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Old 11-21-2007, 06:54 PM
 
3,107 posts, read 8,033,425 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roselvr View Post
I wasn't sure.
Actually, you can go to a Reproductive Endocrinologist who will perform blood tests that check your ovarian reserve/FSH; that gives REs an idea of where to start. They will check for thyroid conditions, PCOS, and other reproductive-related oddities that might make it difficult to conceive whether naturally or ART (artificial reproductive technology). NONE of these tests is fail-proof. I have an FSH of a teenager but had an amazingly difficult time getting pregnant (my eggs are bad). One thing to definitely get checked is if you have a history of diabetes in the family. After my 6th IVF cycle it was discovered that I had uncontrolled diabetes (no symptoms) but it caused me to have a lot of problems having a successful cycle. Once I had my diabetes under control, I got pregnant on my 7th cycle!
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Old 11-22-2007, 04:19 AM
 
12,842 posts, read 24,483,936 times
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The final kicker for me in my childfree life (and it wasn't so much a decision as an acknowledgement) was, I imagined, what if I had a great marriage, and we had a lot of money so I wouldn't have to worry about being poor or stuck/depressed, and we could hire help and all? And I thought, if I had a relationship like that, the LAST thing I'd want is children to ruin our company and freedom and lives. Also, I thought, why would I have kids if I basically hoped to be able to buy my way out of being with them a lot?
The final thought- what about a tragedy where I become a single parent? That was the absolute end of the thinking. NO WAY would I want to be a single parent.

Now, many people say they were overwhelmed and surprised by how much they love having kids even if they weren't much into the idea. But I note, they still DID have the kids, so they must have been somewhat into the whole thing. Also, it seems VERY dicey to do something that is permanent (having kids) and wonder if you'll warm up to it.

Maybe I would have been amazed at my delight in having kids, if I jumped off the cliff and had them. I'm willing to accept that I might have missed a great experience. But you can only deal with the present as it is, and try to project ahead somewhat (after all, what else is signing a mortgage/making a marriage promise/etc.)? But if you don't like the idea or thoughts of parenthood from here and now, how on earth can you plow ahead and do it anyway?

Also, by the way, a lot of men have no idea what they're getting or what they want when they say they want kids. If they're not interested in being a primary caretaker, what are they thinking of? "Continuing 'my line'" throwing a footbal, etc. etc. Kodak moments. So many marriages tank because of the realities of being parents of young children.

You cannot overly second-guess yourself.If you don't wanna, you don't wanna. Society says "you''ll change your mind" and "someday..." and having kids is the default assumption, and it should be the other way around- a conscious, desired choice. And if you aren't making that choice, that's OK. You and your husband need to decide if he wants the marriage more than he wants some idea or image of a person who doesn't even exist yet. Good luck- there is so little support for making that decision.
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Old 11-22-2007, 06:21 AM
 
Location: North Carolina
2,657 posts, read 7,005,349 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doglover29 View Post
When I met DH, we were both 23. Do people really think about having kids at age 23? It just never occurred to me to think about it.
For some of us who are CF and have known that since a young age (we call ourselves 'early articulators' or acknowledge that we are 'wired' to be CF) yeah, we thought about it at that age. But not on your terms. I suppose I'm lucky to have known myself in that regard at a young age - shoot, I knew when I was in my teens that I would not be having kids. But, reaching an age where I might find someone who would become a significant person in my life, the notion always at the top of my mind was "what if he wants kids?" I had no intention of allowing myself to be drawn into a potentially committed relationship if that person wanted to be a parent.

You mentioned counseling. Your posts are so well thought out and articulated, I'm not sure why you would need counseling. I'm guessing it is more a moderated venue for you and your husband to try to come to terms with the decision and the events that will proceed from it? Just beware - find a counselor who will be unbiased. There have been posts on the childfree boards where couples grappling with this meet with a counselor who leans toward the childed side. Your thoughts on possibly choosing a CF life will be seen as the problem that the counselor will help you fix so you do have kids.

Good luck on your decision and keep us posted. Your messages, while obviously very painful, have been some of the best I've read from a person looking at the decision from all angles.
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Old 11-22-2007, 06:30 AM
 
Location: NJ
9,191 posts, read 20,215,476 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brightdoglover View Post
The final thought- what about a tragedy where I become a single parent? That was the absolute end of the thinking. NO WAY would I want to be a single parent.
Being a single parent is hard at times but in the end it was worth it.
My son's "father" (more like sperm donor) was out of the picture when my son was 1 1/2. I was not only the mother but also father. His didn't want to be in his life and wasn't until child support / college ended.

He & I have a great relationship. I would never change the outcome even if I was given the chance to.
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Old 11-22-2007, 09:05 AM
 
Location: Boise / Eagle, Idaho
306 posts, read 1,100,622 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brightdoglover View Post
.... Now, many people say they were overwhelmed and surprised by how much they love having kids even if they weren't much into the idea. But I note, they still DID have the kids, so they must have been somewhat into the whole thing. Also, it seems VERY dicey to do something that is permanent (having kids) and wonder if you'll warm up to it ...
.
My 1st child was an oops baby, proof that Birth control is only 99% effective ... it wasn't so much that we were into into the idea (that's hard to admit - but true.) I just knew at 38 I didn't want to have an abortion. It felt wrong. We DID warm up to the idea of a child as you said and I'm very glad I did not teminate - though I seriously contemplated it.

Now, Please note that I have NO intention or any desire to turn this into an abortion debate. So, please don't go there. I'm just responding to the jumping off the cliff portion. Not everyone posting in favor of children climbed the mountain with the intention of jumping. I didn't. Instead, I'm one of those who suddenly found myself on the edge of a cliff with a hard choice to make - I jumped and it was a good thing (for me.)
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Old 11-22-2007, 03:55 PM
 
12,842 posts, read 24,483,936 times
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If you haven't already, you can run some "what ifs" through your mind (and with your husband). What if your coupling is infertile? Supposedy some 20% of infertility is unexplained. How would you feel if he said he really didn't want kids and meant it? Relieved? Disappointed? Thrilled? How would you feel if you became divorced or widowed (Yes, I know it's painful to contemplate, but it happens) and you'd had a child to suit his desires for the marriage?

Put it this way, at my age and life place, if I date at all, it's always a divorced man with kids, either younger (less likely) or grown kids. It has never been a deal-breaker that he wants more kids, in fact, at any age, I have never met a man who already had a kid/kids for whom having more was important.
I again and echo the comments re: "counseling." Counselors are no better than the average population at being open-minded regarding societal scripts. The people I've known who went to counselors, either marriage or individual, over the child issue- inevitably, the counseling became what was "wrong" with the partner who didn't want kids and how to fix that.
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Old 11-22-2007, 09:24 PM
 
Location: Missouri
1,554 posts, read 4,067,719 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sweetana3 View Post
Just wondering out loud if there are any babies or toddlers that you can "borrow" for a week to see how the two of you react when they have needs and the needs conflict???
I am not kidding but how about one of thos fake babies that cries and all. The one Health classes in High School uses. Just might be an option.
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Old 11-23-2007, 10:30 AM
 
Location: In the sunshine on a ship with a plank
3,413 posts, read 7,836,441 times
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brightdoglover, I think your explanation is outstanding. Nobody should ever feel guilty for choosing to be child free.
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Old 11-23-2007, 12:43 PM
 
Location: Boise / Eagle, Idaho
306 posts, read 1,100,622 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brightdoglover View Post
... I again and echo the comments re: "counseling." Counselors are no better than the average population at being open-minded regarding societal scripts. The people I've known who went to counselors, either marriage or individual, over the child issue- inevitably, the counseling became what was "wrong" with the partner who didn't want kids and how to fix that.
I do agree with this statement regarding counseling ... if you do go that route, interview many ... the above statement is sad ... but likely true. Personally, I think the two of you are intelligent enough to discuss it yourselves.

If conversations get heated, try the letters technique (write letters to one another in private - exchange and read them in private - write your rebuttals in private) after 3 or 4 letter exchanges you will likely come to a decision and REALLY know the other persons position.

This technique takes a lot time, commitment and effort to do. But it is very beneficial because you can't interrupt a letter; you can't change to direction of the conversation; you can't argue ... you won't let the look on his/her face effect the course of your comments. Your letter writing is honest and true and when you read his letter - it has 100% of your attention. It's thoughtful and intense. - I think it could work, if you two the time to do it.

It's worth a shot and its a lot cheaper than therapy and does not involve a stranger.
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Old 11-23-2007, 02:25 PM
 
12,842 posts, read 24,483,936 times
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"brightdoglover, I think your explanation is outstanding. Nobody should ever feel guilty for choosing to be child free."

Thanks so much for your kind comment.

I'm not sure why anyone does feel guilty about wanting to be childfree or choosing so, but if they do, that's a shame. Why be guilty for not doing something that is, in our society, purely optional and not particularly necessary to anyone but the one choosing it? It's not like people say to each other, "Honey, Social Security needs more workers. Let's go upstairs and make some."
I suppose religions have added to the sense that it's required (or at least that sex is required to have "consequences," at least for women).
What I think is, it's only been a few decades in a few societies where we have the technology and subsequent social changes to control our reproduction in a meaningful way. Given the centuries where there were no/few choices (convent, anyone?) it makes sense that people's thoughts and plans haven't caught up to the new reality. It's one reason I yammer on about the subject. I think childbearing should be safe, legal, and rare.
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