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Old 02-19-2016, 08:46 AM
 
15,745 posts, read 13,176,204 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marlow View Post
I learned when my daughter was young that if my husband took on a task, to let him do it however he wanted. When she was young, like 4 to 9 or so, he used to take her shopping for clothes and shoes. They came home with things I never would have chosen, but so what? He's a parent and can do parental things.
.
Good points and a hard lesson for me to learn and one I still work on. His clean is not my clean but it is still clean.
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Old 02-19-2016, 08:54 AM
 
Location: The Hall of Justice
25,907 posts, read 34,989,441 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marlow View Post
I learned when my daughter was young that if my husband took on a task, to let him do it however he wanted. When she was young, like 4 to 9 or so, he used to take her shopping for clothes and shoes. They came home with things I never would have chosen, but so what? He's a parent and can do parental things.

Agree about the woman in the article not being a typical family. She said a couple of times in the article that no one knew she was pregnant, presumably because she works from home. I thought that was especially odd. I don't know of anyone who has hidden a pregnancy in order to further her career. Her life would have been much better if she had announced her pregnancy and told everyone she'd be gone for a few weeks and then shut her computer down.

And I also didn't get staying in the peed-in pants and the bag of dirty diapers in the bedroom. It would have taken less than a minute to fix either of those problems. Much less time than it took her to write the article.
She sounds overwhelmed and hopeless. Exhaustion and some post-partum depression, I bet. She's "trying to do" it all, not "having" it all. Maudlin humor is her coping mechanism.
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Old 02-19-2016, 09:09 AM
 
15,192 posts, read 16,049,554 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustJulia View Post
She sounds overwhelmed and hopeless. Exhaustion and some post-partum depression, I bet. She's "trying to do" it all, not "having" it all. Maudlin humor is her coping mechanism.
Agreed.
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Old 02-19-2016, 10:09 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
16,488 posts, read 15,923,785 times
Reputation: 38807
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marlow View Post
...
Agree about the woman in the article not being a typical family. She said a couple of times in the article that no one knew she was pregnant, presumably because she works from home. I thought that was especially odd. I don't know of anyone who has hidden a pregnancy in order to further her career. Her life would have been much better if she had announced her pregnancy and told everyone she'd be gone for a few weeks and then shut her computer down.

I agree.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marlow View Post
And I also didn't get staying in the peed-in pants and the bag of dirty diapers in the bedroom. It would have taken less than a minute to fix either of those problems. Much less time than it took her to write the article.

I agree, too
Quote:
Originally Posted by JustJulia View Post
Her husband also has this choice. He can also take the dirty diapers out, presumably.
I also wondered about that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JustJulia View Post
She sounds overwhelmed and hopeless. Exhaustion and some post-partum depression, I bet. She's "trying to do" it all, not "having" it all. Maudlin humor is her coping mechanism.
Good points.
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Old 02-19-2016, 10:17 AM
 
2,512 posts, read 1,285,890 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marlow View Post
I'm approximately your same age--54--and I understand what you're saying, although I don't agree with all of it. First, I don't hear women our age talking about being duped. I work full-time and most of my friends are working mothers. I've never heard a single one of them complain about trying to "have it all." As far as men never saying they wanted it all, if they have a wife who WOTH, they are buying into the notion that you can have a two-earner household and successfully raise children. So in a sense, they are participating in the "having it all" concept.

I do not look down on SAHP's at all. I believe they contribute in many ways to a happy household for the children and adults in the house. If a family can afford it and a parent wants to stay home--great. The only reason I waded into this discussion was to respond to very pointed comments that children suffer when both parents WOTH and that a woman who chooses to WOTH is selfish and materialistic.
Thanks for your response. Your reply makes me realize I didn't state my thoughts clearly, because you misunderstood some things. Let me clarify.

1. I also envisioned having a career when I was a child. I wanted to be a journalist from a young age. I even followed family members around with a tape recorder. However, my friends and I envisioned that when we had kids we'd be SAHMs or at least part time workers. I didn't envision a life of juggling a difficult and challenging career and parenting and taking care of a home - and caring for elderly parents -- all simultaneously. It was assumed that once kids were in the picture, the mom would be a SAHM parent at least until the kids were old enough to be latchkey kids after school, and the dad would bring home the paycheck. (Note: I ended not having kids -- so this was all moot.)

My own mother worked part time when I was a smaller child (she did this on weekends) and when I got old enough to be alone she worked during weekdays. However it was not a career that required long hours or caused lots of stress. It didn't pay a lot and it was more about engaging in something she enjoyed.

2. Once we went to college, and seriously started to form a path to the future, we were never made to understand the difficulties involved in being a working parent. The stress, the challenge on marriages (see arguments over division of responsibilities), the enormous cost of child care, the compromises that have to be made as a result of whichever choice you make, etc. Everyone assumed that you'd have a healthy, well functioning kid without special needs or attention required. Careerhood was presented as something that where motherhood could be easily inserted as a simultaneous piece at any time with little muss or fuss. And where being a SAHM would help mitigate some of the above challenges, that option was inferred to be a lesser option for the modern young woman. Remember all the derogatory remarks about someone getting their MRS degree?

At the same time, most guys I knew in my 20s-30s feared being the sole income earner. Where my dad saw it as a source of pride to support a family, guys in my age group absolutely wanted their wives to work, kids or not. So there again, the "choice" was not really a "choice" for women who wanted to be SAHMs but found a smaller pool of men willing to carry the financial load alone.

For those of you who said they don't hear women complaining...that's awesome because it means women are happy --- and happy women = a happy world! I happen to hear a lot of "I never thought my life would be like this..." comments from women in my circles as well as complaining about "husbands who don't pull their weight" (even though the husbands are also involved in taking kids to games, school events etc.)

It might be because most of the women I am talking to about feminism are very intellectual types who overanalyze everything. LOL!
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Old 02-19-2016, 10:22 AM
 
2,540 posts, read 3,302,757 times
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The whole situation of the author just sounds strange.
It seems like she's dug out her own grave with being pretty much in denial about having a baby and trying to treat it as some sort of nuisance that shouldn't interrupt her regular life, out of some misguided sense of perfectionism or major control issues, and that's just stupid. I sincerely doubt that it was her employer or finances or career or anything else that forced her to be back to work next day after giving birth, since no sane employer would require that. It was her own choice, probably trying to prove something to herself and the world, and now she sounds like she wants a medal and a cookie for her heroism.
She's trying to be funny but the undercurrent of the post seems to be 'look at me, everyone, what a special and dedicated and hardworking person I am, back to work even as i pee my pants."

it's just stupid. The same as dragging yourself into work when you're deathly sick, or breaking a leg and then jumping out of the hospital bed to go on a hike before your cast is set. And then being surprised that it's hard, and the world isn't bowing down to your heroism.
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Old 02-19-2016, 10:25 AM
 
Location: Denver area
21,141 posts, read 22,118,386 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilCookie View Post
The whole situation of the author just sounds strange.
It seems like she's dug out her own grave with being pretty much in denial about having a baby and trying to treat it as some sort of nuisance that shouldn't interrupt her regular life, out of some misguided sense of perfectionism or major control issues, and that's just stupid. I sincerely doubt that it was her employer or finances or career or anything else that forced her to be back to work next day after giving birth, since no sane employer would require that. It was her own choice, probably trying to prove something to herself and the world, and now she sounds like she wants a medal and a cookie for her heroism.
She's trying to be funny but the undercurrent of the post seems to be 'look at me, everyone, what a special and dedicated and hardworking person I am, back to work even as i pee my pants."

it's just stupid. The same as dragging yourself into work when you're deathly sick, or breaking a leg and then jumping out of the hospital bed to go on a hike before your cast is set. And then being surprised that it's hard, and the world isn't bowing down to your heroism.
Why on earth would you presume that information (other than her employer not forcing her to be back at work after one day off to give birth- that's a given) - based on what?

Go back and re read. Her income was keeping her husband's business afloat. I'd imagine that is pretty stressful.

Last edited by maciesmom; 02-19-2016 at 10:34 AM..
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Old 02-19-2016, 10:35 AM
 
2,540 posts, read 3,302,757 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maciesmom View Post
Go back and re read. Her income was keeping her husband's business afloat. I'd imagine that is pretty stressful.
I didn't read too carefully. Was she self employed? If not, did her employer really expect her back at work next day after giving birth? Why wasn't there mat leave? Did all the women in her company do the same or was it just her? Why didn't op and her husband plan for what would happen right after having the baby?

If their life really depended on her income to the extent she couldn't miss one day, what would've happened if she had complications at birth and was forced to stay at the hospital, or nicu? Did they not consider that possibility?

I still say the situation sounds weird and that the author is being a martyr.
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Old 02-19-2016, 10:41 AM
 
Location: Denver area
21,141 posts, read 22,118,386 times
Reputation: 35536
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilCookie View Post
I didn't read too carefully. Was she self employed? If not, did her employer really expect her back at work next day after giving birth? Why wasn't there mat leave? Did all the women in her company do the same or was it just her? Why didn't op and her husband plan for what would happen right after having the baby?

If their life really depended on her income to the extent she couldn't miss one day, what would've happened if she had complications at birth and was forced to stay at the hospital, or nicu? Did they not consider that possibility?

I still say the situation sounds weird and that the author is being a martyr.
So you didn't read too carefully, yet you are perfectly willing to make judgements on what her life, her finances etc are and whether her employment is a luxury? What makes something a luxury? Money? Personal satisfaction?

Newsflash -everyone's reality doesn't mimic yours. Your truth isn't true for everyone. There are actually families where the wife/mother is the main income earner! Or their benefit package is much better or consistent or whatever than their husbands. Insurance and retirement are not luxuries.

I have no idea what her finances are - she did mention that she made enough to keep her husband's business afloat. It was near the beginning of the article, not buried somewhere. It appears she works from home. Other than that I don't know, and I won't guess. It's not my business or my concern. Guessing is just a way to try to justify whatever judgement you are projecting.
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Old 02-19-2016, 10:51 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
40,959 posts, read 32,676,353 times
Reputation: 57073
Quote:
Originally Posted by maciesmom View Post
So you didn't read too carefully, yet you are perfectly willing to make judgements on what her life, her finances etc are and whether her employment is a luxury? What makes something a luxury? Money? Personal satisfaction?

Newsflash -everyone's reality doesn't mimic yours. Your truth isn't true for everyone. There are actually families where the wife/mother is the main income earner! Or their benefit package is much better or consistent or whatever than their husbands. Insurance and retirement are not luxuries.

I have no idea what her finances are - she did mention that she made enough to keep her husband's business afloat. It was near the beginning of the article, not buried somewhere. It appears she works from home. Other than that I don't know, and I won't guess. It's not my business or my concern. Guessing is just a way to try to justify whatever judgement you are projecting.
These are legitimate questions:

Quote:
Why didn't op and her husband plan for what would happen right after having the baby?

If their life really depended on her income to the extent she couldn't miss one day, what would've happened if she had complications at birth and was forced to stay at the hospital, or nicu? Did they not consider that possibility?
These are questions not necessarily meant for you to answer, but for readers of the article to ponder, to ask themselves so they don't find themselves sitting in pee pants with a bag of poop diapers over in the corner, snapping shots of their feet while they apparently try to keep the family business from going down the drain a day after giving birth.

By the way, I've bolded the parts of your post that seem overly inflammatory. Why do you feel compelled to make everything so personally insulting? Can't we have a discussion, ask pertinent questions, and maintain some dignity while contemplate and consider all the options - and possible pitfalls - that women today face?
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