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I'm going to go in a different direction and suggest that you have a sit down discussion with your son's father, without your son, about parenting styles and explain your parenting philosophy. Tell him that after you discuss your parenting philosophy you would like him to discuss his. (Note-you must be fully prepared to discuss your style and if you are not real sure what it is, then this won't be very effective)
First part you talk about your expectations you have for your son. Next you talk about how you handle it when those expectations are being met or not being met. These might include behavior, chores, school, nutrition, religion, medical and discipline.
Then it's his turn. You might find that he hasn't really thought about it in this manner and that his parenting has been a reaction based on the way he was parented.
I am embarrassed to say, as it is pretty obvious, that we discussed next to nothing regarding parenting. I now see it is one of the first things I should have discussed with him. I was naive. To be honest, I was expecting he would just observe and pick up on things and we would gradually talk about the big stuff. DS is such a relaxed kid, I didn't have any behavior problems to inform my ex of. I didn't discuss discipline because I next to never have to discipline him. Normally just talking to him helps tremendously. Any behavior issues have never gone past me gently talking to him. I'm not saying he is perfection but he's just good natured and quiet. I thought his dad would see that.
He did ask me basic stuff, like when to bathe him, what time he went to bed (this is why I got upset at the pop he gave DS- I specifically told him DS doesn't sleep that early), foods he liked, places he could take him for fun, etc. He was aware of a few things.
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Originally Posted by hypocore
Next would come discussions of specific examples that you have concern over, like school and homework. I imagine you expect your son to do and turn in his homework. I also figure that at age 6 your son is still learning how everything works with school and still needs guidance. Your parenting philosophy would likely be to help him learn how to be responsible and how to deal with the consequence if he fails at being responsible. In this case, the natural consequence of not turning in homework is getting a mark in his conduct folder and a lower grade.
If that doesn't bring about improvement, then the next logical step in a discipline plan would be to work out a system between your son, his teacher, you and now his dad to ensure that homework does get turned in. This may be daily communication between home and school with everyone putting forth a little more effort to help him learn to be responsible.
If he still has not shown improvement, then perhaps you discuss a negative consequence he receives at school, since that is where he needs to improve. Maybe he has to miss recess for not turning in homework repeatedly.
At this point if there is no improvement, then it would be appropriate for a negative consequence at home. (Note I said consequence not punishment) For instance...IF he doesn't turn in his homework, THEN he has to sit and re-do his homework at home and do additional homework. This becomes his choice. IF he chooses to not turn it in THEN he has chosen to do it over and have more to do.
DS has an issue with homework but his teacher and I have a system. He attends private school and they have worked with me well before. Prior to his dad disciplining him, DS had actually improved over the last two months. Ex would have known that had he looked over the conduct folder and seen. The missing hw was not a mark against DS, but an update for me. The folders have to be signed and returned by Monday and I was going to look over it Sunday. I had no idea ex spoke to DS about the missing hw or even that he was aware of it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hypocore
Here is where you are explaining the goal of teaching him to be responsible and how to go about it. This gives you the opportunity to explain that spanking is counter to teaching him what he needs to do, therefore it is not part of your parenting style. You could then ask him to not include it in his as well. You will probably have to inform him that the spanking made his son fear him and not want to visit him again, something you are sure he does not want his son to feel.
Anyway, the point is to explain the hows and whys of your parenting philosophy and try to get yours and his to mesh well together. Maybe he might even be willing to take a parenting class.......if he is trying after all this time to be a dad, maybe he really wants to be a good one but doesn't know how?
I do want him to have the opportunity to be a father and turn things around. I'm his biggest cheerleader. I am all for him, like you say, taking parenting classes and improving. He's not a bad man... he can be a jerk but that's his personality. I have no problem with him. But I do have a problem with him hitting our child. It doesn't matter how I feel about the guy. I care about my son and what's going to be best for him in the long run. Dad or no dad.
Not necessarily so re contempt of court. They have no legal agreement. My bet is he returned to justify not having his child support raised if/when he salary increases. If he can establish he's a true 50% parent, then the courts will automatically give joint custody of the child and his support is definitely affected by this percentage of time and type of custody.
Her reality is she's being played by "lawyer dad." And she needs to stop playing his game. Take him to court. OP, tell your attorney that your child has suffered trauma due to the spankings by his "new" father; show the teacher's note. Describe his new behavior. He is not your husband and was absent for FIVE years!
I would not discuss this with the father...quite frankly, he never bothered to discuss his and your parenting styles (and neither did you for that matter) so it's too late in the game for that. He's not going to change and now you have to deal with your son being angry and resentful towards you. Please don't try to build a pseudo-family with your ex; it ain't gonna happen. I suggest you treat him like the donor he is.
His visitations need to be supervised and limited. Your ex made his bed, as lumpy as it may be, he needs to lie in it. Your son deserves better! And I say this as someone who is not opposed to spankings.
...I honestly never considered this. However, it doesn't exactly make sense. What I get in child support is dependent upon ex's salary. The initial amount I started receiving once DS was born was actually generous for his salary at the time (back when he was a sleazy car wreck attorney). I was reluctant to take it because I knew it was because he never wanted us coming around. At the time he was willing to do anything to make it go away and to go on with life. Child support increased.
When he came around he told me it was because he wanted to get to know our son. I couldn't think of a shady reason for him to want to do that. I didn't see an agenda.
How does your son feel about the issue? Have you asked him if he wants to keep spending time with the guy (I'm not going to call him dad) if that involves continued spanking?
It might also be good to discuss the possibility that he will do other things, too, in the future -- yell, or shame your son, or hit harder -- and how you two might want to handle that.
Your son is young for this, but boundaries are an important skill to learn. Deciding what is worth putting up with and what is not, in relationships.
Heck, you and son could even talk first, and then talk together with dad, about types of punishment your son feels work for him. Again, he is young for this but he might have some useful input.
I discussed it with him. I asked him if he understood what happened and he just said no and that it hurt and he had to go to sleep. I asked him about spending more time with daddy and he said that daddy didn't like him. We had ice cream and later on we had a bedtime talk about it. He's sensitive and it hurt his feelings more than his bottom.
I don't think it sounds like you are trying to be controlling. Nor does it really sound like your ex is either. You both sound pretty level-headed and reasonable, from your description--just that you differ on this issue. I think some posters are making this guy out to be a monster for spanking, but honestly, some households do spank. Most of us were probably raised with spanking too. My thought to consider is merely that there may be influences at play that come from both parties feeling a lack of control over their role as parent without either having intention to be controlling at all.
Obviously you want him to get your input before making any parenting choice. I would imagine he has the exact same feeling--and probably feels a bit threatened that you likely wouldn't come to HIM to ask his permission about anything. You'd just do it. As if you somehow have more right to make an executive decision about a child who is as much a part of him as a part of you. And of course you feel like that. It's natural to feel possessive and protective and be willing to do anything in the world to keep your child safe. This is just infinitely more difficult when the two people who are that's child parent both feel the same way and aren't in a healthy, functioning relationship where they can come to agreement on difficult issues. You haven't had the practice and pattern of doing that in a relationship and are both used to doing your own thing without having to consider the other. And whether or not some on here argue he's nothing more relevant than mom's new boyfriend... that's just not true. He's your son's father every bit as much as you are his mother. That ship has already sailed. It's done. Deciding he can't see the boy if he doesn't agree to this or that may not even be on the table. You guys can sit down and hammer out an agreement and get lawyers involved, and that may wind up being the best course. But I would advise what another poster suggested first. Just sit down and have a talk together. Talk about parenting. Talk about your mutual son. And not a talk where you tell him how it's going to be, but one where both listen to the other. If you want him to be willing to bend on this, what are you willing to bend for him? To do his way even when it's completely against yours? If you two are reasonable, then perhaps you could find some common ground based on shared goals for your son, and the discussion could be broached based on wanting to be consistent in the two households.
Thank you for all that you wrote. It's so wonderful to get so many well-thought out opinions, especially when I feel as hopeless as I do right now.
If ex and I had parented together from the start, I'd be more willing to ask for his input. I went on the ride solo because he didn't want to come along. I was fine with that. Then he asks to join in. I'm fine with that too, but me asking for his input is new for me. It's not as though I didn't want his opinions or to make all the decisions without consulting him, it's just what I am used to. I am still trying to adjust. My son is too. We all are but if he really has all those high expectations... all I can do is work on it.
I want us to talk. I want us to communicate. I want to hear his side and his expectations as far as parenting. I am afraid of his response.
...I honestly never considered this. However, it doesn't exactly make sense. What I get in child support is dependent upon ex's salary. The initial amount I started receiving once DS was born was actually generous for his salary at the time (back when he was a sleazy car wreck attorney). I was reluctant to take it because I knew it was because he never wanted us coming around. At the time he was willing to do anything to make it go away and to go on with life. Child support increased.
When he came around he told me it was because he wanted to get to know our son. I couldn't think of a shady reason for him to want to do that. I didn't see an agenda.
It doesn't make sense because you never went to court to determine child custody and support. He (your ex) has controlled this whole issue with regard to child support. You have been following his lead. Time to change. Did you or have you ever seen his tax returns? How do you know what he makes?
Child support is not solely dependent upon salary. I suspect your ex knows this, hence his renewed interest in a child he never wanted...five years after birth. Please, please, seek legal advice - soon.
Thank you for all that you wrote. It's so wonderful to get so many well-thought out opinions, especially when I feel as hopeless as I do right now.
If ex and I had parented together from the start, I'd be more willing to ask for his input. I went on the ride solo because he didn't want to come along. I was fine with that. Then he asks to join in. I'm fine with that too, but me asking for his input is new for me. It's not as though I didn't want his opinions or to make all the decisions without consulting him, it's just what I am used to. I am still trying to adjust. My son is too. We all are but if he really has all those high expectations... all I can do is work on it.
I want us to talk. I want us to communicate. I want to hear his side and his expectations as far as parenting. I am afraid of his response.
I think it sounds like you are trying to do the right thing. This is a challenging time for everyone, and it never feels good to go through a period of change. There are so many people advocating that your ex be told he will only get this or that, etc, but I would be very cautious with that approach--for several reasons. The first and foremost being I think it could permanently sour the co-parenting relationship and make things a LOT more difficult on both of you, and your son. You're kind of in an okay place right now in that you've cooperated so far and there's the opportunity for discussion to take place.
The second reason is because ultimately, you might not have many/any more legal rights than he does. People are calling him "the donor" and while I understand that viewpoint, it's coming across to me as a little extreme. This man is the biological father. He's been on the birth certificate from the start. He's paid child support. A year ago he reached out and got involved and has gradually had increasing contact. No, he wins no awards for not wanting to be a father at the start, but honestly, the way this started was not something the two of you planned. It was an accident, by everyone's account. You had one reaction to it. There would've been no condemnation if you'd chosen another. Your ex chose that it wasn't what he'd wanted, but he still took the financial responsibility on. He didn't just bail. Then later, after he'd likely grown up a bit, he figured out he was capable of being involved to. The writing that you don't want kids on your blog thing isn't the stuff of Hallmark cards, but honestly, some people feel like that at one point in their lives, then change as they get older and mature.
I write all this out to raise the point that the courts may very well give him shared custody. Or generous visitation. Supervised visitation is usually for extreme cases--abuse, etc. You don't have that here. You have a parenting disagreement. If this is ultimately going to end very similarly to the situation you currently have, or more in his favor, I don't know that it swings things in your favor for it to get nastier rather than for you two to simply try sitting down and discussing your parenting ideas. It is an adjustment for everyone. Discussions tend to go better when everyone feels like they are heard and have power in the situation. It is possible that although you say you never have to discipline your son, this results in some behaviors that seem too undisciplined for your ex. You might have to agree on some rules that are more structured than what you are used to. That might be something you could give, if he gave on the area of discipline. And really, this isn't necessarily different from what you'd have to do if you two were married and had been in agreement all along. Even parents who are in a relationship disagree on parenting. Even parents who are in a relationship and have agreed on parenting have to re-discuss things all the time as the situation changes. What worked beautifully in the concept in your head may not work on that particular kid. What worked beautifully on kid #1 may not work on kid #2.
I think it can't hurt to try to find common ground.
Maybe I'm overcautious, but it strikes me as a bad sign that he's already striking the kid. Yes, it's his son, but he's only known him for a short time; there a caring underpinning there that the discipline can rest upon. Plus if he's resorting to spanking over relatively non-urgent, non-intense matters such as an early elementary kid's lost homework...there's no where to go but escalation, really.
It doesn't make sense because you never went to court to determine child custody and support. He (your ex) has controlled this whole issue with regard to child support. You have been following his lead. Time to change. Did you or have you ever seen his tax returns? How do you know what he makes?
Child support is not solely dependent upon salary. I suspect your ex knows this, hence his renewed interest in a child he never wanted...five years after birth. Please, please, seek legal advice - soon.
This. The ex knows all sorts of things the OP doesn't know. Including what has been going on in his life the five years he didn't want any contact with his son. I'd be finding out if/how many other kids the Hook Up has out there. And make sure my child's $upport was in writing, and legally binding. If this guy was sleeping with multiple women when the OP was meeting him there's a real good chance this child has half siblings.
I urge you to find that out OP. The last thing your son needs is to come back after a visit and say, "I met my brother today. Did you know I had a brother?" Never mind the chance of him meeting Dad's girlfriends. One by one. If he was hooking up with multiple women five years ago I'd guess he still is today. Be smart, OP. Find out what's going on so you can prepare your son and protect him from surprises. And he deserves to have his financial share of the pie secured by the courts in case this guy has other kids.
Jaded is right. The ex is pulling all the strings. An attorney needs to be seen.... pronto.
Whatever else, try to work things out between yourselves. Bringing lawyers, and especially the court, into the process is going to produce (expensive) results which neither of you (including junior) are going to like.
That is not to say if there is some heinous behavior going on, or Dad beasts son (spanking is fine--you know what I am talking about) or you are otherwise being extensively taken advantage of, then by all means get 'the law' involved.
But don't think any outsiders are going to generate satisfactory results. These are best achieved, and they likely won't be perfect (few things in life are) directly between yourselves.
Good luck. I divorced in large part of the issue how to discipline children. Not an easy space in which to work, especially given your circumstances.
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