Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I disagree with the bolded. Yes you can stop her. You can take it away from her like you say you do in the 2nd paragraph down. That is stopping her. a 2.5 year old should have her hands held if she is tossing things and making a mess. To say "she chooses to" and that you can't stop her is very strange to me.
When my kid was 18 months old, it was fine to physically restrain her. She did something wrong, we restrained her and then she lost interest.
Today at 2 1/2 physical restraints don't work the same way. She doesn't learn not to do it, it just makes her angry that we have physically taken away her ability to choose what to do in life. And I've realized that I need her to choose to listen to me, and we as parents we need to focus on the choices that we can make and not try to force her to make the right choice. This sounds weird but isn't.
For example, she has taken to not wanting to sit in her carseat while in the car. After playing in the park, she refused to sit in it. I wanted to physically force her to sit in it, but realize that she's not learning anything except to get angry at me. What I need her to do is listen to me when I tell her to do something, and that is the lesson that needs to be learned. It was her choice to sit in the carseat or not. It was my choice as the driver whether the car was going to move or not. I explained to her that the car wouldn't move until she was sitting in her carseat. 40 minutes later, she finally decided that she needed to sit in the carseat and crawled in there, and we drove home. I about went batty for those 40 minutes but I knew that she needed to test the boundaries and that is how she did it.
Holding the hands of the child who is making a mess isn't teaching them anything if they are old enough that they want to make their decisions. The moment you let go, those hands will start grabbing and making a mess again, and this time might be throwing knives and forks, which is actually dangerous. Instead, we have to have our children choose to listen to us.
I love kids. Even if they are irritating I tolerate them. People who make an effort to find fault in the children of others are just plain bitter. It is not usually the behavior of the kid that bothers some folks - even if they were well behaved their resentment would still be there- Just a more reserved and quiet version of loathing and contempt.
I'm not bitter, but I will be honest and confess that I do not like small children. They're loud, messy, and they stress me out. I don't know how to deal with them.
I avoid "family friendly" restaurants at peak times in an effort to minimize my exposure to them, but sometimes parents insist on bringing tired, cranky toddlers out late at night. That annoys me because those kids should be in bed. What are you doing dining out at a place with tablecloths at 9pm? I won't even darken the doorways of restaurants with playgrounds. Those are a kid's domain.
As long as a child is well-behaved, I usually don't notice that they're there. It's only when they start screaming or throwing things that I notice them.
No, but I do work in food service. A restaurant is for eating, not a "food playground" for a toddler.
This is the problem with people who don't have kids passing judgments. They like to explore their world and are curious in everything that is new. It is not possible to put a toddler in an environment with new things and expect that they would not show interest in exploring their new environment. It's part of growing up.
And the next part will shock you - you once were a toddler, too. And if your mom ever took you to a restaurant as a toddler, you explored your surroundings as well, and perhaps even treated it a bit like a food playground. And not everyone around you thought you behaved appropriately all of the time.
When my kid was 18 months old, it was fine to physically restrain her. She did something wrong, we restrained her and then she lost interest.
Today at 2 1/2 physical restraints don't work the same way. She doesn't learn not to do it, it just makes her angry that we have physically taken away her ability to choose what to do in life.
What you are trying to do, of course, changes with the age of the child. At 18 months, there is no learning about restaurants going on. They are too little. At 2 1/2, you bet they are old enough to learn.
When you are ready to eat properly in a restaurant, THEN we will eat in a restaurant. Else YOU LEAVE.
Quote:
And I've realized that I need her to choose to listen to me, and we as parents we need to focus on the choices that we can make and not try to force her to make the right choice. This sounds weird but isn't.
It does not sound at all weird. But it does not sound like what you are doing either.
I explained to her that the car wouldn't move until she was sitting in her carseat. 40 minutes later, she finally decided that she needed to sit in the carseat and crawled in there, and we drove home. I about went batty for those 40 minutes but I knew that she needed to test the boundaries and that is how she did it.
Instead, we have to have our children choose to listen to us.
While I agree with this technique in some instances, I worry you may not be teaching the lesson you think is getting across. What about the scenario where she is running towards the street and a car is coming, yet you are too far away to physically grab her? A child who has been taught that when mom says, "STOP!" they'd better mind is much safer than the one who's been taught that when mom says something, they can do whatever the heck they want for 40 minutes until they're good and ready to do what mom says.
I really don't see in that scenario how she's choosing to listen to you at all. She's just being forced to wait until she's bored enough to do it. That works fine for some things, but I wouldn't call it, "choosing to listen to you" either.
I'm not bitter, but I will be honest and confess that I do not like small children. They're loud, messy, and they stress me out. I don't know how to deal with them.
I avoid "family friendly" restaurants at peak times in an effort to minimize my exposure to them, but sometimes parents insist on bringing tired, cranky toddlers out late at night. That annoys me because those kids should be in bed. What are you doing dining out at a place with tablecloths at 9pm? I won't even darken the doorways of restaurants with playgrounds. Those are a kid's domain.
As long as a child is well-behaved, I usually don't notice that they're there. It's only when they start screaming or throwing things that I notice them.
Kids are just part of the human landscape...it's normal. You don't have to "deal" with them...no more than you have to deal with traffic noise if you live in the city- or the irritating sound of a siren blasting by your window. I see your point about dragging a kid out at night when they should be in bed- It's usually a combination of disposable cash and an unwillingness to cook at home. My wife was responsible- She had a routine for the kids and established it early. Bed time came a a certain time...supper was at a certain time...it was the old fashioned way of raising children...some kids these days are being raised with out a routine and they are wild.
If a kid is screaming or throwing things around in a public place - it is not the kid that is at fault for breaching your sense of peace and order...It is the parent- The second your kid becomes unmanageable- The right and proper thing to do if you respect others is GET UP AND LEAVE immediately...how hard can that be? BUT a lot of people really don't care about the comfort and peace of others.
I'm not bitter, but I will be honest and confess that I do not like small children. They're loud, messy, and they stress me out. I don't know how to deal with them.
Well, this explains a lot.
You "deal with them" by understanding that they are little kids. As you once were. They are not short adults, they are little kids who are learning things. Just as you did.
Things will happen in restaurants as they do at home. Crumbs ARE going to fall on the floor. Drinks ARE going to be spilled. I'd rather have a kid eating crackers in the booth next to me than four adults drinking their lunch and being loud and rude to the waitress. (Which I see much more often than crackers on the floor.)
Last edited by DewDropInn; 07-25-2013 at 09:34 AM..
I love kids. Even if they are irritating I tolerate them. People who make an effort to find fault in the children of others are just plain bitter. It is not usually the behavior of the kid that bothers some folks - even if they were well behaved their resentment would still be there- Just a more reserved and quiet version of loathing and contempt.
I love kids, too. Think they're awesome and have a wonderful perspective on life. I also love them enough to realize that they deserve to be given the best possible chance, and that means that sometimes the parents have to actually, you know, parent, even if they don't feel like it (who ever feels like it every time that it's necessary?).
Quote:
Originally Posted by twoincomes
This is the problem with people who don't have kids passing judgments. They like to explore their world and are curious in everything that is new. It is not possible to put a toddler in an environment with new things and expect that they would not show interest in exploring their new environment. It's part of growing up.
And the next part will shock you - you once were a toddler, too. And if your mom ever took you to a restaurant as a toddler, you explored your surroundings as well, and perhaps even treated it a bit like a food playground. And not everyone around you thought you behaved appropriately all of the time.
See above, and the fact that I raised two children to adulthood and adored them the entire time (still do) and yet STILL accepted that it was my responsibility to see that they grew up civilized, even on those occasions when they chose NOT to listen to me. Heck, I'm an old hippy and I understand the "let them raise themselves" theory, but once I had my first child I realized pretty quickly that that was indulging myself and not doing the child any good whatsoever. You cannot reason consistently with a two-year-old in full tantrum mode. You have to be the grown-up and the one in charge. You have to put consequences in place and enforce them even if the child insists that you're mean and they hate you (which they all will one way or another at one time or another because they're trying to find out where the lines are, they need that security of knowing that someone is in charge and it isn't them, it gives them feeling that they're safe and taken care of, though some will push it harder than others). This applies to all sorts of things, including dining out.
I'm not bitter, but I will be honest and confess that I do not like small children. They're loud, messy, and they stress me out. I don't know how to deal with them.
You do recognize that you were a small child right, and annoyed many people around you?
You "deal with them" by understanding that they are little kids. As you once were. They are not short adults, they are little kids who are learning things.
Things will happen in restaurants as they do at home. Crumbs ARE going to fall on the floor. Drinks ARE going to be spilled. I'd rather have a kid eating crackers in the booth next to me than four adults drinking their lunch and being loud and rude to the waitress. (Which I see MUCH more than the mess you seem to be wading through on your way to the table.)
What happened to all the liberals here who insist "It takes a village to raise a child"? Seems they like to talk about racial tolerance, gay rights and the protection of children and calling child protection agents out of spite. Having come from a large family and raising four kids myself...I just don't get it why some people feel that kids are some sort of curse. Kids are kids and as I said before they are just part of the normal human landscape.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
