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I just want to say something about never saying anything bad about one's spouse.
Maybe it's different after a divorce, but I grew up with my mother telling me what a wonderful person my father was. He is NOT a wonderful person. He's kind of awful - he is a borderline sociopath and a narcissist for sure. Don't get me wrong - I love my father to pieces, but with no one acknowledging his problematic personality and the fact that he is almost completely morally bankrupt, I often felt like I was going crazy. For a long time, I had a very skewed view of what constituted "normal and healthy." I KNEW my father wasn't "right," but no one would acknowledge it. In fact, one day when I was criticizing my father's lack of morals, my mother slapped my face to shut me up.
The most annoying part was when he cheated on my mother during my senior year of college and basically imploded the marriage. My mother was all "Why? Why? WHY?" accompanied by hysterical crying jags and a fake suicide attempt. And I had a hard time having much sympathy for her. Who he was was in front of her all the time and she refused to acknowledge it.
After the divorce a therapist explained narcissistic personality disorder and how my father fit all the criteria. It all made sense. But being raised in that household has had a huge impact on my personal relationships, especially my romantic relationships, which have been very limited in number.
When one parent has a mental disorder, failing to acknowledge it can be a big problem. Is it talking crap about your ex-spouse if you acknowledge to your child that their mental wiring isn't all that it should be? I don't think it really is. I wish my mother had been honest with herself and been honest with me about what my father's really like.
I don't understand what the question is. You are obviously determined to pursue this talk.
Me either & yes, OP is determined. I don't even know why this thread was even started now...
OP is going to go in "guns blazing" & set the useless record straight. Good luck with that. How sad you just can't end it for your son who just graduated & probably wants some attention focused on that instead of hearing all this BS he has heard all his life.
This whole thing sounds juvenile & dare I say... something you usually hear from a scorned wife. Your poor son. I hope he gets a chance to enjoy having just graduated HS & attending college in the fall instead of rehashing the same old crap with his parents. Ugh.
Yes, I have to share some heavy stuff. The ex has left me no choice. And up until recently, I was as involved with my son as I ever was, in germs of raising him. His personality reflects my side of the family more than hers. He has approached wanting to know about the things his mother has told him of late. I wasn't offering, he's asking. Straight up.
Dude,
I have a story from hell - won't go into it - and a piece of advice I would pass on to you is to call him tomorrow, he is coming over Wed, and tell him to write down any questions he wants to ask, just like it was business. That way he won't forget to ask something.
After the hugs and greetings keep the talk light. I would let him ask and you answer calmly about yourself and him only. I wouldn't touch on his mother unless he really wants to know and even then I would ask him if he really wants you to answer that. If he asks something you are a bit uncomfortable with tell him you'll have to think about it and can answer the next time you get together. You do plan on seeing him again, correct? Why force this conversation into one window of opportunity? Make this visit easy and tell him you want to get to know the man he is.
You should have plenty of chances to shoot the breeze since he is an adult. Take him out for lunch or dinner and buy him a beer - oops, he's 18, tell him not to shave.
Life sux big time and you'll both get over it. He's your boy and needs to know you have his back.
You might succeed in running down the ex, if that's what you're trying for. But parenting isn't a game where if one loses, the other one wins. Chances are good that such a strategy will end in the kid just resenting and looking down at BOTH parents.
If he has heard untrue things about you, correct them...about you. I am not a drug user. My disability is real. This is how much I was required to pay in support, out of an income of this much. Facts, not drama. Truths about you, not drama about your ex. For much of this stuff you should have documentation - e.g. incomes, support payments, doctor records, etc. - you can show those, solid backup of what you're saying.
If what you're looking for is a good relationship with your son, the point isn't to drag your ex down, it's to lift yourself up. Stick to that.
And basically no kid appreciates dramatics from a parent. Kids, even grown kids, feel secure with a parent who is solid and steady. So consider toning down the operatics.
Well, I don't believe in always taking the "high road." Sometimes taking the high road just leaves you stranded!
As far as telling your son the truth, I'm a big fan of telling adult children (even mature late teens) the truth. I'm also not sure that explaining the details of the situation with your son will backfire on you as some posters have alluded here. In fact, your son might be experiencing some issues with his mother and has kept them to himself for fear of badmouthing her to YOU.
I've never understood the notion that parents or other family members should forever be placed on a pedestal or have their flawed characters protected from those closest to them, whom they can actually hurt due to the unsuspecting nature of those loved ones...all because it was thought that they needed to be "kept out of the mess..." I can assure you, THAT mindset will backfire on you.
If your wife is vindictive, untruthful, and manipulative, your son already knows this. Give him space to vent (let him know it's okay to do so with you). And welcome his concerns and complaints if he has any. Also, he's old enough to know exactly why you and your wife divorced. I'm surprised he hasn't asked already! Most children of divorced parents ask this question. If the truth is that there was infidelity, why on earth would you lie to him about that at his age? Stating the FACTS about the deterioration of your relationship with your ex and subsequent divorce is something that IS his business as it did and still does affect him. This doesn't mean you have to bash his mother or call her out of her name, etc. It just means that as a young man, an adult, he deserves to know the truth.
If you choose to avoid discussing his mother, then the conversation will not achieve the results you are seeking. I personally don't see in your posts where you want him to hate his mother. Rather, you want him to understand your circumstances and why you and his mother are no longer together - unfortunately, from what you've written, there is no way around not discussing her. She's the other "half" of the issue.
It always sounds wonderful to say "don't say anything negative about the other parent" but reality is that children are not blind. They are not deaf, dumb, and aloof to their parents or others behaviors. Sometimes it's best to lay all the cards on the table and allow family members and loved ones to take those they need and leave the rest. At your son's age, he's likely already formed solid opinions about you and your ex-wife. The fact that your current GF used to be her friend and that your son likes your GF a lot probably fueled most of the latest slurs your ex-wife has thrown your way.
I believe that no parent should paint the other as a saint or villain. At appropriate ages, children deserve to hear that not liking certain characteristics or personality traits of a parent's or anyone's for that matter, is completely normal and acceptable. If you try to maintain keeping her image "clean" and "innocent" then he may feel something is wrong with him if he believes she isn't.
well if he 'graduated' he is 18, there shouldn't be anything he can't handle.
A frank discussion about your medical situation, and to lesser degree the effect on your financial situation I think is fine. Bashing/bad mouthing/fully documenting every atrocity your ex ever did to you - don't nobody want to hear that. Keep it down to a few bullet points about termination of child support and the continuing alimony requirement. Your kid might be daft if he has no idea his mama hates your guts.
I don't understand what the question is. You are obviously determined to pursue this talk.
That's because there is no question being asked. Yes, this talk will happen. But writing things down and reading the responses here has helped me put what I'm going to talk about in perspective, a d helps calm me down so I'm thinking properly.
Well, my ex just pulled a hummdinger today. Oh my....bit of a game changer. I may just throw up my hands and let it ride. Cancel even talking to my son about anything. Let time do its work and just suck it up. I have no counter punch I wish to throw with this, and my son most certainly doesn't need to know anything. I truly don't understand how my ex could have gone here, but she did.
Things with my son will stand as is, and I'll just leave the door open. I can't sink to the depths it would take to even respond to things with his mother. Best to go on haunches and sink spur straight ahead. But hey all, thanks for all the interest, anyway. Some good reading and thought provoking opinions. Helped a bit.
Well, my ex just pulled a hummdinger today. Oh my....bit of a game changer. I may just throw up my hands and let it ride. Cancel even talking to my son about anything. Let time do its work and just suck it up. I have no counter punch I wish to throw with this, and my son most certainly doesn't need to know anything. I truly don't understand how my ex could have gone here, but she did.
Things with my son will stand as is, and I'll just leave the door open. I can't sink to the depths it would take to even respond to things with his mother. Best to go on haunches and sink spur straight ahead. But hey all, thanks for all the interest, anyway. Some good reading and thought provoking opinions. Helped a bit.
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