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Old 12-13-2007, 06:07 PM
 
Location: NJ
9,228 posts, read 20,253,831 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pirate girl View Post
OH no, my son knows exactly what he does. He's far from impulsive- when he was younger he really challenged his first grade teacher and we had him tested for ADD and we learned that he's actually of above average intelligence and not ADD at all- he's just stubborn and challenging and demanding of answers.

When we're arguing, he chastises me for interrupting him- he feels that he should be heard, no matter how ridiculous his mission may be. Since he was about 4 I realized that he wasn't typical- didn't buy into fantasty stories- always, always questioned things. He busted me for being the tooth fairy when he was six and was probably on only his third tooth. He had his doubts and he pretended to be asleep so when I went in to exchange the tooth for money he jumped up when I had my hand under his pillow and said "Aha, I caught you!" It was dark enough that I dropped to all fours and crawled out of the room without answering him. The next morning he mentioned what happened and I acted like I had no idea what he was talking about.

Well a couple months later he lost another tooth and didn't tell me- the next morning he came out holding the tooth saying that I must be the tooth fairy because he didn't tell me about the tooth and the tooth fairy didn't come. I told him that the tooth fairy is busy and she needs parents to call her to let her know when she needs to come.

He didn't buy it and instead told me to just give him the money.


He's a piece of work.
Good thing I wasn't drinking something. Holy cow!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave1215 View Post
Be careful with this advice. Don't smother him or make him mommy's little boy. Have him join a gym and then take him there and watch over him???? I'm not sure a freshman would want that level of babysitting - may turn him off more than help. Just be careful and let him grow into being a man - this is part of that learning.

No one is saying to smother him. I take my daughter places.. and I sit & wait. A lot can be learned by doing this. I see how my daughter interacts with people. No one is saying to make him a mommys boy. She has questions, sometimes it's the only way to find out. I know parents that wouldn't care one way or another what goes on with their kid.
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Old 12-14-2007, 09:43 AM
 
Location: NE Florida
9,362 posts, read 22,359,929 times
Reputation: 9265
Yesterday my son came home and the hot dog bully started telling my son that he was gay in front of everyone. My son said that he almost started crying in class. The teacher had stepped out. This is not like my son at all. So forget all my "wise" advice..... catch the kids after school and beat the crap out of them.. That's what I am going to do today....I'll dress up like Santa.

Okay, maybe not.

Since they have a game tonight and will be on Chrsitmas break beginning Monday, my 28YO son and I will speak to his parents at the game. Turns out the kid is also making fun of a boy whose mom is a lesbian- asking in front of others, "Hey, D, do you have a dad?" And telling the kids that D's mom is a lesbian.

Haven't gotten the rsvp to my son's b-day party from bully boy, so guess he isn't planning on coming.
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Old 12-14-2007, 10:19 AM
 
Location: Lexington, MA
250 posts, read 831,979 times
Reputation: 487
DISCLAIMER: My oldest boy is 7, so I haven't taken a kid down this road. BUT I was fairly active in high school sports when I grew up, and I think I have the picture of what's going on.

My advice, in a nutshell: If he's being given a hard time because the older kids say he isn't lifting properly.... LISTEN TO THE OLDER KIDS. I have no idea what attitudes are flying around the gym... there probably is a bit of ego, but it may be that his lifting technique isn't correct.... If all the older kids are telling him he's not doing it properly, my advice would be to listen to them and learn to do it properly.

I'm guessing his improper technique is allowing him to use heavier weights that are probably approaching what the older kids are lifting. They feel threatened because the frosh is lifting heavier weights, so they are picking on his technique. And, the hell of it is, the older kids could be right. He may not be able to lift as much with the proper technique.

It may be the best-case scenario here is he uses proper technique and has to listen to some (hopefully) good-natured razzing because he isn't lifting as much as the older kids. But that may come along with just being on the team and if they allow him to participate that way... food for thought, anyhow.

:shrug:

Last edited by johnycakes; 12-14-2007 at 11:04 AM..
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Old 12-14-2007, 02:01 PM
 
12,620 posts, read 17,707,067 times
Reputation: 2988
Quote:
Originally Posted by pirate girl View Post
OH no, my son knows exactly what he does. He's far from impulsive- when he was younger he really challenged his first grade teacher and we had him tested for ADD and we learned that he's actually of above average intelligence and not ADD at all- he's just stubborn and challenging and demanding of answers.

When we're arguing, he chastises me for interrupting him- he feels that he should be heard, no matter how ridiculous his mission may be. Since he was about 4 I realized that he wasn't typical- didn't buy into fantasty stories- always, always questioned things. He busted me for being the tooth fairy when he was six and was probably on only his third tooth. He had his doubts and he pretended to be asleep so when I went in to exchange the tooth for money he jumped up when I had my hand under his pillow and said "Aha, I caught you!" It was dark enough that I dropped to all fours and crawled out of the room without answering him. The next morning he mentioned what happened and I acted like I had no idea what he was talking about.

Well a couple months later he lost another tooth and didn't tell me- the next morning he came out holding the tooth saying that I must be the tooth fairy because he didn't tell me about the tooth and the tooth fairy didn't come. I told him that the tooth fairy is busy and she needs parents to call her to let her know when she needs to come.

He didn't buy it and instead told me to just give him the money.


He's a piece of work.
Sounds like my 20 + kid only worse... The first thing I would do is to discontinue arguing with him when he is disrespecful say something like I will not allow you to talk to me in that way and walk away! If he says anything say We will discuss this later if you can be respectful and non argumentative. It is difficult to do but you have to!

As far as the coach I would talk to the coach and ask how he is doing and what the coach thinks.
I would feel out the situation and maybe wait to discuss the occurances your son is having with his fellow classmates.
When discussing this with the coach I would voice concerns about the not letting him work out and is he lifting or doing the other things the right way or not.
That type of conversation so the coach does not go into defense mode. Be more of a concerned parent with questions. Than accusing.
That way the coach might be more opt to watch and see instead of pulling kids into his office and accusing them of this or that.
If in the event your son is not lifting the right way he could seriously hurt himself for life.
I know others have said stay out of it. Well, I disagree he is only a freshman not experienced with this sort of heirechey of high school. Kids on a team should be just that a team.
Hang in there.
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Old 12-16-2007, 11:37 AM
 
788 posts, read 1,889,580 times
Reputation: 597
I haven't been around in a while - but I have another idea that I'd like you to consider. I have a 17 year old son who plays 3 varsity sports. I would give the athletic director at the school a call and just suggest that there be more supervision in the weight room - that you are uncomfortable with some of the things that you heard. You do need to let your son handle it himself - but he is still a child. He will get the rep with the kids and also the coaches and it's hard to undo that.
I have spoken to my son's coaches WITHOUT the child knowing it - I just ask the coach not to say anything. They NEVER have. It may just be your kid's mouthy - mine sure is! But it could also be some of the older kids abusing their authority. Either way - it needs to be kept in check. I know that my idea isn't very popular - that's okay. I am confident that the way that I handle things works for my family. Everyone is different and you can only listen with an open mind and then decide for yourself. I have a tendancy to let my son get a little mouthy and let him air his feelings as long as he stays within spitting distance of respect. But that isn't the way the world works and I have had a hard time getting through to him on that - it's a hard lesson.
I agree about not letting them quit - just remember - this too will NOT pass!! Boys are easier in some ways - but harder in others. I have two of each!!
Good luck!!
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Old 01-05-2008, 02:19 AM
MsV
 
2,604 posts, read 993,048 times
Reputation: 854
Hi pg, I wrote you a lengthy response pre-Christmas, and lost it all to cyberspace when I finished. Even tonight, I wrote a few sentences to post, and it disappeared again. My computer has been super-sensitive since moving, sorry. Oh well, let me just say that some great posts go before me, and some I don't agree with (of course, you know me).

* You sound like a great Mother ~ and although I'm sure your x is nice enough, he and his wife need to grow up and he needs to get his butt more involved in his son's life, bec it is his responsibility, every bit as much as $ support is...and after he does that, he will realize it is his pleasure too! "His wife won't let him come?!" What a gift this man is neglecting! And he is definitely impacting his' son's impression of fatherhood and men in general, even from a distance away. Oh well, anyway...

* Your son sounds like an unusually well-balanced young man. I agree that some of the qualities you describe in your son, are actually ones that will serve him well in adulthood, if he can just learn to 'stay within himself' by controlling his stubborn/mouthy tendencies...other than that, he sounds like a genuinely smart and capable young man. Unfortunately, if he sounds too self-assured, it can sound arrogant...and then you have those seniors just looking for something he's not doing perfectly right, and they pounce on it. I happens all day long, every day, everywhere...but the bullying and pushing shouldn't be tolerated...this is one reason college 'hazing' is endured ~ people assume it is a right of passage. Most of these ugly events get swept under the rug, but since you were so well-engaged with your son, you got to hear about it. Unlike most of my fellow posters, I would speak to the coach (particularly if it continues).

I'm the mother of 3, one boy, who I wondered daily how I could best help him make it through HS. He was a very bright, great kid, who only wanted to do things his own way, and it caused problems. Today he is a 25yo successful software engineer with a masters degree, working for the government...so I particularly know what you mean when you say your son is a good kid, in spite of what's happening.

* You've convinced me that the coach is kind, sincere and professional. I would most definitely call him...BUT as was mentioned earlier, don't call to complain, call to inform him that you're concerned about things you've heard, let him know you don't want to use any names, but that you have enough faith in the coach to know that he couldn't be aware of what's happening during practices. Then you could tell him that your son is motivated to condition himself, but you are concerned whether he's lifting weights properly ~ and it was a good idea that you send him to a gym to learn to lift properly, if you can afford this. I think if you don't challenge the coach, but rather assume that he isn't aware of what's happening, and you ask him to not tell your son you are calling, you will have helped the situation. It worked for me many times through my son's HS years. And incidentally, it's true that performing well in the sport is the best way to earn the team's regard...remind your son of that.

I've been an adolescent clinician in a school system for many years, and I can assure you that the "tell the kid to pull his boots up by the straps and find his own way out" doesn't always work. It can easily leave kids struggling alone with things that are prohibited, threatening, or just plain illegal. It is a parent's job description to help kids through these tough events ~ but many, if not most, of them haven't even done the work of bonding with their kids as you have...it's just easier to let the kids work things out for themselves. The kids learn very early to not rely on adults to protect or guide them. And incidentally, I believe in that theory myself, but we are talking about events that are not supposed to happen, unforeseen events ~ sometimes it can build character for a kid to handle these things themselves, but often it can leave them feeling overwhelmed with frustration, anger and even saddness ~ that is not the way to nurture good self-esteem.

Speaking to the extreme effects these events have on kid's lives, just know that adolescent suicide's being one of the highest percentages is not just rhetoric, it is fact. I suggest that if you feel you can make the call in the positive and productive (non-incriminating) way we all suggest, that you do. But, no matter what you decide, keep monitoring your son's progress in life bec, it shows! Congratulations on a job well done.

PS: Incidentally, as is previously suggested, people who speak out, do their own thing, are stubborn, feisty and/or arrogant, etc are not signs of good self-esteem...it can often be either a sign of poor impulse control, a lack of trust in working with others or a multitude of other things. I don't believe that description matched your son's profile or issues. Just my thoughts...

Last edited by MsV; 01-05-2008 at 02:37 AM..
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Old 01-05-2008, 07:33 AM
 
Location: In the sunshine on a ship with a plank
3,413 posts, read 7,842,175 times
Reputation: 2214
Thank you Ms. V.
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Old 01-07-2008, 12:07 AM
 
1 posts, read 1,430 times
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Default ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by pirate girl View Post
HELP! And I'm sorry this is so long

I have a young teen who is a freshman. He's always been outspoken and stubborn and never afraid to speak his mind. These traits, although I find them favorable most of the time, I know can be irritating to other people like teachers and coaches and classmates.

He joined a sports team at his school and seemed to get along well with his teammates throughout the season. There seemed to be some good natured bullying from the older kids and I chalked that up to typical freshman initiation. For instance, if he got tired during conditioning or workouts and stopped, they would pick on him. Or they would give him a hard time the next day and tell him not to be a wimp during practice. Again- nothing I worried about and as a matter of fact, I knew the older kids (captains) were doing their job by trying to get him fired up.

Well they are through the first part of their season and are now in a conditioning phase. They are using the weight room and doing some running after school every day. Although this part of the sport is optional, my son stays after school every day to work out and condition. He enjoys participating and is committed to his sport.

Over the last couple of weeks I have seen his attitude change and for the last two days he has called me to pick him up early. Apparently, the older kids are giving him a hard time about his weight room practices. They tell him he can't lift a certain weight and of course he does to prove to them that he can. They then tell him he's cheating...... He is no shrinking violet, so he mouths off to them and it becomes a *****ing match of words.

These kids have shoved him away from weight sets and told him he's not lifting properly. They have called him some names (some not so nice) and he has become fed up. Yesterday he wanted to quit the team and I told him that was fine but he had to either talk to his coach or write him an e mail explaining why. Well after cooling off he decided he wanted to stay on the team and went to practice today. The results were similar- the kids wouldn't let him work out because he's not doing it right. Three or four of them have really bashed him verbally. One thing he repeated is that one senior told him that he needs to stop arguing all the time and start listening to what they tell him.

This set off some alarms in my mind- because he can exasperate me sometimes with his arguing. He's a good kid but like I said, very outspoken and stubborn. He's a bit of a late bloomer and has been very hormonal lately- he's a good kid, I don't see any signs of trouble other than being easily frustrated and very determined to be his own person- so the older kid being aggravated with him makes perfect sense to me.

Anyway, he's talking about leaving the team again. I told him he needs to talk to his coach or I would. He told me he's not a baby and he can handle this himself. I think it's good that he does- but if his attitude is argumentative I don't know if I need to reach out to the coach as well to find out how difficult he's being.

I know the coach likes him- and I'm not sure he would be ok with the bullying and name calling that his older kids are doing. But I know I need to let go and stop being too protective. I don't want him to be known as the kid who's mom tells on other kids for being mean.

So I really don't know what to do. Part of me wants to let him handle it. The other part of me wants to swoop in and have a talk with his coach.

Like I said, although he's hormonal and moody, he's really a good kid. He doesn't go to parties, I always know exactly where he is. I know his friends and his friend's parents. We have a very open relationship and I have no concerns about any major problems (drugs, etc). I think he's just trying to become a man and handle things on his own. But he can be such a buster sometimes.


Any advice from VETERANS of raising teen boys would be appreciated.

Well I haven't raised a teen boy but i am 18 and went through what he has. most of the time there just joking around with him in the weight room as a leader on our team i did it all the time. it just got people motivated to lift harder. But tell him the worst thing he can do is argue back, older team mates hate that and will be aggrissive toward him. If someone says he cant lift that much or make fun of his lifts just tell him to smile and flip them off in his head. Sometime i seen freshman get picked on i usual take that one in as a friend and let them lift with me so no one talks **** to him. Tell him to try and find an older lifting partner to help him and push him to make him better. make sure you dont talk to the coach about it inless he starts getting physicly abused. If he needs to talk to me or needs help on dealing with problems like that with teammates tell him to email me at [email]WolfWood435@hotmail.com[/email] or Myspace me same email. Ill help him anyway i can.

~corey #79
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Old 01-07-2008, 08:19 AM
MsV
 
2,604 posts, read 993,048 times
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EaglesFootball79, kudos to you for writing such an insightful response. Your suggestion of finding a lifting "partner" is obviously the best idea. Congratulations on your most helpful post. MsV
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Old 01-08-2008, 09:03 AM
 
Location: In the sunshine on a ship with a plank
3,413 posts, read 7,842,175 times
Reputation: 2214
Corey, thank you! It's nice to hear such a great angle from someone who has been there- on both sides of the issue- very recently.

School just started back yesterday- and he had a great practice- let's hope it continues.
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