said things like "well now that I saw that, you've just lost your case". And it worked, she learned.
Yah things like eye rolling are so trivial. You hit your kid over something like that, and you lose their true respect and trust.
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Old 12-18-2018, 11:03 AM
 
1,984 posts, read 1,204,554 times
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How about sitting down or pausing for a moment and discussing why those behaviors are not appropriate communication? And teaching your kid what IS appropriate communication.

I remember asking my son "What are you trying to communicate to me when you talk with that tone of voice?" Then I explained that when he talks in that tone, it makes me feel angry, and then communication breaks down and we both end up getting in a bad mood. Also, I asked him how he could get his point across in a different way.

Yes, I taught my son how to talk about his feelings. I thought he should be able to say things like "Mom, I'm really busy with XYZ and you talking about ABC right now is annoying me. Can we talk at dinner?" It didn't take long for " I HATE taking out the trash!" stomp-stomp-slam to turn into understanding that we all have jobs to do and bad behavior doesn't make them go away or get shorter.

I'm a big fan of teaching kids how to self-regulate. I asked my son "Is this the type of person you really want to be?" throughout his life. He figured out for himself that he really doesn't want to be a brat.

But hey, if slapping, threatening violence, and pulling rank works, that sounds easier, right?
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