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Hi all. Back with an update and some responses to more frequent comments.
After wanting to do it for awhile now, the suggestions in this thread helped give us the extra push we needed to get him sleeping him his own room. It's been 4 nights now in his own room in the crib and results have been mixed.
First night - He was acting very nervous and unsettled. He stayed content in the crib for awhile, but DID not sleep. Mostly just kept looking around. Probably the new environment? Nonetheless, we brought him back to our room.
Second night: Slept 3 hours in the crib on his own, but then wouldn't go back to sleep so into our room.
Third night: ANGRY about the crib. No success at all.
Fourth night. Slept 3 hours in crib, got up but actually went back to sleep after about 40 minutes in the crib for another 2 hours. Woke up again, but was super fussy this time and wouldn't go back in the crib to finish the night. Getting a bit better though.
We'll see how it goes tonight. It seems to be improving but unfortunately it hasn't been a magical solution. I will say though it's been VERY nice for mom and me to have our bedroom back to ourselves. Not having to worry about every little noise we or him makes, and just feeling like we have our space back is very nice. Unfortunately, the sleep is still not great but we're hoping he will keep improving in his own room.
Some other things...
A lot of people mentioned co-sleeping and I forgot to mention that my wife actually started doing this with him around 2 months because she was starting to lose it and while it was not ideal, it definitely helped him fall back asleep when otherwise he would fight and fight and fight. Really though, while it sometimes helped him go back to sleep a bit easier, it does nothing to change the frequency of which he wakes up or how long he sleeps. The big issue is that his night time sleep is usually broken up in multiple increments of 1-3 hour naps, (he's yet to sleep longer than 3.5 hours at night), and the bear of the problem is getting him to go back to sleep for the next round. Here's a typical night:
7-9PM - night time routine (variety of bath, feeding, reading books, music, etc)
9PM-12AM - He sleeps (he's got this one down pretty good)
12-1:30AM - Baby awake for feeding, but then gets angry and won't go back down.
1:30-3:30AM - Sleeps
3:30-5AM - Baby awake AGAIN. Fights the sleep
5-7AM - Sleeps
7AM - up for the day, ready to go till he takes a short 30 minute nap at around 9AM.
So yea, the problem is that he frequently gets up, sometimes more than this. (About a week ago he was getting up every 30-45 minutes all night!), and it's so hard to get him to go back to sleep when we are so exhausted and frustrated. We're trying to stay optimistic though!
Thanks for all the words of encouragement, I really appreciate it! I'll see how the following nights go and hopefully he'll make some more progress in his room on his own!
My older son was like this, actually even worse. We found that as time went on it did get better. And co-sleeping did help a lot in that although he still woke as often he would go back to sleep quicker. Also, I didn't read the whole thread but it would help (if you aren't doing so already) to take turns staying up with the baby, that way you do get a little extra sleep. There probably is nothing wrong with him, some babies sleep through the night right away, some are like your son, most are somewhere in between. I know you've gotten a lot of well meaning advice here, but the hard truth is there really isn't that much you can do, sometimes rockers etc will help a bit but there is no magic cure. What you do need to do is learn how to cope with it (not easy but you can do it). We found that driving our son around got him back to sleep better, the problem was when you tried to take him out of the car seat he would wake up immediately, so we basically took turns driving him around at one point and sitting in the car while the other one got a couple of hours rest. Sounds crazy but it helped us.
Also be very wary of "sleep trainers" who will promise to get your child to sleep better. What they really do is just put the baby down and leave the room and let him scream. You don't have to pay someone to do that for you. Having said that some children do respond to the Ferber method, but most don't and studies have shown it does affect children emotionally in a negative way.
Also be very wary of "sleep trainers" who will promise to get your child to sleep better. What they really do is just put the baby down and leave the room and let him scream. You don't have to pay someone to do that for you. Having said that some children do respond to the Ferber method, but most don't and studies have shown it does affect children emotionally in a negative way.
Since you specifically mentioned Ferber, it is important to point out that the Ferber method is not simply leaving the baby alone in the room to scream himself to sleep.
Not at 3 months old. Most parents do what you do because it is easier on them, but it is not better for the child. A 3 month old doesn't have the brain capacity to "manipulate". Whoever ran your "parenting" class didn't know what they were talking about.
Heck, I was doing this with mine practically from day 1. Now, granted, in terms of how long I'd wait until returning, the time was much less (say 5 minutes rather than 30), but I most certainly was not going to have my arms fall off rocking them to sleep until the end of time. Of course my feedings were on something of a semi-flexible schedule vs "on demand." Regardless, that it was easier on me, oh well--sometimes that's what you do if for no other reason than because if it keeps you from becoming so tired that you make a mistake that can lead to awful consequences (forgetting them in the car etc) or because it keeps you from being so tired that you fall asleep at the wheel while driving. I don't see anything wrong with Ferber anyway, but even IF it's inferior to rocking a child to sleep as long as it takes, that's where the saying goes "the perfect is the enemy of the good" (in terms of trying to do everything but tiring yourself out in the process to where you end up messing up things worse as a result).
I don't go for the ideas you hear a lot such as "when I get home from work, I'm tired, but my 3 year old doesn't understand that," as if that settles things and it means you can't rest for a few minutes because the 3 year old doesn't understand that. OH WELL. If I get home from work and I'm tired, I'M TIRED and I will get a few minutes of rest and that's that. Afterwards of course I'll pay much attention to my child, but I'm not required to modify what I do because the child doesn't understand it. To me, the same goes with this, but at the same time, as the Ferber method has you "gradually phase in" the amount of time (and in fact they may well not recommend this course of action from day one), that's how I did it, started out with small 3-5 minute bits of time and extending it as they became older.
I started this program when my kids were babies. It worked absolutely wonderfully and helped to establish routines and a sense of normalcy for me, especially as a first time mom.
In case my other post gets deleted for linking to another forum...
I started this program when my kids were babies. It worked absolutely wonderfully and helped to establish routines and a sense of normalcy for me, especially as a first time mom.
Since you specifically mentioned Ferber, it is important to point out that the Ferber method is not simply leaving the baby alone in the room to scream himself to sleep.
Yes I realize that, I was exaggerating a bit- but it is based on the 'cry it out" principle, most sleep trainers will do some version of that. If you feel the Ferber method is the way you want to go, you don't need to pay someone to do that either.
In case my other post gets deleted for linking to another forum...
I started this program when my kids were babies. It worked absolutely wonderfully and helped to establish routines and a sense of normalcy for me, especially as a first time mom.
I hope this helps OP!!
We read this book, it didn't really help us, but it is worth a read. The thing is that there is no one size fits all. From my experience and from other parents we know, routines in general are good, but you can't be rigid about them, and they don't work that well until the child is somewhat older- but again every child is different, and every family has a different dynamic.
I had three kids in five years and there were about 7 years that I didn't ever get a full night's sleep. One of them would always have me up for some reason or another. The oldest one was 3 before the second was born, but she (the oldest) had night terrors so that caused a lot of not enough sleep nights. The second slept all night but as a toddler had a habit of falling of bed. She didn't wake up but the "thunk" on the floor woke ME up every time. The third as a newborn would stay awake at night and sleep during the day.
Heck, I was doing this with mine practically from day 1. Now, granted, in terms of how long I'd wait until returning, the time was much less (say 5 minutes rather than 30), but I most certainly was not going to have my arms fall off rocking them to sleep until the end of time. Of course my feedings were on something of a semi-flexible schedule vs "on demand." Regardless, that it was easier on me, oh well--sometimes that's what you do if for no other reason than because if it keeps you from becoming so tired that you make a mistake that can lead to awful consequences (forgetting them in the car etc) or because it keeps you from being so tired that you fall asleep at the wheel while driving. I don't see anything wrong with Ferber anyway, but even IF it's inferior to rocking a child to sleep as long as it takes, that's where the saying goes "the perfect is the enemy of the good" (in terms of trying to do everything but tiring yourself out in the process to where you end up messing up things worse as a result).
I don't go for the ideas you hear a lot such as "when I get home from work, I'm tired, but my 3 year old doesn't understand that," as if that settles things and it means you can't rest for a few minutes because the 3 year old doesn't understand that. OH WELL. If I get home from work and I'm tired, I'M TIRED and I will get a few minutes of rest and that's that. Afterwards of course I'll pay much attention to my child, but I'm not required to modify what I do because the child doesn't understand it. To me, the same goes with this, but at the same time, as the Ferber method has you "gradually phase in" the amount of time (and in fact they may well not recommend this course of action from day one), that's how I did it, started out with small 3-5 minute bits of time and extending it as they became older.
Of course you need a break, switching off with your spouse or simply putting the child on the bed and lying near him also gives you that rest without leaving your child. also a rocker can come in handy, I used to lie in bed, look at my phone or read and rock my son with my foot. It helped. Very young babies do need to be fed pretty much "on demand" but as they get older you can establish more of a routine. Ferber himself doesn't advocate using his method on babies under 6 months.
A 3 YO and a 3 month old are like comparing apples and oranges so while I get your analogy, I don't necessarily see that it fits. I found that when my son was 3 and I would come in and he would run to me, just giving him a hug then telling him "daddy needs a minute" worked pretty well. Or my wife would just take him for 5 minutes more and then I was ready to play with him. Now he is 6 and I'm lucky he gets up from the TV to say hi LOL
I'm really late in seeing this post, but I just really feel for you and your wife, OP. At 3 months with my daughter I was at a breaking point as well. I hated life. Or baby was so young that I really remembered life without her and i missed it dearly. I missed sleep so so so much. I was becoming completely unglued.
It really does get better, but it is going to probably be several more months, I'm sorry to say. My baby is 13 months now and usually sleeps through the night. Her naps are still a crap shoot though. But, at least I mostly have my sanity back. I managed to get enough sleep that I was able to buy a business (total career change) and so far I haven't driven it into the ground or anything.
I know exactly how you feel. I still question whether parenthood is really a good fit for me. I don't think our daughter will have any siblings, but that's OK. At least she will be very loved abs that's enough. Babyhood is not for the faint of heart.
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