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The New York Times just published an article about gun safety and children. It answered some questions I have had about this issue. I have read many stories about children being accidentally shot by guns--often by another child. Yet, the NRA has claimed this is rare event. It turns out that these deaths and injuries are really under-reported because of the way they are labelled at doctor's officers and by coroners. I know some gun owners won't like this article, but I think it is a really important article, particularly for gun owners with children:
Let's be honest about statistics here for a moment. Even if you take the NYTimes adjusted data, which in itself is somewhat subjective, gun accidents account for 4.4% of the 5 out of 100,000 child accident deaths a year 0.22 out of 100,000. 124 child accident deaths from guns per year. That's the adjusted data. In a country with 315 million people where 40% of households have guns equaling more than 300 million firearms in the US.
If you want to talk about guns lets talk about the 11,000 homicides by guns every year or the 5000 homicides not committed with guns, either one is way more relevant than a very sad but very small number of gun accident deaths.
If you want to talk about guns lets talk about the 11,000 homicides by guns every year or the 5000 homicides not committed with guns, either one is way more relevant than a very sad but very small number of gun accident deaths.
You're in the parenting forum. I don't think anyone is coming to this forum because they really want to talk about guns and homicides (committed with or without guns). That is not relevant to the discussion. On the other hand talking about gun safety and children is very relevant to this forum and something that every parent should think about. Even if it is just 124 children who are accidentally killed each year, that is too many. Children shouldn't die because their parents (or relatives, or their friends' families) were careless with their firearms or because they weren't taught gun safety. I think doctors should be asking parents what their kids know about gun safety, and not just asking if their are guns in the house. Chances are your child is either visiting a relative or a friend who owns guns. Parents that don't own guns might not know the appropriate way to talk to their kids about guns, but its still a conversation that needs to be had.
Of course this shouldn't be brought up in a way that shows the doctors viewpoints on guns, but in a very nonbiased way. New, young parents might not think that they need to tell their 4-5 year old about gun safety because they don't own guns. By having someone they trust (hopefully they trust their doctor) bring it up, it could be a good way to get the discussion going.
You're in the parenting forum. I don't think anyone is coming to this forum because they really want to talk about guns and homicides (committed with or without guns). That is not relevant to the discussion. On the other hand talking about gun safety and children is very relevant to this forum and something that every parent should think about. Even if it is just 124 children who are accidentally killed each year, that is too many. Children shouldn't die because their parents (or relatives, or their friends' families) were careless with their firearms or because they weren't taught gun safety. I think doctors should be asking parents what their kids know about gun safety, and not just asking if their are guns in the house. Chances are your child is either visiting a relative or a friend who owns guns. Parents that don't own guns might not know the appropriate way to talk to their kids about guns, but its still a conversation that needs to be had.
Of course this shouldn't be brought up in a way that shows the doctors viewpoints on guns, but in a very nonbiased way. New, young parents might not think that they need to tell their 4-5 year old about gun safety because they don't own guns. By having someone they trust (hopefully they trust their doctor) bring it up, it could be a good way to get the discussion going.
I agree with you completely. Note that I was not the poster who brought up gun stats.
I agree with you completely. Note that I was not the poster who brought up gun stats.
But those stats were about children and gun safety. They were explaining why a doctor might bring up gun safety during a wellness check. Your post was, "Who cares that 124 kids die from guns because there is also non gun related deaths!" Which is true... but those other stats have nothing to do with your child's doctor visits.
Let's be honest about statistics here for a moment. Even if you take the NYTimes adjusted data, which in itself is somewhat subjective, gun accidents account for 4.4% of the 5 out of 100,000 child accident deaths a year 0.22 out of 100,000. 124 child accident deaths from guns per year. That's the adjusted data. In a country with 315 million people where 40% of households have guns equaling more than 300 million firearms in the US.
If you want to talk about guns lets talk about the 11,000 homicides by guns every year or the 5000 homicides not committed with guns, either one is way more relevant than a very sad but very small number of gun accident deaths.
It's because it is a sad, but very small, but very preventable number of gun accident deaths that pediatricians are asking the question.
Perhaps if enough pediatricians ask the question we can get that number down to zero.
It's no different from advising parents about the use of child restraints and seat belts.
I have no problem with the question. And of course I care that children die, any child. My response was to a post slamming guns around children. I just think the discussion needs to be framed in a way that is accurate. The previous poster wrote "the NRA has claimed this is rare event" and then linked to a very sad but misleading article. The fact is that gun accidents are indeed a "rare event."
Again, no issue with the question or gun safety. Simply pointing out that the PP was misleading.
As for getting the number to zero, I fear that the same idiots who don't lock up their guns or teach their children about gun safety are probably less likely to listen to their doctor. But maybe I'm wrong, who knows.
I have no problem with the question. And of course I care that children die, any child. My response was to a post slamming guns around children. I just think the discussion needs to be framed in a way that is accurate. The previous poster wrote "the NRA has claimed this is rare event" and then linked to a very sad but misleading article. The fact is that gun accidents are indeed a "rare event."
Again, no issue with the question or gun safety. Simply pointing out that the PP was misleading.
As for getting the number to zero, I fear that the same idiots who don't lock up their guns or teach their children about gun safety are probably less likely to listen to their doctor. But maybe I'm wrong, who knows.
I agree. There is no medical treatment for stupidity.
Apparently you'd be surprised how many people leave guns and ammo laying around unprotected. It's their right under the constitution.
I've also seen steak knifes and scissors laying in plain view. And don't get me started on the number of people without safety locks on the stovetops and irons.
I have no problem with the question. And of course I care that children die, any child. My response was to a post slamming guns around children. I just think the discussion needs to be framed in a way that is accurate. The previous poster wrote "the NRA has claimed this is rare event" and then linked to a very sad but misleading article. The fact is that gun accidents are indeed a "rare event."
Again, no issue with the question or gun safety. Simply pointing out that the PP was misleading.
As for getting the number to zero, I fear that the same idiots who don't lock up their guns or teach their children about gun safety are probably less likely to listen to their doctor. But maybe I'm wrong, who knows.
I did not slam guns. If you took the time to read the article, then you will see the focus is on these preventable deaths in children. The NRA also does say these accidental shooting deaths happen on a rarer occasion than they actually do because of the way statistics have been gathered. The article explains why this happens, including photos of actual case reports.
I included the article because I think it is important information, which is made more evident to me by this response. The parents featured in this article were not "idiot" parents. Gun deaths happen very quickly, and it can take just one careless mistake. As the article says, boys in particular can be taught to be careful with guns, but they just may not follow the parent rules when the parent is out of sight. Aside from the gun deaths listed, there also are injuries of course, and there are all the near misses. When I took a quick glance at the comments below the article a number of posters mentioned times they were careless with a gun when they are younger and almost shot someone.
I don't know why some people get so worked up about these things. No parent gets upset when you tell them to lock up poisonous substances, but some people get so angry when you suggest you do that with a gun. To me, it is all a part of essential child safety.
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