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Old 01-03-2016, 02:57 PM
 
13,975 posts, read 25,820,403 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhotoProIP View Post
I disagree; it's a very dismissive phrase. It says: "I have no time/desire(or knowledge/discovered Google) enough to want to help you make an educated decision about the field of work you'll have to get up for every single morning." This phrase expects the kids, to make that decision, while MOST aren't prepared to make such decisions. Seriously, read the work & employment forum. It's eye opening.

I don't need to look in the mirror, as I don't live by that phrase, nor will I ever tell that to my kids. No one ever said that to me while I was growing up, which turned out to be a good thing actually.

"Working hard" is not related with becoming "anything you want to be". One has to work regardless, (what's the other choice here? Not working, being homeless?) And also remember that working hard and be treated like crap by employers completely kills the "want to work hard" idea all together, and sours many who hoped to work in their fields of choice="anything they wanted to be".

This does not apply in America where companies can go under, or fire people for no apparent reason. Remember the death of unions? Remember "right to work" BS? You HAVE to be an accountant(or some other financial job) if you want to make ends meet. Wen was the last time you paid your mortgage out of photography for example? Please show me how many floor employees at Walmart make ends meet? They work, hard annoying long hours, and deal with horrible bosses and are paid nothing...I am sure those people were told they too can be anything they want when they grow up too.


We'll have to agree to disagree.
Are you a native born American? You have a decidedly anti-US view.

But, it isn't a parent's job to tell their children what career they'll go for. It's a parent's job to make sure they leave those doors open, and let the child figure out which threshold to cross. We provide education and encouragement, they provide the will to succeed.
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Old 01-03-2016, 03:03 PM
 
1,615 posts, read 1,629,299 times
Reputation: 2714
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattie View Post
Are you a native born American? You have a decidedly anti-US view.

But, it isn't a parent's job to tell their children what career they'll go for. It's a parent's job to make sure they leave those doors open, and let the child figure out which threshold to cross. We provide education and encouragement, they provide the will to succeed.
Your post Mattie was short and to the point. Kids can determine what course to take somewhere in high school and don't follow what mommy and daddy decided for them. That's what gets them to leave the nest and succeed.
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Old 01-03-2016, 03:25 PM
 
Location: Central IL
20,726 posts, read 16,192,675 times
Reputation: 50367
Quote:
Originally Posted by luv my dayton View Post
Your post Mattie was short and to the point. Kids can determine what course to take somewhere in high school and don't follow what mommy and daddy decided for them. That's what gets them to leave the nest and succeed.
No - parents should help their kids set realistic goals based on their skills, likes, and the money willing to be spent on education, etc.

We've wound up with kids owing 10's of thousands of dollars for an undergraduate degree that they don't even know what they can do with! Sometimes a fine arts degree, or sociology, etc. Those are wonderful degrees, but won't get you much money unless you go further with your education. Yet they're competing for little above minimum wage jobs with a huge debt load.

SHOULD SOMEONE HAVE GIVEN THEM A CLUE? Like , you can do what you want but be aware that there are few jobs out there that you're qualified for that will help you pay off this loan before you need to start saving for a home and retirement? No - we just hand them a magic wand to wave...

You don't have to CRUSH your kids but you owe them a dose of reality...else they may land back on your doorstep when you're trying to retire.
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Old 01-03-2016, 03:33 PM
 
Location: Central IL
20,726 posts, read 16,192,675 times
Reputation: 50367
Quote:
Originally Posted by ss20ts View Post
No one said anything about encouraging a child who wants to turn into a unicorn. And YES there have been pro basketball players who are 5'6". Short people have skills just as tall people do. By steering people away from their dreams, you are killing their dreams...creating resentment....being a jerk....why does it hurt to have a dream? What's it to you?
Apparently you've not been to the Work and Employment forum where there are currently several threads from college grads who have't a clue what they want to do with their very expensive degree. Don't just give them platitudes "you can be the king of Siam if you just try hard enough" - help them do some REAL research on the world of work...and the skills/education needed to succeed.

Oh - here's something about the shortest basketball players...almost as rare as a 5'6" ballerina...
"This is a complete listing of the shortest players in National Basketball Association history at a listed height of 5 feet, 9 inches or shorter. Only 24 players in NBA history have been at a listed height of 5 feet, 9 inches or shorter.[1] Two are currently active. The shortest player and only player at this height to be inducted into the Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame is Calvin Murphy, at 5 feet, 9 inches. With one exception, Dino Martin (a forward), all of the players listed here have played or play the position of point guard.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...iation_history

I wouldn't stop my 5'6" kid from trying to be a pro basketballer, but I'd sure as hell tell him what he's up against!
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Old 01-03-2016, 03:44 PM
 
13,975 posts, read 25,820,403 times
Reputation: 39851
Quote:
Originally Posted by reneeh63 View Post
No - parents should help their kids set realistic goals based on their skills, likes, and the money willing to be spent on education, etc.

We've wound up with kids owing 10's of thousands of dollars for an undergraduate degree that they don't even know what they can do with! Sometimes a fine arts degree, or sociology, etc. Those are wonderful degrees, but won't get you much money unless you go further with your education. Yet they're competing for little above minimum wage jobs with a huge debt load.

SHOULD SOMEONE HAVE GIVEN THEM A CLUE? Like , you can do what you want but be aware that there are few jobs out there that you're qualified for that will help you pay off this loan before you need to start saving for a home and retirement? No - we just hand them a magic wand to wave...

You don't have to CRUSH your kids but you owe them a dose of reality...else they may land back on your doorstep when you're trying to retire.
Funds available for education? Sure. But, I only have a cursory understanding of what it is my kids even do these days. One is involved in medical research, another is studying genetics, and a third works with manufacturing transmissions, NOT the type that go in cars (although those aren't exactly my forte either).

If we had told any of them which direction to go in, they would be in sales management, that's what we know.

Our youngest was turned down by his three first choice colleges. Because they were his choices, not ours, we didn't commiserate with his disappointment, we told him #4 was an excellent school. And it was. Since it was his will to succeed, he parlayed that degree into a fully funded PhD program, at Stanford.

We had no input in their higher education beyond what we could afford. They are happy with their choices. They are successful. My kids aren't special, they've just been allowed to choose their own paths. How many posters come onto C-D complaining that they got a degree in a field they had no interest in, just to make their parents happy? (A lot!).
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Old 01-03-2016, 03:58 PM
 
Location: Central IL
20,726 posts, read 16,192,675 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattie View Post
Funds available for education? Sure. But, I only have a cursory understanding of what it is my kids even do these days. One is involved in medical research, another is studying genetics, and a third works with manufacturing transmissions, NOT the type that go in cars (although those aren't exactly my forte either).

If we had told any of them which direction to go in, they would be in sales management, that's what we know.

Our youngest was turned down by his three first choice colleges. Because they were his choices, not ours, we didn't commiserate with his disappointment, we told him #4 was an excellent school. And it was. Since it was his will to succeed, he parlayed that degree into a fully funded PhD program, at Stanford.

We had no input in their higher education beyond what we could afford. They are happy with their choices. They are successful. My kids aren't special, they've just been allowed to choose their own paths. How many posters come onto C-D complaining that they got a degree in a field they had no interest in, just to make their parents happy? (A lot!).
The middle road is best...don't tell them they have to be a lawyer or else...and don't feed into magical thinking. Don't be afraid to point your kids to information that will help them. It sounds similar to parents who don't talk to kids about "the birds and the bees" for fear of pushing them into something. I'd start talking about vocational choices in junior high, not graduate school...
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Old 01-03-2016, 05:41 PM
 
Location: here
24,873 posts, read 36,020,612 times
Reputation: 32725
My son just asked me where Harvard is. I showed him on a map, and asked why. He said "because it's a good school..." This kid is about a B/C student in the last couple years of elementary school. He likely has a learning disability. Let's just say school is a challenge for him.

I had 2 options. Say "There is no way you'll ever get into Harvard." or say what I said, "If you want to go to Harvard, you're going to need better grades than you've been getting lately." Both are true. One builds up. One tears down.
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Old 01-03-2016, 06:02 PM
 
13,975 posts, read 25,820,403 times
Reputation: 39851
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kibbiekat View Post
My son just asked me where Harvard is. I showed him on a map, and asked why. He said "because it's a good school..." This kid is about a B/C student in the last couple years of elementary school. He likely has a learning disability. Let's just say school is a challenge for him.

I had 2 options. Say "There is no way you'll ever get into Harvard." or say what I said, "If you want to go to Harvard, you're going to need better grades than you've been getting lately." Both are true. One builds up. One tears down.
Exactly. Why would any parent choose option #2?
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Old 01-03-2016, 07:27 PM
 
Location: Somewhere in America
15,479 posts, read 15,505,565 times
Reputation: 28452
Quote:
Originally Posted by reneeh63 View Post
Apparently you've not been to the Work and Employment forum where there are currently several threads from college grads who have't a clue what they want to do with their very expensive degree. Don't just give them platitudes "you can be the king of Siam if you just try hard enough" - help them do some REAL research on the world of work...and the skills/education needed to succeed.

Oh - here's something about the shortest basketball players...almost as rare as a 5'6" ballerina...
"This is a complete listing of the shortest players in National Basketball Association history at a listed height of 5 feet, 9 inches or shorter. Only 24 players in NBA history have been at a listed height of 5 feet, 9 inches or shorter.[1] Two are currently active. The shortest player and only player at this height to be inducted into the Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame is Calvin Murphy, at 5 feet, 9 inches. With one exception, Dino Martin (a forward), all of the players listed here have played or play the position of point guard.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...iation_history

I wouldn't stop my 5'6" kid from trying to be a pro basketballer, but I'd sure as hell tell him what he's up against!
Do you realize that people have been going into major debt for a college education for decades? This isn't anything new! I live in a town with an extremely expensive liberal arts college. Plenty of kids get their degree in philosophy.....somehow they figure out what they want to do in life and figure it out.

And yes you CAN do anything you want if you're willing to work for it. Look at Kate Middleton! She went to college with a purpose and she's a freaking princess now! Misty Copeland was told she was crazy and it would never happen....yeah well it DID happen. She worked her butt off and can tell people you to bugger off. Dream crusher! Sounds like you grew up with soul sucking, dream crushing parents.

So only 24 players have been under 5'9". Those are 24 men who were determined to make it happen. Kudos to them for not listening to dream suckers like you! What should they have done instead? Become history teachers? Sell oxygen tanks? If they're happy, what's it to you?
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Old 01-03-2016, 07:59 PM
 
Location: Central IL
20,726 posts, read 16,192,675 times
Reputation: 50367
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kibbiekat View Post
My son just asked me where Harvard is. I showed him on a map, and asked why. He said "because it's a good school..." This kid is about a B/C student in the last couple years of elementary school. He likely has a learning disability. Let's just say school is a challenge for him.

I had 2 options. Say "There is no way you'll ever get into Harvard." or say what I said, "If you want to go to Harvard, you're going to need better grades than you've been getting lately." Both are true. One builds up. One tears down.
Good for you! You told it to him straight that he would need better grades - that's being realistic. So much better than "Of course you can do it - you can do ANYTHING!" (with the subtext possibly, "you don't need to do anything special to get in").
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