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Old 08-03-2014, 09:27 PM
 
43,012 posts, read 88,940,518 times
Reputation: 30256

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Quote:
Originally Posted by eok View Post
The real problem is that you love him too much, and love makes you blind. Teenagers aren't human. You should only love humans. Find an excuse to send him somewhere far away, till he reaches age 20 and becomes human again.
I love this in theory! LOL

 
Old 08-03-2014, 10:23 PM
 
477 posts, read 375,277 times
Reputation: 1547
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tina545 View Post
My son is going into senior year and has developed a very callous attitude. This got worse after he took AP Biology and started applying the ideas to human life. For example, he makes jokes about my sister's fertility issues. He has called adoption an institution that allows for gays and steriles to live out their delusions of having kids. Also, he has called religious people including his own grandparents retards. He also said that he only cares about people when he benefits. There seems to be no compassion left in him and it breaks my heart that he sees the world through lens of Social Darwinism. He used to be such a happy go lucky child but that faded as he got exposed to the news and the world around him What should I do?
I am sorry to say this, but these are hallmarks of an antisocial personality disorder - what they used to call psychopaths. Before you get TOO upset, not all antisocial people are axe murderers - very few, actually. In fact many highly paid corporate executives exhibit these traits. it doesn't make it any easier for the people in their lives, though.

Also let me reassure you that even if this is the case (and you really CANNOT make "diagnoses" like this over the Internet) it is NOT your fault. There is absolutely no evidence to point the finger at parenting as the root cause. It seems to be something physiological.

The features to be concerned about are the lack of empathy, disdain for others, and his clearly expressed and no doubt truthful - because he doesn't (yet) see the need to lie about it - belief that he need only be considerate of other people if it benefits him.

There are other traits that are typical of such a personality disorder; so just because he exhibits a handful of them doesn't mean he actually HAS that personality disorder. But you say he seems depressed, and has seemed so for years. That, too, is concerning, even if there were NONE of the signs of a personality disorder.

In another post you admit that this has been developing for quite some time. Whether or not he has an actual personality disorder - and you would only know that if you took him to a professional to have him evaluated - it is not a result of "being exposed to the news of the world" or "seeing the world through the lens of Social Darwinism". There is something else at the root of this. If it were my son, I'd have gone in with him for counseling long ago.

Note that that is "gone in WITH him" and not "taken him in". At the very least, there is a family dynamic that needs to be attended to, one way or another. Hopefully a competent therapist will evaluate the situation and be able to reassure you that it's a "phase" or something the family can work through to improve. But if it were me, I'd be seeking some help. You can be too close to a problem and either overestimate OR underestimate its seriousness, and there's no way to tell which, or neither, over the Internet. Antisocial personality disorder is thankfully fairly rare; I'm actually more concerned about the depression you report. Outside help is in order.
 
Old 08-04-2014, 12:01 AM
 
704 posts, read 989,585 times
Reputation: 791
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tina545 View Post
He's smarter than me and is not afraid of me.
I know my kids are smarter academically than I am. I also know my kids aren't afraid of me. But they RESPECT me.
 
Old 08-04-2014, 12:09 AM
 
35,121 posts, read 37,790,060 times
Reputation: 61840
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tina545 View Post
I would argue he's too immersed in the real world. He has an obsession with everything that is dark and unpleasant. There is no dependency and entitlement issues. He won't respond to this anyway he will simply adjust.

Why did you even start this thread if all you are going to continue to do is make excuses as to why he won't (fill in the blank) and you continue to justify his behavior.
I think this thread was a complete waste of my time and everyone else's who has posted.
I do wish you and yours all you deserve in your lifetime and I am checking out of the hotel bs.
 
Old 08-04-2014, 01:02 AM
 
3,942 posts, read 3,871,659 times
Reputation: 4682
Hmm.. Since the Levesques are so concerned and knowing your son is all about survival of the fittest, he can practice his Social Darwinism with the polar bears up north.

Send him to Antarctica. The way you describe him, he can outsmart anyone and outlive any harsh conditions.

He's old enough. Most fit. Or send him to Sub-Saharan Africa. He'll find a way. Congo. The militia can straighten him out.

Place him in the middle of a gorilla warfare. See how he adapts. He's callous enough, right?

(another troll thread?)
 
Old 08-04-2014, 02:10 AM
eok
 
6,684 posts, read 2,945,131 times
Reputation: 8439
Parents should respect their children and help them become independent. I personally think it would be wonderful to send him to Alaska. Not just to get him out of your way, but also because Alaska is a great place for people that age to become independent. Jobs there pay a lot, because there is a shortage of workers. It's a very beautiful, very wonderful place, and he would always treasure his memories of it. Don't just dump him there. Give him everything he needs to get started there. He is, after all, your son, and you love him a lot more than he presently seems to love you. Don't be fooled by that temporary lack of love. It's just the way teenagers are. He will love you more than ever when he's older. Sending him to someplace like Alaska might very well be the greatest gift you could give him right now. A few years there, and he's likely to come back a completely different person. Unless he decides to stay there forever, which would give you an opportunity to discover the wonders yourself, whenever you visit him there.

"Were you ever out in the great alone
When the moon was awful clear
And the icy mountains hemmed you in
With a silence you most could hear
With only the howl of a timber wolf
And you camped there in the cold
A half dead thing in a stark dead world
Clean mad for the muck called gold
While high overhead green yellow and red
The north lights swept in bars
Then you've a hunch what the music meant
Hunger and night and the stars"

If he doesn't know how to get to Alaska, look at the Alaska state flag. It has a map of how to get there.

On the other hand, if he can afford a good university, and/or can get a good scholarship, all you have to do is make sure it's a long way from where you live, and everything will be fine. Absence makes the heart grow fonder, and all the love he seems to have lost for you will gradually come back.

Like a mother bird, it's your job to find a way to kick him out, and watch him fly.
 
Old 08-04-2014, 03:04 AM
 
1,851 posts, read 2,908,158 times
Reputation: 2346
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tina545 View Post
I thought he was just being silly. Whenever I talk to him it goes in one ear and come out of the other. His friends are more or less partiers who don't have the brain capacity for this kind of thought. I think he has developed this way on his own. He has always been an independent thinker.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tina545 View Post
He's not afraid of me. If I take away the TV he will still find a way to watch it. He's too independent and intelligent for me to control. I also don't think he deserves to be kicked out of the house. He gets good grades and has a bright future.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tina545 View Post
The way he and his peers treat each other is ridiculous they constantly make fun of each other. My son can behave when he wants something out of someone, for example with girls. He is also fairly popular so I don't think that's an issue.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tina545 View Post
He will not listen to me no matter what. To him I'm a dumb housewife and nothing more. He's smarter than me and is not afraid of me.

You do realize that you and your husband have been with this child since his birth? I'm starting to doubt this whole scenario...
 
Old 08-04-2014, 07:42 AM
 
Location: 500 miles from home
27,237 posts, read 15,024,326 times
Reputation: 20850
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tina545 View Post
My son is going into senior year and has developed a very callous attitude. This got worse after he took AP Biology and started applying the ideas to human life. For example, he makes jokes about my sister's fertility issues. He has called adoption an institution that allows for gays and steriles to live out their delusions of having kids. Also, he has called religious people including his own grandparents retards. He also said that he only cares about people when he benefits. There seems to be no compassion left in him and it breaks my heart that he sees the world through lens of Social Darwinism. He used to be such a happy go lucky child but that faded as he got exposed to the news and the world around him What should I do?
And this has exactly what to do with AP Biology? My kid was cranky when he took it too - but mainly because it was HARD. I think you are way off base with this assumption.

He has been away at college for one year and he, too, has questioned his religion. I think that is quite normal at a certain age. It's normal for them to walk away from the Church and also normal that they come back (often when they have kids of their own).

Teen-age boys are not known for their compassionate personalities, in general.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wmsn4Life View Post
So he was a totally normal, loving, happy kid until he took AP Biology?

Well, I guess you'd better schedule a parent-teacher conference.
Yeah. That was kind of 'out there'.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tina545 View Post
I tried blocking news channels but he just went on the internet. When I started to regulate his internet he just looks it up during school. We as a family volunteer regularly but he scoffs at it as patronizing and condescending. He has no respect for what i have to say because he views me as less intelligent and therefore not worth listening to. When he does respect someone's intelligence he will listen for example he has very deep respect for my brother who is one of the wealthiest men in the county and constantly tries to learn from him.
What good does blocking the news of the world do? Or blocking the internet (unless he's going to x rated sites, etc)? Your actions seem totally unrelated to the issues you are bringing up.

Lack of respect for YOU has not one darn thing to do with watching the news. He has no respect for you because: (a) he's a teen-age boy in the process of breaking the apron strings and (b) because you do not demand his respect or at least tell him to shut his mouth.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Metlakatla View Post
What really matters here is whether he's saying this stuff straight to your sister's face or just to you. It's my suspicion he's saying it just to you because he knows it'll get your tail in a knot.

Stop talking about family with him. Just don't do it. Cut the conversation off calmly and quickly. But don't stop talking. Talk about future plans, what he wants to do after graduation, that sort of thing. Maybe help him make a college plan.

You know, I recall my son's last three months in my home. He was due to fly out to Europe for several months and then onto college. This was one of the best -- but very bittersweet -- times in my life.

Having my son in the house then was just like living with a well-mannered, pleasant, intelligent adult - because that's what he was. What I'm trying to say is that it's tough for us mothers to let go of our sons, but once we do, something pretty cool happens. They become the men they were meant to be.

I have a feeling that's where you're at with your son. You're trying to hold onto the little boy while the man is fighting to get out.
I felt exactly like that last summer; his last summer at home. I literally thought I would die when he moved 8 hours away to attend college. But, I adjusted!

And he came home . . a different person. I really do not like his attitude toward me at all but I know I did my fair share of rebelling. I do think less homemade meals and having his laundry done for him . . is in order. It's hard to give up those habits but I think it would benefit the OP as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by eok View Post
The real problem is that you love him too much, and love makes you blind. Teenagers aren't human. You should only love humans. Find an excuse to send him somewhere far away, till he reaches age 20 and becomes human again.

You keep complaining about him, but don't recognize that compared to most teenagers he's practically a miracle. Lots of parents reading this would gladly trade you theirs for yours. But they're still teenagers, and should not be confused with humans.
Haha! I agree with this statement! 19 has been worse than 18 so far but I know part of that is my fault.

My friends tell me 20-25 . . . .
 
Old 08-04-2014, 08:15 AM
 
Location: Warren County and loving it!
5,079 posts, read 7,243,923 times
Reputation: 2557
I don't have a son but remember the boys in high school. They were pretty callous.

AP Bio has nothing to do with it.

I have a friend whose nephew sounds like your son. It's a mess for the parents. He leaves for school this month and it will be the best thing for him. Actually all of them.

He didn't even "let" his parents tour the school with him. He made them wait in a lounge area. Really????

It sounds like he's testing the boundaries and limitations. It's up to you to set them and enforce them.
 
Old 08-04-2014, 08:46 AM
 
Location: Bangor,Maine
35 posts, read 34,914 times
Reputation: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerseyt719 View Post
I don't have a son but remember the boys in high school. They were pretty callous.

AP Bio has nothing to do with it.

I have a friend whose nephew sounds like your son. It's a mess for the parents. He leaves for school this month and it will be the best thing for him. Actually all of them.

He didn't even "let" his parents tour the school with him. He made them wait in a lounge area. Really????

It sounds like he's testing the boundaries and limitations. It's up to you to set them and enforce them.
I try and I can handle my other three children but I find myself unable to set limits on him, he has no fear.
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