U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Parenting
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 01-04-2016, 02:39 PM
 
4,586 posts, read 4,430,688 times
Reputation: 4341

Advertisements

I didn't say "parents, predict your child's future", I said take/make the time to show them what "future jobs they're interested in" look like. Teach them what they entail, and figure out paths for them to get there together. Expecting them to do it alone is mean, and teaches them nothing but become bitter when it doesn't happen the delusional way they were told when they were "little". Any kid 8 and over is perfectly capable to understand these things if someone takes the time to explain it to them & teaches them how to properly research something.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 01-04-2016, 03:04 PM
 
4,586 posts, read 4,430,688 times
Reputation: 4341
Quote:
Originally Posted by HighFlyingBird View Post
I remember when I was little I said I wanted to be a ballerina. My dad told me that was stupid, hardly anyone "makes it" and they don't make a lot of money. When I was a few years older I said I wanted to be a vet, he told me that was stupid, it would take for ever to get the degree, Id have to be the top of my class. So a few years later I said I wanted to be in advertising and make funny commercials. He told me that was evil ...blah blah blah.

So I stopped dreaming, or thinking about my future. It took a long time for me to be able to do it. My friends got to dream and think about what they wanted to be when they grew up. Not me. I couldn't answer that question until I was actually in college.

When I was and adult studying in the medical field I went to visit my dad. He actually apologized for having done that to me over the years, that he should have just let me be a kid and dream. Not 30 minutes later he unleashed on me about my chosen career path, blah blah blah big business, blah blah blah big phrama, blah blah blah.

I have a feeling the OP and my dad might get along.
That's not what I said....
I'm sorry your dad did this to you, in my case I'm not turning anything down, (except maybe ultimate fighting championships! LOL), like I said "my path" was chosen for me, so I'm never going to do that to my kids, BUT it is my responsibility to present them with little facts(age appropriate conversation), about what they "think" they want to do.

He should have taken you to ballet. I did take my DD and she didn't like it. One of my boys didn't like karate, but I signed him up so he tries before making up an opinion about it. He stopped, because he didn't like it. My other two do. They continue to go. While in conversation about their instructor, I said you too can do this and teach other kids karate...they have to determine if they have enough patience, etc etc etc.

Sounds like your dad didn't know much about other work fields, and wasn't interested in finding out more about them either. I'm the opposite. I'm always curious what various jobs entail....(not so I can pursue them, but because I'm curious).
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-04-2016, 03:37 PM
 
4,586 posts, read 4,430,688 times
Reputation: 4341
Quote:
Originally Posted by convextech View Post
If you were a good enough photographer, you'd get business by word-of-mouth, and wouldn't need to advertise.
Sadly, I don't photograph people/weddings where that "word of mouth" thing works.
I'm a commercial photographer, and we need to spend a lot of money to advertise where it matters.
Plus, we deal with "supply & demand" more than a tailboard engineer does.


I am very good at what I do.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-04-2016, 03:42 PM
 
Location: Denver 'burbs
21,164 posts, read 22,188,272 times
Reputation: 35686
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhotoProIP View Post
I didn't say "parents, predict your child's future", I said take/make the time to show them what "future jobs they're interested in" look like. Teach them what they entail, and figure out paths for them to get there together. Expecting them to do it alone is mean, and teaches them nothing but become bitter when it doesn't happen the delusional way they were told when they were "little". Any kid 8 and over is perfectly capable to understand these things if someone takes the time to explain it to them & teaches them how to properly research something.
Perhaps you need to go re-read your OP.

If that's what you intended to say, you took the long way around and I'm not sure you ever got there. Or if you did it was buried somewhere between your disdain for women who do "men's jobs" or who aren't SAHMs, or parents who overshedule their kids, or don't value the arts or are part of the evil government or the greedy capitalistic American society, or..........
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-04-2016, 04:37 PM
 
32,538 posts, read 29,435,399 times
Reputation: 32248
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhotoProIP View Post
Good for you!

I have no desire to do what men do. I have nothing to prove.
Actually, if you are female and a professional/commercial photographer, you are in a profession that was male-dominated until the 70's when women began making inroads. Few women were able to work as photographers because of sex-based discrimination. Those who did find employment had a VERY tough time in places like news rooms. Even today the number of women working as cinematographers is very, very low.

You're working because of the women who DID have something to prove.

Last edited by DewDropInn; 01-04-2016 at 06:04 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-04-2016, 05:42 PM
 
Location: here
24,483 posts, read 28,837,213 times
Reputation: 31077
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhotoProIP View Post
I didn't say "parents, predict your child's future", I said take/make the time to show them what "future jobs they're interested in" look like. Teach them what they entail, and figure out paths for them to get there together. Expecting them to do it alone is mean, and teaches them nothing but become bitter when it doesn't happen the delusional way they were told when they were "little". Any kid 8 and over is perfectly capable to understand these things if someone takes the time to explain it to them & teaches them how to properly research something.
Quote:
Originally Posted by maciesmom View Post
Perhaps you need to go re-read your OP.

If that's what you intended to say, you took the long way around and I'm not sure you ever got there. Or if you did it was buried somewhere between your disdain for women who do "men's jobs" or who aren't SAHMs, or parents who overshedule their kids, or don't value the arts or are part of the evil government or the greedy capitalistic American society, or..........
Ya, this.

Is this whole rant because you are pissed about your own life choices? It is totally possible to both tell a child they can be anything they want, and teach them the best ways to decide. Giving them positive feedback and allowing them to dream doesn't mean you expect them to figure it all out alone.

Your train of thought has just completely derailed. The connections you are trying to make in your OP and since then don't make any sense at all.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-05-2016, 01:26 AM
 
468 posts, read 483,337 times
Reputation: 516
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhotoProIP View Post
LOL!

So if I told you I "badly" want to pay my mortgage out of my photography services, (because that's where my skills/talent & education is), does that mean you'll finally understand the importance of a good photo and pay me???? Pffff OK! I'll go to my next client and tell them that I really badly want to photograph their property and see what they say! (Or watch them laugh in my face while they show me their camera is more expensive than mine!)

Wanting something "bad enough" & having the available/disposable income to advertise it are two very different things. You forget that nothing is free.
I feel like I've quoted this anecdote once before on C-D and if so apologize, but agreed that it is difficult to be "a creative" nowadays. A friend, for example, has attributed this story to Harlan Ellison, who said once upon a time in the 50s, he was able to pay his NYC rent from selling one short story a month.

Now, we're lucky to even have any market for the short stories.

Now, the market is choked with self-publishing, well-meaning but glaringly unpolished, or in some cases next to illiterate, people pushing their CreateSpace ebooks on Amazon, to the point where they sometimes drown out the search results of professional writers whose output is worthy of the name. It is surprising when we find ourselves with a runaway success like Harry Potter and Hunger Games, with so many options diluting the eyeball pool. I've seen many a blogger who stinks on WordPress and the like, but then again, I've also seen people whose work I would read, whose posts, reviews, etc., have gone 6-7 years without accumulating a comment. Ditto in respect of the same types of free/tip jar bloggers further devaluing the Internet-ravaged corpse of journalism. Then they also say people can't make "dot-com money" anymore, so one does wonder why the economy is Internet-based, lol.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-05-2016, 10:53 PM
 
Location: Eastern Shore of Maryland
5,941 posts, read 2,510,000 times
Reputation: 5609
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhotoProIP View Post
That's the biggest propaganda ever!


Talent is NOT learned. Sorry. That's a huge misconception.

SKILLS are learned traits.

There is no such thing as talent. Its all learned. The old saying that "I am not talented" is nothing more than a cop out for a quitter who doesn't want to put in the work required.


Or you had Parents that told them they can't do anythings they want. .


Skills, is all there is. The better your skills, the more "Talent" people say you have, which is a lie. Your mind may be sharper, and you may learn faster, but in the end, its all skills your learning.


Failure is a self fulfilled prophesy. If you think you will fail, more than likely you will.


If one failed to achieve their goals, in lets say, Photography, its not likely they failed in taking pictures, using the equipment improperly. More than likely, the failure was a direction they chose, if any, and no marketing plan.

Last edited by Boris347; 01-05-2016 at 11:13 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-05-2016, 11:09 PM
 
Location: Eastern Shore of Maryland
5,941 posts, read 2,510,000 times
Reputation: 5609
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhotoProIP View Post
Sadly, I don't photograph people/weddings where that "word of mouth" thing works.
I'm a commercial photographer, and we need to spend a lot of money to advertise where it matters.
Plus, we deal with "supply & demand" more than a tailboard engineer does.


I am very good at what I do.

Sort of like being a "For Hire" Aircraft Technician, but you only change Propellers. What kind of plan told you that would be the most lucrative direction, with constant demand?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-06-2016, 04:21 AM
 
4,586 posts, read 4,430,688 times
Reputation: 4341
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boris347 View Post
There is no such thing as talent. Its all learned. The old saying that "I am not talented" is nothing more than a cop out for a quitter who doesn't want to put in the work required.


Or you had Parents that told them they can't do anythings they want. .


Skills, is all there is. The better your skills, the more "Talent" people say you have, which is a lie. Your mind may be sharper, and you may learn faster, but in the end, its all skills your learning.


Failure is a self fulfilled prophesy. If you think you will fail, more than likely you will.


If one failed to achieve their goals, in lets say, Photography, its not likely they failed in taking pictures, using the equipment improperly. More than likely, the failure was a direction they chose, if any, and no marketing plan.
Fully disagree. I have ballet, photography, painting, sculpting as first hand examples where you can clearly see someone who has a "natural" ability to do them versus someone who tried to do them by teaching themselves. Not everyone can be a ballet dancer, or a cello player. Teaching one self how to play cello and actually having a natural ability to do it are two different things. We'll have to agree to disagree because in my over 40 years I have seen examples of this galore. Remember, I didn't spend my life in accounting and math fields, or retail of any sort. I actually spent my life amongst people with artistic abilities.

A "marketing" plan by itself does nothing for anyone. Please do go to an SBA "volunteer" and tell them you want help making a "marketing plan for a "photography" business that strictly depends on sending out fancy advertising materials and hope for the best!" See how far you go before they kick you out the door for wasting their time. Photography is a business, and as with any business it requires capital. I was fine in Miami, it all went downhill after the market crashed and we moved to Tampa for a promotion for my husband...Here, no marketing plan will make what I do work in the sense of providing an yearly income, because the "clients" are simply not here. AND there is an insane degree of nepotism going around too. Try convincing a daddy builder to use me instead of his precious daughter! Good Luck. Being on one income doesn't allow me to go "further my education" either into some other work field, and as you know no one is looking to hire a 40 something as "entry level". We're not in a position to assimilate such debt. We have kids. My "work" life is gone bye bye.

Like I said in the original post, life is about circumstance and opportunity and neither is on my side at the moment. You can't make people pay you if they don't want to. I can't pay for anything working for free which is what I am constantly asked to do. "But X did it for us for free"! "We don't have a budget for photography! But we love your work!" No "marketing" plan will make this person pay for my services. It is what it is. I already given up. I am not Don Quijote.

Do you know that we photographers who are pro's have to have insurance? Which isn't free. Be part of associations that cost $300 a year; have travel costs, equipment costs, advertising costs, because no one will print anything for free either, I have a whole list of things that "we" have to pay for, so when people refuse to pay us, and rather settle for horrendous imagery instead, there isn't anything we can do. It costs $1000 to have an "agent", and more money on top of that for those of us specialized in various genre's like food photography, product etc. Nothing is free for us. In Tampa no one wants to pay for our work. There are three photogs who are in their 60's who have a strong hold of the market I'm in, and for me to break into that I'll need to be available each time my clients meet, which is impossible for me as I don't have baby sitters to watch my kids so I can go out and "market". Trust me...I've flipped this coin on all sorts of ways and it ain't working. Being a business owner costs a lot of money which we don't have right now.

The point of my post was that I wish people stopped feeding children this fluffy BS with "you can be anything you want" and instead, offer a real guidance and show them what it is like to BE in whatever field they think they want to be in. NOT by dissuading them, or demeaning whatever field they're interested in, but by teaching them what that field entails so they can make educated decision about it. You the adult should be more than capable to do a Google search if you're not familiar with the field and help them out, not expect them to "fail" first and learn later. That is a stupid waste of time. To think people pay thousands of dollars for certain degrees and then end up working for minimum wages is ridiculous. It's wrong, and it shouldn't happen. These people are trapped now; they have to pay those loans back, which is very hard out of a shameful wage, and it means their whole life is pushed back. They can't travel anywhere, because working a low wage job doesn't allow for that, and they're just wasting their lives, when it all could have been easily avoided by just offering some guidance early on.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Parenting
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top