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Old 01-05-2012, 02:42 PM
 
Location: Upper Midwest
1,875 posts, read 3,583,215 times
Reputation: 1869

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Quote:
Originally Posted by omigawd View Post
I just looked and there's a RIP Amanda Facebook page and there are some nasty comments on there, too. Ridiculous




Please tell me what 15 year old doesn't have or encourage drama in their life??? Teenagers are all about angst and drama. I don't think she encouraged people to hate her enough to write nasty messages on her Facebook wall as she lay dying in a hospital.

I wish you would "explain" what you mean --- I'm far from ignorant and I don't understand what you're talking about other than what I just posted (teens and drama/angst)
You don't think she partially stirred the pot by knowing her bullies were out there and choosing to keep a public Facebook? I know a lot of people who keep their walls public, but very few allow posts from strangers on top of that... that's rare. And honestly, that is not the action of someone who is motivated to keep the negative drama out of her life.

But anyway that's all I'll say. That's kind of one of my new year's resolutions. Be myself more and explain myself less. If you don't understand, maybe you're just not meant to.

 
Old 01-05-2012, 02:54 PM
 
Location: Geneva, IL
12,976 posts, read 11,811,103 times
Reputation: 14677
Quote:
Originally Posted by Minnesconsinite View Post
You don't think she partially stirred the pot by knowing her bullies were out there and choosing to keep a public Facebook? I know a lot of people who keep their walls public, but very few allow posts from strangers on top of that... that's rare. And honestly, that is not the action of someone who is motivated to keep the negative drama out of her life.

But anyway that's all I'll say. That's kind of one of my new year's resolutions. Be myself more and explain myself less. If you don't understand, maybe you're just not meant to.
Aahh! Blame the victim? Nice.
 
Old 01-05-2012, 02:56 PM
 
Location: Petticoat Junction
930 posts, read 1,579,438 times
Reputation: 1487
Ya know, its possible to live without Facebook. Really. There are at least ten or twelve clinical examples from laboratory testing to prove it.
 
Old 01-05-2012, 02:59 PM
 
Location: Upper Midwest
1,875 posts, read 3,583,215 times
Reputation: 1869
Quote:
Originally Posted by AJBarney View Post
Ya know, its possible to live without Facebook. Really. There are at least ten or twelve clinical examples from laboratory testing to prove it.
True. I've cut way back. I was on the patch for a while...
 
Old 01-05-2012, 03:06 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
3,388 posts, read 3,230,739 times
Reputation: 2387
Quote:
Originally Posted by Minnesconsinite View Post
Well..... obviously Amanda encouraged some of the drama in her life, I see.

This opens up a whole new angle on it.

I won't even explain that. The ignorant people will think I'm being mean, the smart ones will understand where I'm coming from.
While you are entitled to your opinion, I have to say, I'm plenty smart and somewhat of an expert on adolescence by professional training, and what you wrote came across as " she must have done something to deserve or encourage it." Maybe not what you meant, but what it sounded like. And we don't know the details of her life, but I have to say, giving the bullies the benefit of the doubt here, I find a little appalling.

As I mentioned earlier, just blocking people doesn't necessarily stop the cyber bullying or finding out about it. I worked with a number of suicidal teens who had that exact problem, going so far as to switch schools and it still continued. Sometimes "the mean kids" can be very persistent, like sharks smelling blood in the water. If you haven't seen that phenomenon in action,well, that's lucky for you.
 
Old 01-05-2012, 03:10 PM
 
Location: Upper Midwest
1,875 posts, read 3,583,215 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eastwesteastagain View Post
While you are entitled to your opinion, I have to say, I'm plenty smart and somewhat of an expert on adolescence by professional training, and what you wrote came across as " she must have done something to deserve or encourage it."
Encourage, absolutely.

Quote:
Maybe not what you meant, but what it sounded like. And we don't know the details of her life, but I have to say, giving the bullies the benefit of the doubt here, I find a little appalling.
Of course ya do...
And I didn't give the bullies anything.
 
Old 01-05-2012, 03:19 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
3,388 posts, read 3,230,739 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Minnesconsinite View Post
Encourage, absolutely.



Of course ya do...
And I didn't give the bullies anything.
Just a thought: if you're going to make a statement to "stir the pot" and not back it up by discussion, it doesn't necessarily contribute much.

There are instances, and plenty of them, where kids and teens are the targets of bullies because they are perceived as weak or different. What I find appalling is that your post seems to assume that bullying is the result of two-way drama, which i'm sure does occur in some cases, but in my professional experience, the suicidal victims of bullying were not engaged in any two-way drama.
 
Old 01-05-2012, 03:26 PM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,393 posts, read 29,758,930 times
Reputation: 14503
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
They are proud of themselves. This is about power. They succeeded. And they'll get away with it. It's about being so important that you can control another person.

We have raised a generation of kids to think they are better than everyone else. From the time they were little, we've praised them and told them how special they are. It should come as no suprise that when the praise stops, they'll turn to putting others down to feel good about themselves. They want that I'm better than you feeling they've grown up with. When they world doesn't tell them how special and wonderful they are, they settle for building themselves up by tearing others down. While they'll be shocked they actually pushed her to kill herself, once the shock wears off, they'll be amazed with themselves for having that much power.

And for the ones bullied, all that praise resulted in shallow self esteem that crumbles at the first criticism. When the world not only doesn't tell them how great they are but tells them how awful they are, they can't deal with it. All this feel good parenting is coming back to bite us. Parents did this to kids. Yes, we built their self esteem but we built monsters too and left our kids without the ability to fight them or fight becomming one.
We raise our children in stark contrast to how they were raised in the past and then act shocked when they don't espouse the same values as in the past . In the past, children were born into a family and expected to adapt to the family. Today, the family transforms around the child. In the past, children were part of a community (translation just one of many and no more deserving than the next) and taught that they owed something to society. Today, they're told how special they are so they grow up expecting something from society. And then we wring our hands when they react badly to a society that doesn't consider them special at all. They don't know how to deal with just being one of millions in society because we never taught them. We told them they were special.

Yes, I blame feel good parenting ego stroking for a lot of what ails us today. It is far better to raise our children to think others are more important than they are than to raise them to think they are special. What are others if you are the special one?

I see one of two things happening when children, who have been raised to believe they are special, go out into a world in which they are just one of many. Either they will try to build themselves up by tearing others down to gain that feeling of being special or they will be crushed by the loss of their specialness. Those of the first type will prey on those of the second type....and we end up with situations like this...

We need to get back to teaching our children that they are like everyone else. Members of society, that they owe something to society and others are important. The only ones who are special are the ones that prove to be special in the long run. The rest are just run of the mill, and you know what???? THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH BEING AVERAGE!!!! We've taught our kids they have to be special. We gave them a label to live up to WITHOUT giving them the means to actually be special. And we wring our hands and wonder why crap like this happens....

Yes, I blame feel good parenting for leaving kids so vulnerable to bullying that they can't deal with it. For giving them egos that are so fragile they crumble if they're not being told they're special. Why did anyone think they were doing their kids any favors to build such a fragile false self esteem?

Last edited by Ivorytickler; 01-05-2012 at 03:36 PM..
 
Old 01-05-2012, 03:30 PM
 
Location: Upper Midwest
1,875 posts, read 3,583,215 times
Reputation: 1869
There are some things you can control, and things you can't.

You can control the settings of your Facebook.

The fact that she kept it public and completely open to be read and be posted on by anybody (who does that? nobody I know) speaks volumes about her pro-activeness in solving her problem with these people (non-existent).

If you want to read some deep dark meaning into that, or view that simple point of view as "stirring the pot" go ahead.
 
Old 01-05-2012, 03:36 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
3,388 posts, read 3,230,739 times
Reputation: 2387
Quote:
Originally Posted by Minnesconsinite View Post
There are some things you can control, and things you can't.

You can control the settings of your Facebook.

The fact that she kept it public and completely open to be read and be posted on by anybody (who does that? nobody I know) speaks volumes about her pro-activeness in solving her problem with these people (non-existent).

If you want to read some deep dark meaning into that, or view that simple point of view as "stirring the pot" go ahead.
I guess what I don't understand is why you would assume keeping her fb not private (which I generally think isn't smart) is rare among teenagers? It's not rare, at least among the teens I have worked with ( stupid, IMO, yes, but rare, no). So, I guess I find it confusing that a relatively common behavior could tell you volumes about her problem solving or lack thereof? Certainly you can hold that opinion, I'm not disagreeing about that.
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