Do grown males oggle girls where you live? (children, 15 yr old, natural)

[cpg35223]

Case in point. I went to the grocery store the other day, and saw a 13-year-old girl wearing a tank top that had "Tasty" spelled out in sequins across the front.

Somebody please tell me what parent in their right mind not only allowed her to wear that, but allowed that shirt in the house in the first place.

[gladimnotyounganymore]

Originally Posted by Lindsey_Mcfarren

Once again your giving the man a pass, he shouldn't HAVE to control himself because the female is dressing provocatively. THATS BS.
Men should be expected to behave appropriately even if someone is walking down the street buck naked.

As a woman who dressed provocatively as a teen and then thought it was "cool" when guys would honk or whistle...well let's just say I'm glad I'm still here to tell the tale about what a little **** I acted like. My mom bitched about how I dressed, yet she really never did anything about it. Men should behave appropriately, that's true, but what about the girls? Everyone needs to take responsibility for controlling their behavior, including the girls. Why are they dressing to attract attention and then crying foul when they get it? A young girl or her mother today almost has no choice but to buy slutty looking clothes because it seems that's all the stores carry, but everyone has to use common sense. They won't make it if no one buys it.

As for men ogling, I don't notice it as much where I live, at least not blatantly like that. there seems to be a high Christian presence here...could that be it? Maybe I'm not paying that much attention and it's happening all over the place. I notice my husband does it. When we were in our 20s he used to do it a lot more and I used to confront him about it...now when I see him do it I'm just disgusted and disappointed.

[mari4him]

Originally Posted by Lt. Dan

Sounds like a bunch of MALE HATERS to me. But they are right! A bunch of pigs we are! us men would NEVER know right from wrong unless some whining woman told us. Geeesh!

I haven't thoroughly read all the newer posts but I find your posts a bit on the defensive side. Once again, I don't think anyone here is saying they are male haters. In fact most here are married to a man or have son's and all probably have had a father or father figure, so that is not the case. What most are saying is that SOME men, which is a fact, take admiration of a female's beauty to an unhealthy level.

Whether you want to believe it or not, there are grown men out there that do not really give a darn if the girl is 10, 15, 20, 25 etc... dressed modestly or dressed seductively, they stare, they oggle and they basically disrobe the female with their "glance" which is not really a glance to begin with.

Admiration of a female's beauty is one thing. Oggling is a whole other matter and that is what this thread is about. Not about male bashing or the simple glance a male may give.

You explain why with the majority of child predators and pedophiles being male's, we as mother's or father's should not be up in arms when some grown man is staring down our daughters.

I personally DO NOT believe that ALL men are pigs. I do however believe that there are definately SOME pigs out there (male and female) and to be blind to that is just beyond me. Yes girls should dress appropriately and all that stuff but there is also such a thing as personal accountability, responsibility, integrity, morals, values, etc. No one, male or female, is nothing more than a body but each is a human being that should be treated or viewed in a respectful manner.

I know there are some males out there that do understand this and get equally as upset about this as women/mother's do. However, for those that do not appreciate what there is to get upset about when this happens, I wonder how they would feel if no matter what they were wearing they were viewed as nothing more than a sex object by the female population. Or if it was their son's that were being oggled by a grown male or female. Somehow it is as it is almost acceptable to those that do not grab the idea that this is wrong, that girls be stared at in this fashion or that it is somehow always the girls fault because she should be covered from head to toe, lest any skin shows at all. Even then, there are those that will still oggle imagining what is under all that clothing.

There are perverse people in the world that are attracted to young children. That is a fact, just look up the National Sex Offenders Website and the proof is all right there.

[FLhereIcome]

All the time... but I don't think it's anything new. Men are men, they can't help themselves. Growing up I looked much older than I was, but I did dress modestly. I never let anything hang out and I was still oggled. I also remember my mother giving the "death stare" many times. I always felt embarrassed when she did it, but now it's my turn! My girls dress modestly, but they also look older than they are and are well-endowed. So now I give the "death stare" and ask what are you looking at? It doesn't embarrass them in the least because men have oggled me and they both give the "death stare" and say stop looking at my mom like that!

[mari4him]

Originally Posted by gladimnotyounganymore

As a woman who dressed provocatively as a teen and then thought it was "cool" when guys would honk or whistle...well let's just say I'm glad I'm still here to tell the tale about what a little **** I acted like. My mom bitched about how I dressed, yet she really never did anything about it. Men should behave appropriately, that's true, but what about the girls? Everyone needs to take responsibility for controlling their behavior, including the girls. Why are they dressing to attract attention and then crying foul when they get it? A young girl or her mother today almost has no choice but to buy slutty looking clothes because it seems that's all the stores carry, but everyone has to use common sense. They won't make it if no one buys it.

As for men ogling, I don't notice it as much where I live, at least not blatantly like that. there seems to be a high Christian presence here...could that be it? Maybe I'm not paying that much attention and it's happening all over the place. I notice my husband does it. When we were in our 20s he used to do it a lot more and I used to confront him about it...now when I see him do it I'm just disgusted and disappointed.

I absolutely agree with you. Everyone, male and female, has to be accountable and responsible for how they carry and portray themselves. I grew up in a family where there were a lot of males and they were raised to respect women. The females where raised to respect themselves and to not provoke males.

My grandfather used to say... don't tell me about the guy that was checking you out because chances are you did not find him attractive because if you had found him attractive I am sure you would not be coming home complaining about it.

This is true. I see it with my own daughter and son. Ohhhh if the boy is cute it doesn't seem to matter much that he hit on her. However, if he is not cute it is a different story. She doesn't mind, and even welcomes, her brother being the protective older brother when she doesn't really like the boy, but if she does like the boy, suddenly her brother is ruining her social life.

I do agree with you so much that it is difficult to find and buy appropriate clothing for teen girls. I've gone to the store's with my 15 (almost 16) year old daughter and had disagreements about clothing to buy because I'll ask "where's the rest of it?". I've had to find a middle ground with her as to what is in style so she doesn't feel like a total geek and out of date/fashion but where I can still feel somewhat (though not always completely) comfortable with what she is wearing. I do however have no qualms about telling her pull that cleavage up, pull that t-shirt down a bit, or that skirt, those shorts have to go they no longer fit you right or even at times have told her to go change because she is not going dressed like that.

Just like it is a repsonsibility to the adult, it is also a responsibility to the child and there is the parental responsibility as well. Though yes, it is getting harder and harder as the trends get skimpier and skimpier. It's really sad. We wonder why there is such a sexual undertone with our young children/tweens/teens, all we have to do is look at how fashion industry sexes them up.

[mari4him]

Originally Posted by FLhereIcome

All the time... but I don't think it's anything new. Men are men, they can't help themselves. Growing up I looked much older than I was, but I did dress modestly. I never let anything hang out and I was still oggled. I also remember my mother giving the "death stare" many times. I always felt embarrassed when she did it, but now it's my turn! My girls dress modestly, but they also look older than they are and are well-endowed. So now I give the "death stare" and ask what are you looking at? It doesn't embarrass them in the least because men have oggled me and they both give the "death stare" and say stop looking at my mom like that!

I just had to giggle at this and respond.... I know exactly what you mean. I have that with my kids. My son is 19 and can be very protective of me and his sister. My daughter is 15 and she doesn't take too kindly to someone oggling me. There was a day that my daughter and I still laugh about when we talk about it. We were at the grocery store doing our weekly shopping and as I turned down an aisle some guy apparently was oggling me. My daughter gave him a look and when he didn't stop staring, she stood in his view blocking it from me, stomped her foot down, hands on her hips and with that look and attitude asked him "yes, did you lose something?". Needless to say the guy went on his way. She and I laugh about this all the time. She later told my fiance about it and they laughed as she told him, "don't worry I got your back" ... LOL.

[johnrex62]

Originally Posted by Lindsey_Mcfarren

I find it amazing that some men out there assume that how a woman is dressed is for men. Thats just not always true. I'm sure there are women out there that do but ALOT of us wear what we want with no sexual undertones to it.

The bathing suit I wear isn't about what men think, its about what I think, what I like, what I think I look good in. I could care less who is looking at me at the beach, I am more concerned about tan lines.

Its a dangerous thing for men or boys to make an assumption they know whats in a woman or girls mind with reference to what they do want or don't want where sex is concerned.

Just exactly why are you concerned about looking good and to whom is it important for you to look good to? Why are tan lines critical if you do not care about being noticed and looked at?

the basic human nature, regardless of how well repressed or justified to one's self is procreation. At some level, conscious or not, we are all thinking about things that increase our odds of successful mating because our brains are hardwired for the survival of the species and us playing our part in that.

As we have 'evolved' and become more self aware and sophisticated, we have somehow decided these survival instincts are undesirable and must be pushed out of lives. Sorry, as much as we would like it just doesn't work that way. To take a line from a movie...Nature finds a way. Even if we refuse to admit it to ourselves we find ourselves doing things that fall perfectly into the category of attracting the opposite sex, even if we say it is for our health, due to peer pressure, the fault of the marketing industry, or whatever.

Like it or not, if you truly did not care who looked at you would also not care how you looked.

[johnrex62]

Originally Posted by darhe3425

Again, as I posted, women in India, DRESSED from head to toe deal with this behavior on the part of men in their country. This is an issue that many men and women will not get unless they experience it personally. This behavior, oggling girls has nothing to do with clothing, but more to do with not being taught the appropriate way to view women/girls which is respectfully by not demonstrating your lower urges by openly staring at every girl.

Consider that the cultural norms are very different there and what is visually normal are not compatible with what is normal here. Porn is said to be perpetually increasing in perversion due to desensitivity among participants. Wouldn't it be equally normal for public modes of dress to create a level of attention based on local norms? What might draw attention in Des Moines may not raise an eyebrow in Los Angeles and vice versa. Why would the "schoolgirl" look be so popular in porno if less clothing is always better?

I agree that a well mannered man is taught better than to stare without regard to the lady's comfort, but that lack of manners is certainly not what caused the rude behavior. It only allowed it to be more easily noticed.

Originally Posted by darhe3425

It is still a misconception that women/girls "invite" wrong attention with the question: "Well, what was she wearing...?" giving no responsibility to the offender, and all to the offended.

Do not confuse wanting attention with wanting action. Those are two very, very different topics. I will still maintain that women want attention and will find a way to get it. The desire for attention and the intent to satisfy the cravings generated by the plays for attention are not mutual and no man in his right mind would assume they were.

Follow the chain of cause and effect to determine why things happen. Women have adopted a mode of dress for a reason. Considering that many of these clothing items are uncomfortable and sometimes even detrimental to their health (shoes, corsets, etc) there must be a pretty compelling underlying motivation. Women have successfully resisted men's attempts to make them like sports for hundreds of generations so I do not think they are weak willed and so susceptible to persuassion as to be at the mercy of the marketing industry unless there is self motivation to be so.

Originally Posted by darhe3425

For example, there is a question of young males wearing sagging pants exposing their underwear and obviously the outline of their butts, Does this turn me on as a grown woman? uh...NO!

Do you really think the young males are trying to attract the grown women, or wouldn't it make more sense they are trying to attract the younger, unattached women? In most cases the females of the species are attracted to the stronger, more aggressive males in the population. A display of rebellion that can go unrepressed is an excellent way of demonstrating aggression and stregnth. Just as women want attention, so do boys. Their subconscious goals are the same but the recptors of those attempts respond differently so then the methods of attracting attention differ.

[Lindsey_Mcfarren]

Originally Posted by gladimnotyounganymore

As a woman who dressed provocatively as a teen and then thought it was "cool" when guys would honk or whistle...well let's just say I'm glad I'm still here to tell the tale about what a little **** I acted like. My mom bitched about how I dressed, yet she really never did anything about it. Men should behave appropriately, that's true, but what about the girls? Everyone needs to take responsibility for controlling their behavior, including the girls. Why are they dressing to attract attention and then crying foul when they get it? A young girl or her mother today almost has no choice but to buy slutty looking clothes because it seems that's all the stores carry, but everyone has to use common sense. They won't make it if no one buys it.

As for men ogling, I don't notice it as much where I live, at least not blatantly like that. there seems to be a high Christian presence here...could that be it? Maybe I'm not paying that much attention and it's happening all over the place. I notice my husband does it. When we were in our 20s he used to do it a lot more and I used to confront him about it...now when I see him do it I'm just disgusted and disappointed.

I dressed my age, my Father was a retired minister and my family was very religious. I simply was not allowed to dress that way. I always found the attention perplexing, I didn't understand sexuality and I didn't understand why they would pay attention to someone my age. Of course I was not really aware of the fact that I didn't look my age.

Originally Posted by FLhereIcome

All the time... but I don't think it's anything new. Men are men, they can't help themselves. Growing up I looked much older than I was, but I did dress modestly. I never let anything hang out and I was still oggled. I also remember my mother giving the "death stare" many times. I always felt embarrassed when she did it, but now it's my turn! My girls dress modestly, but they also look older than they are and are well-endowed. So now I give the "death stare" and ask what are you looking at? It doesn't embarrass them in the least because men have oggled me and they both give the "death stare" and say stop looking at my mom like that!

I disagree, men CAN control themselves, they like to think of themselves as the superior sex but we are supposed to give them a pass on controlling their libido and allow them to wander through life with the morals and control of an alley cat? I disagree and the more people say that, the more they are allowed.

Originally Posted by johnrex62

Just exactly why are you concerned about looking good and to whom is it important for you to look good to? Why are tan lines critical if you do not care about being noticed and looked at?

the basic human nature, regardless of how well repressed or justified to one's self is procreation. At some level, conscious or not, we are all thinking about things that increase our odds of successful mating because our brains are hardwired for the survival of the species and us playing our part in that.

LOL, speak for yourself on that one, I'm not looking for a sucessful mating, maybe your actions are reduced to that but mine aren't.

As we have 'evolved' and become more self aware and sophisticated, we have somehow decided these survival instincts are undesirable and must be pushed out of lives. Sorry, as much as we would like it just doesn't work that way. To take a line from a movie...Nature finds a way. Even if we refuse to admit it to ourselves we find ourselves doing things that fall perfectly into the category of attracting the opposite sex, even if we say it is for our health, due to peer pressure, the fault of the marketing industry, or whatever.

Like it or not, if you truly did not care who looked at you would also not care how you looked.

That has got to be the most inaccurate thing I have seen in writing in some time. I like to look good for myself, as I said before women dress more often to impress others, thats not my opinion but the results of studies. Men prefer to think it all revolves around them and is designed to draw them into our beds, am I the only one who sees how distorted that view is?

[mari4him]

Originally Posted by Lindsey_Mcfarren

That has got to be the most inaccurate thing I have seen in writing in some time. I like to look good for myself, as I said before women dress more often to impress others, thats not my opinion but the results of studies. Men prefer to think it all revolves around them and is designed to draw them into our beds, am I the only one who sees how distorted that view is?

Nope, I agree with you. There are women out there that dress to impress men but many women simply either dress in whatever makes them feel good about themselves (comfort wise, appearance wise, etc) or in some cases it is more of a competitive nature with other females.

I know when my 15 year old dresses she checks herself 20 times, changes every so often because she doesn't like the way it makes her hips look or her stomach or whatever and 9 times out of 10 she is trying to fit in with the female crowd.

Teenage boys rarely critique each other on how the look or what they are wearing but have you ever seen teenage girls together. OH boy.. they can build each other up or rip each other to shreds all over clothing, hair, make-up and downright to shoes, jewelry and purse that they may be using.

My daughter actually prefers her friendships with teenage boys over teenage girls because of this very reason. The intense competition that is always going on in teen girls drives my daughter crazy.