My 16 year-old son has an online "relationship" with a 40 year-old woman (average, girlfriend)
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This ^^^ is really dismissive and sells parents short.
It's possible to care about your child's well-being, want the best for them and be wary of suspicious situations without it having anything to do with controlling their lives.
If the parents ban him from talking to her, that's controlling his life.
Every person? Certainly not ... you are using an absolute term (every person) in that sentence. Has every person who filed a tax return cheated? Has every spouse lied to their partner? Cheated on them? Of course not. If asking whether some transgressions occur, then the answer clearly becomes yes. The word every leaves no room for exceptions. Modifying your statement I would say it is not unreasonable to assume that some people (likely a very small percentage) who have had a connection with a younger person of the opposite gender may have been predatory or deviant in their desires.
Psychiatrists would refer others to numerous well-documented case studies illustrating that it does happen ... just go to Wikipedia and look at the bewildering list of paraphilias that keep mental health professionals busy. Nobody on this forum can possibly know what is in the mind of this particular 40-year-old woman. Perhaps she is a much younger version of Mother Theresa and, therefore, a person who would receive a resounding stamp of approval from virtually all.
But what if she is not? There is no way to plumb the depths of the human mind to ascertain what her motivation, if any, is. Has she ever had any sexual desire to be with a much younger male? Her history is unknown at this time. For example, there are stories reported regularly of older teachers having inappropriate contact with much younger students. Since the central questions remain unanswerable, the prudent thing for the parents is to be proactive and choose to be cautious.
Let's be honest. The whole point of that big list of illias is to let psychologists pretend their profession is important and justify their bloated salaries. I'm sorry, but we don't need a disorder for every possible interaction: Heck, there's a disorder now for being "unhealthily" eating too much broccoli!
And it's not OK to say, "Oh we don't know her desires, so let's just assume they're terrible!"
Also, having a desire in the past isn't equivalent to being a bad person. Most of us probably want to kick a lot of people's ******* when we get upset, but that doesn't mean we're all serial killers.
I agree with SOON2BNSURPRISE post. As a parent I would want to know EXACTLY what the conversation was between my 16 year old and a 40 year old! I wouldn't care if my 16 year old thought it was intrusive. I'd rather they be mad then something bad happen to them! Do I need to know all details of every conversation they have with their friends? No, but if that friend is an adult, yes! There is nothing appropriate going on here!
Why are parents more trusting of other 16 year olds whose values and judgment are way worse than an adult's? This literally makes no sense. If 16-year olds were such great people, why don't we call them adults too?
But leaving that aside for now, if the 40 year old told you the general topics of what they talked about with the 16-year old and the 16-year old confirmed everything the 40-year old said, would you be OK with the friendship?
Maybe so, but anything that can not be said in front of the family is something that should not be said. Privacy is one thing, secret conversations are totally another thing.
If this standard were true, teenagers could never speak to each other.
I bet you wouldn't be ok with your 16 year old daughter have a 5 hour long middle of the night conversation with a 40 year old man. An adult having a friendship with a teen is one thing, the particulars the OP has described are well past the line of inappropriate contact.
The only particular we have so far that is weird is the 5 hour conversation and I think that is also pretty explainable.
I would not call the cops on that either, unless there was evidence of illegal activity going on and it seemed worth prosecuting. It is not a gender issue, it is an issue of the rights we all have in a democratic society. I'm sorry if you have forgotten that creepy and suspicious does not equal proven illegal. It's the price you pay for democracy - you cannot take a legal action against someone solely for being creepy and inappropriate.
This post is very good.
Sadly, it only represents about 1/5 of the users here.
And we wonder why relations between teenagers and parents are so terrible.
I'm sorry, but I didn't experience the conversation in real time, so I'm catching up.
Then use the multiquote button to reply to multiple posts in one so you don't constantly ping the thread with old posts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by emerald2
I don't like the idea of assuming the worst about someone before even interacting with them. That sounds like a recipe for disaster in ALL of your friendships. A minor, but useful example is a friend oversleeping your lunch plans and then you accusing them of doing it on purpose and it leads to a useless fight, whereas they might have just legitimately overslept. You can still guard against manipulation without putting a timer on your phone conversations.
Generally, when people ask me about that topic, my advice is to assess how your life was before and after the new person entered your life. If it's the same or better, the new person's probably good for you. If it's worse, then the new person might be good for you, but you should be more analytical. You might also be doing something to make your life worse, but it at least lets you focus in on the possible damage area. But you don't have to be arbitrarily private to guard against manipulation. AT SOME POINT, the manipulator has to convince you that your best friends really hate you and that you shouldn't talk to them anymore. Otherwise, they can't manipulate you. So if you only stay vigilant of that, in 99.99% of cases, you can avoid being manipulated.
None of that ^^^ equivocation is relevant because there ARE some situations where the most basic circumstances of the "relationship" are deal-breakers that make it harmful. You're speaking as if this is a mutually healthy and beneficial adult relationship when it is NOT.
Quote:
Originally Posted by emerald2
Now you say the woman took advantage of his weak boundaries. But yet we know nothing about the situation, other than their age gap is big and they talk a lot on the phone. HOW can you possibly use that as a proof to indict anything? You say "2 years close to legal" doesn't matter, but then think that that vague pair of facts is going to get someone arrested?
There seems to be a clear disconnect between what is grounds for persecution on the forum and what actually is breaking the law. And that is really harming your ability to give her good advice.
More ethical obtuseness. Don't be afraid to just say something is WRONG. Again, there is a higher standard for right and wrong than just "what is legal." I don't care what they were talking about, although her comment about "waiting till he's 18" gives a good idea. The big giveaway is that they were HIDING it. Most parents strive to instill decent behavior too, and deception doesn't fall under that category.
I'm guessing you're not a parent, about 22 years old?
I'm not talking about what's going on between these two. I'm talking about a general statement that "Anything that a kid is saying to a friend better be something that can be said in front of the parents." The poster was not specifying in this case; s/he was saying ever.
Why do you need to know all the details of every conversation with a kid's adult friend? Lots of kids become friends with coaches, youth directors, etc and talk to them about personal stuff.
So Katarina, is your primary issue that the relationship began online?
Personally, I am wary of those too, but if you stay involved, I think it should be fine.
If he wanted to talk for hours on the phone and hang out with a female youth director, would you be OK with that?
My rule would be you can hang out with her, but it has to be in a group. If they want to be friends, they should know each other's friends anyway.
If they are such terrible incompatible matches for each other as many in the conversation have stated, they won't mesh with each other's friends and the friendship will die a natural death instead of getting enhanced by the power struggle.
Then use the multiquote button to reply to multiple posts in one so you don't constantly ping the thread with old posts.
None of that ^^^ equivocation is relevant because there ARE some situations where the most basic circumstances of the "relationship" are deal-breakers that make it harmful. You're speaking as if this is a mutually healthy and beneficial adult relationship when it is NOT.
More ethical obtuseness. Don't be afraid to just say something is WRONG. Again, there is a higher standard for right and wrong than just "what is legal." I don't care what they were talking about, although her comment about "waiting till he's 18" gives a good idea. The big giveaway is that they were HIDING it. Most parents strive to instill decent behavior too, and deception doesn't fall under that category.
I'm guessing you're not a parent, about 22 years old?
Maybe she just doesn't want to deal with people like you? I do agree that it's a bit of a cop-out, but not everyone cares as much as we do.
So if the son just talked to her on the phone for hours in front of the parents, would you be OK with it then?
No, but harassing is and any 40 year old that wants to talk online for hours or over the phone IMO is harassing the youth. There is NO reason why a 40 year old woman should be calling and talking to a 16 yr old boy for 5 hours, talking online and texting him. PLUS, telling the boy her problems about how she's getting a divorce. And I find it hard to believe that anyone would think it's ok!
Wasn't it the son who made the calls?
How do you say it's harrassment when he's initiating?
I think it's OK, so don't speak for me.
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The big giveaway is that they were HIDING it. Most parents strive to instill decent behavior too, and deception doesn't fall under that category.