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Subjecting people to the police state and its abusive practices won't stop them in the future. In fact subjecting people to the abusive police state only gives them a legitimate reason to be angry. Opening someone up to criminal liability only guarantees he or she will be harmed instead of helped. A better course of action would be for the parent to discuss and explore the issue on an intellectual level and come to an understanding.
I'd care enough about my children not to open them up to criminal liability.
And I care enough about my children to teach them that they aren't exempt from rules and laws. Children that don't learn that, become adults that learn it the hard way. I'd rather my child learn that life lesson when the rules aren't that tough. To each their own.
Again, a friend's son even said himself, had he been held accountable for his actions when he was younger, he likely wouldn't have gotten into the trouble he did when he was old enough to sit in jail for a few years and now have it on his permanent record as an adult. Teach them young, or the world will teach them for you.
And I care enough about my children to teach them that they aren't exempt from rules and laws. Children that don't learn that, become adults that learn it the hard way. I'd rather my child learn that life lesson when the rules aren't that tough. To each their own.
Again, a friend's son even said himself, had he been held accountable for his actions when he was younger, he likely wouldn't have gotten into the trouble he did when he was old enough to sit in jail for a few years and now have it on his permanent record as an adult. Teach them young, or the world will teach them for you.
Agree with your first paragraph. As for the second, some people blame their parents for everything, for life. You see it a lot on these boards, particularly this one and education.
Ignorance of the law isn't an excuse. She knew she was doing something disgusting, and wrong, and she did it anyway. That's why stupid kids carrying a grudge end up with arrest records.
It's not an excuse to not be punished, but she doesn't KNOW that what she did COULD result in a felony. I guarantee this girl believes the worst case scenario for this would be getting fired. She's a kid, not an expert on the law. If her mom explains that yeah you could go to jail and ruin your life over a glob of spit, she won't do it again.
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Originally Posted by Katarina Witt
Sorry, this is more than a "boo-boo". Good grief, she could have been incubating strep throat and given it to the customer, or any number of worse infections. This is way worse even than stealing. And no matter how much of a jerk the customer is being, and believe me, I've met a few doozies myself, it is not OK to spit in their food! It's ridiculous that anyone would have to tell you that. None of us, including, know for a fact that the customer was being as obnoxious as the child is saying, either. Some people take everything very personally.
Oh, baloney! As Mattie says, ignorance isn't an excuse. And if that never crossed her mind, she's way too immature to work in food service.
I didn't say it was a boo boo. I said there is a hundred miles between a boo boo and the psych ward, this lies somewhere in between. Unless she has a history of violent or aggressive behavior (more than normal teenage angst) their is no need to subject her to therapy.
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Originally Posted by UserName14289
I don't know what kind of crowd you ran with as a child. I grew up in one of the poorest parts of Baltimore Co., and even I didn't have friends committing felonies.
Oh please. I was a good kid with good friends. Neither I nor any of them ever did anything extreme or were even close to getting arrested. But in general kids do dumb stuff. They don't understand the extent of what they are doing. Driving really fast or vandalising something is fun. Do they realize it's dangerous and wrong, yes, but do they really think that far ahead or fully understand the consequences of their actions? No way.
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Originally Posted by mochamajesty
I hope that you don't have kids, because you totally missed the point. Read the post below, slowly. Out loud if need be.
Yup I have three kids. They are wonderful. I get compliments for their good behavior and I don't send them to counseling every time they mess u . We sit down and have one on one why it was wrong. I parent them, I don't police or demonize them.
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Originally Posted by magicturtle
wow, maybe in your circle people do
I think we are probably not in the same circle
by a long shot
Your silly, see above.
The critical mistake you all are making about this girl, and the biggest mistake many make about teens, is that since they look like adults, you expect them to BEHAVE and perceive things as adults, when really they are just children and their brains are incapable of doing so.
A person's brain does not finish developing until they are 25, yes 25! That means a 17 year old still has a good eight years before his/her brain is fully functioning at an adult level. Guess which part of the brain develops last? Logic and reasoning. So yes, by the teen years they know things are right and wrong on a simplistic level, but their brains simply don't go to the next step of putting actions with consequences. It's why they think they are invincible, that they won't get caught for doing things and they don't factor in the full weight of their choices.
Based on this the girl's reaction seems pretty typical of a teen: emotional not logical.
Quote:
Adults think with the prefrontal cortex, the brain's rational part. This is the part of the bran that responds to situations with good judgment and an awareness of long-term consequences. Teens process information with the amygdale. This is the emotional part.
In teen's brains, the connections between the emotional part of the brain and the decision-making center are still developing. That's why when teens are under overwhelming emotional input, they can't explain later what they were thinking. They weren't thinking as much as they were feeling.
It's unfortunate that her stupid mistake put someone else in danger, but at 17 she simply just does not understand exactly why what she did was so bad. You would not send your kid to therapy for drinking underage one time, you would not send your kid to therapy for stealing one time, you would not send your kid to therapy for excessively speeding one time and so on. All those things deserve punishment and firm reprimanding, but they do not mean your kid is a terrible person who needs therapy or else they will end up in prison. What she did is s big deal, but extreme consequences are not the answer for a FIRST offense. That will just teach her to be more secretive and hide more from her mom.
It's unfortunate that her stupid mistake put someone else in danger, but at 17 she simply just does not understand exactly why what she did was so bad. You would not send your kid to therapy for drinking underage one time, you would not send your kid to therapy for stealing one time, you would not send your kid to therapy for excessively speeding one time and so on. All those things deserve punishment and firm reprimanding, but they do not mean your kid is a terrible person who needs therapy or else they will end up in prison. What she did is s big deal, but extreme consequences are not the answer for a FIRST offense. That will just teach her to be more secretive and hide more from her mom.
Not to mention that there's therapy, and there's therapy. A good therapist will give insight and ideas without spoon-feeding the information, or just act as a venting soundboard, which isn't a bad thing, either. A bad therapist will made you wonder "What an idiot!" at best, and push you down the depression cliff at worst.
She's 17, so she's still a minor. You call the IHOP and tell them she's not allowed to work for them anymore. You tell your kid she's not allowed to have a job (and that you will only provide money for necessities - basically she's grounded) until after she gets evaluated by a psychiatrist and enters therapy. The therapist has to sign off on the job.
In the meantime, you start doing community service together as a family so that she can see the need for empathy and sees you demonstrating it, not to mention that a nasty customer is far from the worst thing that will ever happen to her.
I have a relative who acts like your daughter - she lives a very hard life in some ways because she doesn't understand functional coping behaviors. I don't talk to her because I think she's unstable. Actually, I know she is.
Agree with your first paragraph. As for the second, some people blame their parents for everything, for life. You see it a lot on these boards, particularly this one and education.
I agree 100%. I believe once you are an adult, your actions are your own. Every single one of us baggage of varying degrees, but we choose as adults how we're going to handle it.
In this particular case, he just turned the legal age to be charged as an adult (and mom tried, finally, to teach him a lesson by letting him stay in over night before rescuing him when he was younger but then grandma bailed him out so the lesson was lost on him when he was a minor ). It took lots of family counseling for both parties (child and parent) to learn how they contributed and how both could change to better the futures for both of them (including mom's relationships and marriage to step-dad, because her behaviors carried over into how she treats myself, her close friend, and others).
But I do agree that as adults we are responsible for ourselves. Is an 18yo an adult? By law, yes. By my opinion as a much older adult, that's up for debate. Either way, they need to learn and I'd rather it be when it's not going to carry a record or be so harsh as when they're an adult.
Basically some woman came in and was apparently really rude and nasty to her and complained about the pancakes she had ordered because there was some fuzz on the plate that my daughter had said probably came off her shirt and the woman wanted some new pancakes, and was mean to my daughter about it. I about lost my stomach when she went on to describe what she did. When she got the new pancakes she dug a hole in the middle of them with her finger and spit in it and covered it up with whip cream and served it to the woman! Now regardless of how bad a customer treats you tampering with food is a bad thing and I know she's 17 but it is just disgusting. After she hung up talking to her friend I went into her room and confronted her and of course she got all upset saying I was invading her privacy and as she put it "The <edit> woman deserved it!". I told her she is grounded for the time being and not allowed to go out with friends but I wonder if I should do more such as tell her manager? She said she only has done that once but I am not sure if I can trust her to tell the truth and if she should even be allowed back to work. I have taught her better than this!
Does your daughter do any cooking at the house? if so i'd be concerned about what shes putting into the family food if she gets upset.
She definitely needs to get out of her current job if shes spitting in peoples food.I'd give her the choice to quit the job on her own volition immediately or i'd inform the manager of her actions ,this type of behavior is unacceptable.
Oh please. I was a good kid with good friends. Neither I nor any of them ever did anything extreme or were even close to getting arrested. But in general kids do dumb stuff. They don't understand the extent of what they are doing. Driving really fast or vandalising something is fun. Do they realize it's dangerous and wrong, yes, but do they really think that far ahead or fully understand the consequences of their actions? No way.
Well, little princess is 17yo. She better start thinking ahead and fully understand the consequences of her actions by now, because in a few short months, she will be tried as an adult in a court of law. How do you like those apples? You don't. Well, good luck changing the law. Next.
It is our jobs as parents to teach them that before they are at the age that they can be tried as adults. Perhaps that concept was lost on some.
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). It took lots of family counseling for both parties (child and parent) to learn how they contributed and how both could change to better the futures for both of them (including mom's relationships and marriage to step-dad, because her behaviors carried over into how she treats myself, her close friend, and others).
