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Since the girl is only 14, I think it might not be too late.
You can gently remind them of reality. I don't know exactly how pathological liars start out but I think that no one ever brought them in line early on -- they get some kind of rewards from telling whoppers or they begin to think everyone believes them. Someone should clue them in fairly early that their stories are too far fetched.
I agree. On the other hand, I feel sorry for Mandy, however, I do not want her to think that I am buying into her tall tales. If she thinks she is being successful in fooling people left and right at such a young age, I am afraid she will keep doing it. The other thing is, even if she may be telling the truth on a certain subject, I started assuming that it could be another made-up story.
My daughter acknowledges that Mandy lies, but it seems like she focuses on Mandy's positive personality traits and chalks up her lies to her upbringing.
I debated quite a bit if this post belongs to here or the Psychology forum and finally decided to post it here.
I have a 14 year old daughter who goes to a public school. She has a classmate (I assign the friend a fake name, say Mandy) that she recently brought Mandy home the first time last week and they hang out at our place for a few hours. Mandy seems like a nice girl, she has manners. My daughter says Mandy comes from an underprivileged family, and she does not do well in most of her classes (they only have one class together that is Art). They enjoy their friendship because I think they are both lighthearted, humurous, and not girly like some other 14 year old teens. All is well so far, however, I realized that Mandy lies (my daughter confirms that too). The reason we realized that her stories lack consistency and off the wall at times.
I am not quite sure the best way to handle this. Shall I hint that I am not buying it or say flat out we do not lie in our house or just ignore it ? Other than her vivid made-up stories, she is a good kid. I tend to think that she might be making up stories to shield herself psychologically from a lifestyle she does not like.
I appreciate the input.
Yes. It's just the mind's way of coping with a situation where you have very little power to change things materially. Unless her lies are causing serious issues, she will grow out of them eventually. A 14 year old's mind is still like putty - it's shaping and forming all the time, and if a little fantasy will help it survive those turbulent years, she could turn out to be a fine, creative person. I don't think forcing her to face harsh reality will help in this situation. Once again, it depends on whether her lies are harmless or not.
Edit: I wouldn't recommend *encouraging* her lies, but if you keep pointing out her lies, it's just as likely that she will start refining them to the point that you can't tell the difference any more. I'd love to engage with a child who thinks cats can live a 100 years OTOH, I'd be very wary of a child who's lying about violence or theft.
I WOULD challenge her on every single lie you catch her telling. Inform her that lying is not acceptable behavior in your home. That would be a good lesson for her and your daughter.
And the most important part is that lying will not fly in the real world. People eventually get caught and then get in trouble. Best to nip it in the bud now - at least teach your daughter this is not acceptable.
If you ask me, a parent's job is to prepare kids to go out into the real world and survive. Best they have skills which will not cause them trouble later on.
Yes. It's just the mind's way of coping with a situation where you have very little power to change things materially. Unless her lies are causing serious issues, she will grow out of them eventually. A 14 year old's mind is still like putty - it's shaping and forming all the time, and if a little fantasy will help it survive those turbulent years, she could turn out to be a fine, creative person. I don't think forcing her to face harsh reality will help in this situation. Once again, it depends on whether her lies are harmless or not.
Edit: I wouldn't recommend *encouraging* her lies, but if you keep pointing out her lies, it's just as likely that she will start refining them to the point that you can't tell the difference any more. I'd love to engage with a child who thinks cats can live a 100 years OTOH, I'd be very wary of a child who's lying about violence or theft.
I would not mind the 100 year old cat story, but when Mandy said that she had diabetes to rake in brownie points with us, knowing that my daughter has been suffering Type 1 diabetes since the age of five, I knew her lying spanned beyond just a cat/dog story. We went through a lot of turbulent times due to my daughter's blood sugar control, hospitilization, etc. It turned out that Mandy is healthier than the whole family combined. That lie upset me.
Other lies include, "My cousin got shot to death", "My sister is pregnant, I will be an aunt soon"; none true.
I WOULD challenge her on every single lie you catch her telling. Inform her that lying is not acceptable behavior in your home. The would be a good lesson for her and your daughter.
And the most important part is that lying will not fly in the real world. People eventually get caught and then get in trouble. Best to nip it in the bud now - at least teach your daughter this is not acceptable.
If you ask me, a parent's job is to prepare kids to go out into the real world and survive. Best they have skills which will not cause them trouble later on.
Nicely said. I understand that it is not my place to discipline someone else's child, however, if she is coming over to my house, she must play by the rules of the house. We believe in telling the truth to one another in our family, no matter how harsh it is.
When my daughter's friends are telling obvious lies, sometimes I'll say (in a light, friendly way) "What a good imagination you have! You should try writing some stories."
I think kids are more likely to make up stories like that when they're feeling insecure.
I think this is a good start...calling her on her BS in a non threatening way. I have 13 and 16 year old girls and we have entirely too much experience with girls who exaggerate and lie for me to say that this is not important.
BUt I doubt it will be enough. Why would you let this slide? Or give even a hint to your daughter that this is an acceptable way to interact with a friend?
Of course she is feeling insecure and wants to be like her friend. But lying to be that way is a very dangerous path. I've known plenty of insecure adults who LIE to manipulate their environment and their peers and the outcome is never good. It is hurtful to others and destructive.
I would shut this down pretty quickly. Start with a gentle approach like Hedgehog Mom suggests, then get a little firmer. If you want your daughter to maintain this friendship, you may want to consider being the role model Mandy obviously does not have and be frank but kind with her. Ask her to talk about her self and consider what she does have that is positive. Draw out her strengths and find ways to give her the attention she so clearly craves without having to borrow attention from your daughter. Does she really want a puppy? what other pets would she like? Cousin who died? Ask her about the rest of her family and validate that they are interesting to others even when they seem ordinary to her. Her actual life and thoughts and feelings are valid and important to her and if you can model that for her, she may feel less of a need to lie.
Then assuming, her lying won't stop, I would move on to: "Mandy, I know sometimes we want to be like our friends, but making things up is not the way to go. When you say you have diabetes, and I know you don't, it makes me wonder what other things you say that arent true. Then it becomes hard to trust, which is hard on a friendship"
Mandy's behavior WILL accelerate to the point that she will no longer accept responsibilty for anything she does or says. My oldest has a 'frenemy' who lies constantly. He is an 18 year old senior in high school and his lies are frighteningly like Mandy's: This year alone, he has had cancer, an ulcer, his father was murdered, a sibling died, and a cousin was murdered. He also asked my daughter to hide a bottle of vodka for him (FAIL!) and has been kicked out of the school musical for failing to show up for class and get himself out of academic probation. He lies about his friends behind their backs. He claims his stepfather is abusive.? This is a bright, handsome and engaging young man, with a lot of talent and potential. My daughter thinks his mom is cool...I wonder just how much she knows about her son. It isn't about the lies...it is about the insecurity behind the lies and excuses...this is bringing this young man to a place that his friends can no longer deal with him.
I'm trying to respect my daughter's need to maintain social order with this young man, but his lies are getting dangerous. When they stop working, what else will he do for attention? I'm actually relieved he has been cut from a school trip I am chaperoning in March, because I think his behavior would wreck it for everyone else.
My daughter acknowledges that Mandy lies, but it seems like she focuses on Mandy's positive personality traits and chalks up her lies to her upbringing.
I think this is the most important part. You have an intelligent and compassionate daughter.
My own knee jerk response at this point would probably be "Mandy! You tell so many tall tales that I don't know what to believe. " with a smile and a hug. And then let it go and don't give attention to her prevarications.
I would feel differently if her lies were malicious attempts to get others in trouble or to get herself out of trouble.
I agree. On the other hand, I feel sorry for Mandy, however, I do not want her to think that I am buying into her tall tales. If she thinks she is being successful in fooling people left and right at such a young age, I am afraid she will keep doing it. The other thing is, even if she may be telling the truth on a certain subject, I started assuming that it could be another made-up story.
My daughter acknowledges that Mandy lies, but it seems like she focuses on Mandy's positive personality traits and chalks up her lies to her upbringing.
I have a cousin who was known to exaggerage but certain family members would gently point it out to her and it seems they reined that tendency in. Many years later she still exaggerates but she realizes it and will rein herself in.
One time an aunt listening to her told her flat out that she was exaggerating and she replied "yes but only a little". At this point, it seems more that she is just making a good story better, and she has a theatrical side which is actually entertaining but never went off the deep end.
I think it is a critical age -- if she believes she's fooling people, she won't learn and could become one of those looney tunes types that people try to avoid.
For example on the 100 year old cat, she could be asked if she means in "cat years" -- a 20 year old cat might be equivalent more or less to a 100 year old human. She's going to look like a fruitcake as she gets older if she doesn't start to learn that she's going beyond making a good story better and flat out fabricating.
I think this is the most important part. You have an intelligent and compassionate daughter.
My own knee jerk response at this point would probably be "Mandy! You tell so many tall tales that I don't know what to believe. " with a smile and a hug. And then let it go and don't give attention to her prevarications.
I would feel differently if her lies were malicious attempts to get others in trouble or to get herself out of trouble.
That's a very good approach!
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OTOH, I'd be very wary of a child who's lying about violence or theft.
