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Old 05-27-2012, 02:41 PM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,290 posts, read 27,959,404 times
Reputation: 14318

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Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
You are wrong.

You are very lucky. Lucky your husband is healthy and alive. Lucky that your family hasn't had to deal with a job loss in this economy.

My parents died in an accident and left me three very young siblings to raise. Despite good insurance I was not LUCKY enough to have luxury of staying home with them once try were in school.

So unless you are claiming you deliberately went out and married a man who could provide you with enough income that you could CHOOSE to stay home then you are foolish for not realizing just how LUCKY you are.
Excellent points.

Even if she did, deliberately, go out and marry a man who could support her SAH, she's lucky he still has a job in this day and age. We've had several families on our street lose everything when the husband lost his job. Like it or not, there is a certain amount of luck involved in your plans working out the way you want them to.

 
Old 05-27-2012, 02:42 PM
 
4,267 posts, read 4,872,314 times
Reputation: 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
You are wrong.

You are very lucky. Lucky your husband is healthy and alive. Lucky that your family hasn't had to deal with a job loss in this economy.

My parents died in an accident and left me three very young siblings to raise. Despite good insurance I was not LUCKY enough to have luxury of staying home with them once try were in school.

So unless you are claiming you deliberately went out and married a man who could provide you with enough income that you could CHOOSE to stay home then you are foolish for not realizing just how LUCKY you are.
Ya know. I said before that sometimes luck is a factor so I'm not sure why you feel the need to start off your post by saying, "You are wrong". It's not conducive to having a conversation.
 
Old 05-27-2012, 02:43 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
3,388 posts, read 3,040,372 times
Reputation: 2377
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
Who cares who sacrifices what? The only way sacrifices matter is if one SHOULD sacrifice for something. If there is no should here, sacrifices don't matter. It's just people choosing what they want out of life. Period.

IMO, it's not a sacrifice to give up one thing you want for something you want more. It's a choice. We are, truely, lucky in life if we have choices.
IMO, "should" is not a useful word, unless one is invested in judging other people's choices or situations. I am crystal clear on what your view is, thanks. I do agree that having choices makes one fortunate; for most people, it is not an all-or-none proposition.
 
Old 05-27-2012, 02:52 PM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,290 posts, read 27,959,404 times
Reputation: 14318
Quote:
Originally Posted by eastwesteastagain View Post
IMO, "should" is not a useful word. I am crystal clear on what your view is, thanks. I do agree that having choices makes one fortunate; for most people, it is not an all-or-none proposition.
The word sacrifice implies giving something up for a greater good. While is is, preferred lifestyle for many, SAH is not a greater good. If there's no greater good, there's no sacrifice. Just a choice. When you get what you wanted, that is it's own reward even if you didn't get something else you wanted less. If I buy the blue car instead of the red car, I don't go around saying I sacrificed the red car to have the blue car. I say I chose. Just as the red car is no better than the blue care, SAH is no better than WOH. Maternal working status isn't a determining factor in how our kids turn out. Things like maternal education level at the time of birth, whether your parents are married, SES and demographics trump working status to the point working status isn't a blip on the radar.

I once pissed a SAHM off royally on this topic. We were sitting in the park talking, (it was the middle of the day so her initial assumption was I was a SAHM) and she started talking about how she sacrificed to SAH and then made a comment about WM's being greedy (referring to a working neighbor). I gave her a puzzled look and asked why living in this neighborhood (she had talked about sacrificing living in a nice house) was a sacrifice for her but a working mom working to live in the same neighborhood was evidence of greed? She got up and left without a word. I find it interesting that she thought that a working mom working to have the same lifestyle she called a sacrifice was evidence of greed. It can't be both a sacrifice and a lavish lifestyle at the same time now can it?
 
Old 05-27-2012, 02:57 PM
 
Location: Denver area
20,439 posts, read 20,564,338 times
Reputation: 32313
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
The word sacrifice implies giving something up for a greater good. While is is, preferred lifestyle for many, SAH is not a greater good. If there's no greater good, there's no sacrifice. Just a choice. When you get what you wanted, that is it's own reward even if you didn't get something else you wanted less. If I buy the blue car instead of the red car, I don't go around saying I sacrificed the red car to have the blue car. I say I chose. Just as the red car is no better than the blue care, SAH is no better than WOH. Maternal working status isn't a determining factor in how our kids turn out. Things like whether your parents are married, SES and demographics trump working status to the point working status isn't a blip on the radar.

I once pissed a SAHM off royally on this topic. We were sitting in the park talking, (it was the middle of the day so her initial assumption was I was a SAHM) and she started talking about how she sacrificed to SAH and then made a comment about WM's being greedy (referring to a working neighbor). I gave her a puzzled look and asked why living in this neighborhood (she had talked about sacrificing living in a nice house) was a sacrifice for her but a working mom working to live in the same neighborhood was evidence of greed? She got up and left without a word. I find it interesting that she thought that a working mom working to have the same lifestyle she called a sacrifice was evidence of greed. It can't be both a sacrifice and a lavish lifestyle at the same time now can it?

Aaaand here we go again.
 
Old 05-27-2012, 02:58 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
3,388 posts, read 3,040,372 times
Reputation: 2377
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
The word sacrifice implies giving something up for a greater good. While is is, preferred lifestyle for many, SAH is not a greater good. If there's no greater good, there's no sacrifice. Just a choice. When you get what you wanted, that is it's own reward even if you didn't get something else you wanted less. If I buy the blue car instead of the red car, I don't go around saying I sacrificed the red car to have the blue car. I say I chose. Just as the red car is no better than the blue care, SAH is no better than WOH. Maternal working status isn't a determining factor in how our kids turn out. Things like whether your parents are married, SES and demographics trump working status to the point working status isn't a blip on the radar.

I once pissed a SAHM off royally on this topic. We were sitting in the park talking, (it was the middle of the day so her initial assumption was I was a SAHM) and she started talking about how she sacrificed to SAH and then made a comment about WM's being greedy (referring to a working neighbor). I gave her a puzzled look and asked why living in this neighborhood (she had talked about sacrificing living in a nice house) was a sacrifice for her but a working mom working to live in the same neighborhood was evidence of greed? She got up and left without a word. I find it interesting that she thought that a working mom working to have the same lifestyle she called a sacrifice was evidence of greed. It can't be both a sacrifice and a lavish lifestyle at the same time now can it?
Again, crystal clear on what your view is, thanks. I don't think one working status is better than another, so I don't congratulate or condemn on the basis of it.
 
Old 05-27-2012, 02:59 PM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,290 posts, read 27,959,404 times
Reputation: 14318
Quote:
Originally Posted by maciesmom View Post
Aaaand here we go again.
The problem, maciesmom, is that using the word sacrifice implies giving up something for a greater good as if SAH is a greater good. Once we accept that SAH/WOH are irrevent we can drop the self edifying use of the word sacrifice and call it what it is. A lifestyle choice. I don't know why that's seen as an affront. It shouldn't be. It's nice when we get to choose what we want in life. And when we don't, we do what we have to. That's just life.
 
Old 05-27-2012, 03:00 PM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,290 posts, read 27,959,404 times
Reputation: 14318
Quote:
Originally Posted by eastwesteastagain View Post
Again, crystal clear on what your view is, thanks. I don't think one working status is better than another, so I don't congratulate or condemn on the basis of it.
My view is that neither is superior and the only people who have the right to talk about sacrificing here are the ones who don't have choices. The moms who would rather SAH but sacrifice what they want because their kids are better off if they work. The moms like my cousin, who would much rather be working but SAH because her son needs round the clock medical care and it was cheaper to train her and have her SAH. They do what they do for the greater good. The rest of us just choose what we want and should consider ourselves lucky we get to choose.
 
Old 05-27-2012, 03:01 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
3,388 posts, read 3,040,372 times
Reputation: 2377
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
My view is that neither is superior.
Interesting. My view is the same, without caveats.
 
Old 05-27-2012, 03:02 PM
 
4,267 posts, read 4,872,314 times
Reputation: 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
You can plan all you want but you don't have luck on your side, you have nothing. It amazes me that people are arrogant enough to say they are where they are because of their planning. You have to be lucky enough to be able to plan in the first place and then be lucky enough that life doesn't derail that plan. One of the reasons I didn't stay home with my kids is that I know how fast life can change and I didn't want to get caught with my pants down. I didn't want to chance regretting not working when I could have only to find later that I couldn't. I have friends in that position. They chose not to work when their kids were young and now health issues prevent them from working. The time they thought they'd have to make up for the years spent not working isn't there for them. While I have fared better, I still regret the years I worked only part time. We'd be that much closer to having college paid for for the girls if I hadn't been selfish. Not something I'm proud of. I should have put my kids first but I put myself first.
BTW, there is nothing wrong with the plan being working to support your children. It is a parent's responsibility to support their children.
Why are you so condescending to people who make choices that differ from your own?
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