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The minor can decide to terminate the child, but if the child is born, she cannot decide whether to use spanking as discipline?
"Ok to scramble their brains with a needle - not ok to deliver a harmless smack on the butt to get their attention" Something seems out of wack here.
By the way, are self performed abortions legal or illegal? If the 16 year old has to ask her parents to get an abortion by a doctor, does she have to ask them before she can do it herself?
We just have to agree to disagree :-) I believe that a minor should still have the right to get such a procedure done without having to consult others. Sure, it would be better if they did, but they shouldn't be forced to do so. It's still their own body and just because they are 16 shouldn't change that.
By the way, the bill regarding spanking wouldn't result in fines for the parents. I believe it's more of a culture change where we can make progress.
Okay. So a minor should be able to drink, right? After all, it's her body (or his body). Why not poison it with alcohol or even drugs for that matter. And how come you can't get a tattoo until you're 18 in MA but you can have an abortion?
Okay. So a minor should be able to drink, right? After all, it's her body (or his body). Why not poison it with alcohol or even drugs for that matter. And how come you can't get a tattoo until you're 18 in MA but you can have an abortion?
Things to ponder.
I definitely think drinking laws are too strict in the US, but drinking is slightly different since being under the influence of alcohol doesn't necessarily just affect the person's body. It's easy to foresee that the likelihood to harm other (i.e. drinking and driving) would increase with alcohol consumption.
I don't agree with the rule that you need to be 18 without parental consent to get a tattoo. There are reasons for all of these, and we have many of these differences in what you can do at a certain age, and at the moment this is what public policy has asked for in the commonwealth.
Open hand is fine for a 2 to 5 year old but past 5, it does not inflict enough pain to be a deterrent. At this point either a belt (thick wide leather) or a paddle- wood or leather- should be used across the buttocks. Never use anything like extension cords (that is what I got) or hit the child anyplace but his buttocks.
This sickens me. Your poor children.
Last edited by johnycakes; 01-21-2008 at 09:23 AM..
Reason: removed ad hominem
The problem is that the U.S. continues to make new laws before we fix the problems with the laws (and enforcement of laws) that are already in place!!
As I stated before, we should be working on fixing our Child Protection Services (DCFS and Foster care system) problems Before we start putting more restrictions on parents.
This law is supposed to protect children from abuse. I support what they are trying to do, but what about the failing Foster care system that we put abused children in?? What about all the kids that are already in the system and being lost that we are failing?? Wouldn't the time and money going into this new law more helpful in FIXING the system and laws that are already in place?! That just baffles me!!
Well, abortion is not considered murder under the law, that is just your opinion. The difference is that a person has right to their own body but not causing harm to another person, which is a big difference in my opinion.
I would have to disagree with this. In abortion you are indeed causing harm to another person, quite a bit more harm then a swat on the bottom infact. Which is not to say that I support hitting children for any reason either, I 100% do not, just playing devil's advocate with the "my body, my choice" argument...since clearly it's not your body that abortion mainly harms.
The House is intending to debate a bill, proposed by Arlington, Ma nurse Kathleen Wolf, that would put an end to corporal punishment in Massachusetts. If passed, it would prohibit parents from forcefully laying a hand on any child under 18 unless it was to keep them from danger. If they do, they can be charged with abuse or neglect, even within the confines of their homes.
If passed it will be the first of it's kind in the nation. Sweden was the first country to enact a spanking ban in 1979. Many countries have followed suit including Israel, Germany, Greece, Norway, and 14 others. The Mass. state Supreme Judicial Court agreed in 1999 that parents can spank their kids provided that they didn't threaten bodily injury.
Has this gone too far or have we now stepped up to provide further protection to children? I'm curious to hear from everyone. What say you?
I think that a ban on spanking is a bit silly and a waste of tax money. I'd rather see them pass mandatory programs for parents that teach positive dicipline, than laws that ban things. This being said I think hitting your children to teach them is not only wrong but also rather pointless. Violence leads to more violence, and obeying out of fear is not the goal I'd want for my future children. All in all I think it will take more than laws to change the way people parent though. You can't just ban what you know is bad you have to teach how to fix it.
I come from an irish catholic family of nine . without spanking my mother would have had no control whatsoever . I think spanking makes children realize that if I do this I am going to get a spanking and spanking does not feel good so therefore I had better not do this . Oh please not enough children get spanked these days due to the fact that their parents want to be their friend not their parent . Parents are to be respected and when you get down on a teenagers level or lower you are no longer a parent you are a homie , bro , what have you and therefore the parent has lost all control . Some kids need spanking it is an ends to a means to teach limits and boundaries that children should not cross . sorry but I am all for spanking raised my kids with it and guess what they are responsible grown well adjusted adults .
On spanking, I don't support it, but sometimes a light whack (non painful) on the rear gets their attention especially when they are being smart mouths.
I don't think it does any good, though. It only instills fear, not a lesson learned.
Behind closed doors, who knows what people will do, law or not. I don't think kids should be disciplined in public though. It causes more problems for the family as a whole, as nosey strangers get involved and possibly call police and all this nonsense. Talk to the kids in private in the car or at home, even the restroom at the store, but not in public display. And hitting doesn't help. If your that angry, walk away (if possible) and cool off.
In a society that thinks of anything as child abuse and is more than willing to take your kids away from you, why risk it?
I come from an irish catholic family of nine . without spanking my mother would have had no control whatsoever . I think spanking makes children realize that if I do this I am going to get a spanking and spanking does not feel good so therefore I had better not do this . Oh please not enough children get spanked these days due to the fact that their parents want to be their friend not their parent . Parents are to be respected and when you get down on a teenagers level or lower you are no longer a parent you are a homie , bro , what have you and therefore the parent has lost all control . Some kids need spanking it is an ends to a means to teach limits and boundaries that children should not cross . sorry but I am all for spanking raised my kids with it and guess what they are responsible grown well adjusted adults .
There are many non violent ways to maintain control over your children that do not require any sort of hitting, swatting, spanking or other physical punishment. I wouldn't want my kids to follow the rules just to avoid getting hit..I want them to follow the rules because they understand that the rules are there for good reason and need to be respected.
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