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Old 01-11-2018, 07:10 AM
 
Location: Loudon, TN
4,655 posts, read 4,015,063 times
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Give her 60 days notice to move out and put it in WRITING. Bug her every day about getting a better job to pay for her new apartment when she moves out in 60 days, then say it all again the next day except remind her it's now 59 days, then 58 days, etc. Bug her about it every single day. Remind her every day that she needs to save her money so she'll have enough to pay her rent in 60 days, 59 days, 58 days, etc. Do all this very calmly, and simply as a just a fact about something that's going to happen. She will say to stop bugging her and pitch a fit. Just stay calm and shrug, you're just reminding her after all, not fighting. Then in 60 days if she hasn't moved out put her stuff on the porch.

You have not instilled independence in her in all these years, so a large part of this is your own fault. You've made her life too easy and she will continue to take advantage of that until something changes. While I personally love biology, it's not a field where it's easy to find a good paying job. She will probably end up working in some other industry entirely, as most bio grads do Good luck.
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Old 01-11-2018, 07:22 AM
 
Location: Bloomington, IL
12,520 posts, read 6,627,784 times
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Actually a B.S. in biology, though technically STEM, is not that marketable in and of itself. Unless she has strong stats skills or perhaps a business minor, or plans to go to grad school she's not THAT much better off than a bachelors except the degree was a bit more rigorous to attain. Most people with a B.S. in Biology plan to go to med school...or get a Ph.D.....

Be that as it may - yes, I think you need to give her a very clear deadline to have a job and to move out...otherwise you kick her out. You'll probably have to do that because your past behavior tells her you're a softie and won't follow through, unfortunately for her. So give her another strong set of rules that if she doesn't follow means she's also out...but even if she does, she has to have a job by xx date. At least it's unlikely she can move in with bf's parents and the bf will probably never get his act together enough to get his own place!
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Old 01-11-2018, 07:33 AM
 
Location: Centre of the continent
573 posts, read 197,636 times
Reputation: 2347
Quote:
Originally Posted by confused5596 View Post

I'd like to read others experiences with similar situations and try to do this the right way with the least amount of hurt feelings and conflict.
OP, you need to reframe this discussion. You are not giving her the boot, you're teaching her to spread her wings, to start her "real" life! There should be no conflict, no hurt feelings. She should be excited and waiting to go. This hasn't happened so far. And if you and your wife are fighting about it, and your daughter is stressed and you're stressed... Can't be fun for any of you.

My story: I lived at home later - I was 25 when I left the last time as a repeat boomerang kid. What did it was that my parents moved to a much smaller home where I had little privacy, and they brought up paying rent. Basically they made it less comfortable for me. I took more hours at my crappy low paying job, found a couple of roommates, we found a house to rent, and that was that. I made it work. I don't see it as my parents "throwing me out", they just gave me a nudge and made me think it was my idea to move out. lol They didn`t abandon me, we kept up a close relationship, just from my own house. So there were no hard feelings. Well, maybe except when my dad dropped off my dead car in my driveway, instead of it being in his, and made me deal with it. lol

My daughter is the same age. Lived at home and paid for her own education, her own phone, her own gas/bus pass, socializing, clothing, most of her food while she was here. She couldn't wait to get out, and is now living on her own. The only difference financially is that she`s paying rent - she was already paying everything else for herself. She calls for help every now and then, but is independent. We started teaching her in high school, when she had to pay for her own luxuries (including phone). So I haven't been through what you have. It's too late for you to do what I did now. But I do have other young people in my life who are where your daughter is, and some of the parents have the same frustrations. Some (my brother) love having his 27 year old "kid" at home, or he says he does, so there's that.

I mention the last paragraph for any parents of younger kids who might be reading this. I learned from my parents, maybe others can too.
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Old 01-11-2018, 07:54 AM
 
Location: Central, NJ
2,261 posts, read 4,728,892 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reneeh63 View Post
Actually a B.S. in biology, though technically STEM, is not that marketable in and of itself. Unless she has strong stats skills or perhaps a business minor, or plans to go to grad school she's not THAT much better off than a bachelors except the degree was a bit more rigorous to attain. Most people with a B.S. in Biology plan to go to med school...or get a Ph.D.....
Then I guess it was a REALLY bad idea to quit the job she had before finding another one. Although it sounds like that was handed to her as well so that's probably why she didn't value it.
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Old 01-11-2018, 07:55 AM
 
Location: Central, NJ
2,261 posts, read 4,728,892 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jate88 View Post
I am almost 30. I thought 22 to 44 was appropriate age range for me to be dating.
At 30 you should really be in a different stage of life than a 22 year old.
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Old 01-11-2018, 08:13 AM
Status: "Trying hard to just lurk" (set 27 days ago)
 
8,446 posts, read 8,471,799 times
Reputation: 11746
Quote:
Originally Posted by confused5596 View Post
College is paid for(never had to work), car is paid for, insurance is paid for, cell, health insurance, all expenses other than what she may spend on herself is paid for by me and wife.
Yeah, this may have something to do with why she is the way she is. I hate to say it but when parents say they will foot the bill for their kids while they are in college so they can focus on their grades, I truly think they are hurting them more than helping by giving them a level of comfort in terms of their living situation. That doesn't mean totally abandon them, but they need to have some skin in the game.


It might be too late now, but you need to start the process of cutting off her luxuries. When she realized she can't afford what she wants, it might light the fire under her rear to get her stuff together. Right now, she's getting everything she needs without really needing to put any effort in. She has a huge safety net providing her with comfort. Why change?


I grew up in a household where my dad would tell my dog to get a job. As rough as that sounds, it did shape me and contributes to the successes and comforts I now enjoy today.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Irish Eyes View Post
At 30 you should really be in a different stage of life than a 22 year old.
I would agree. At age 30, I found myself annoyed with 21-26 year olds. Different maturity levels. Age 28-29 or so is a completely different stage in life. Of course, you do find yourself an occasional 30 year old who acts 21.
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Old 01-11-2018, 08:32 AM
 
3,009 posts, read 1,740,515 times
Reputation: 3398
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClaraC View Post
I've seen this happen a lot. I have adult sons, and know a LOT of my friends are in despair because their otherwise successful college educated kids get "stuck". They have a marketable degree and then come home to sit in kind of a fog.

I think partly it's because we as parents made our homes such plush lovely places to be. When I graduated college I would have to be in some dire straits to go back and live with my parents - I just didn't want to. It wasn't a pride in adulthood thing it was I ain't going back THERE to live thing. Not that there was anything wrong with my parents, but geez, who wants to follow their rules like a little kid? I lived in a duplex that was quickly condemned after graduating, because hey, I can afford this and it's my own little ratty home. Where I get to make up the rules.

So anyway, I don't know what to tell you except maybe locate a cheap little efficiency for her and pay rent for 6 months. I would, though, make an appointment for her to get adderall. I really do believe she's in a depression of some kind, and adderall would help. But first get her a drug test so she can be sure she's clean before going to the doc.

I need to clarify - the post ABOVE is the one I agree with, the first two paragraphs especially. ^^^^^^ Rules rules rules. Hated them.

Not the one below, which I didn't see when I posted.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ClaraC View Post
The problem with that, is you look around you and see bums on street corners, and women in shelters with two kids they aren't supporting, and where do they come from?

They come from families who kicked them out when they were somehow no longer functioning their best.

I understand the desire to set a date and change the locks, and we have a fantasy that then the young adults will 'pull themselves up by their bootstraps' and take hold, and in fact, later thank us for giving them the boot.

That happens sometimes, probably.

Mostly, the person becomes more lost. Who knows what is causing her brain chemistry to suddenly get stuck after a successful run at school and college, but that's the fact. And kicking her out will kick her IN to places you'd rather she not be.

If she's a roommate, kick her out and change the locks. If she's your daughter, not so much.
Anyway, I have a few co-workers in a similar situation with even older kids. They leave and come back. Parents pay for everything even now they they are in their 30s. These people continually complain that they are paying a fortune in data charges, "kid" wrecked the car again, etc.

My answer - why are YOU paying for their phone bill? It's obvious not cheaper being on a family plan if they are using all of the shared data. And when they wreck the car, well gee, get a job and buy another.

When I was EIGHTEEN I got a ticket driving a company car. I paid it and forgot about it. My parents insurance went up the next year. I was told I had to get my own policy. Since I was driving to school and work, I didn't have a choice. I was put in a risk pool for 3 years. It SUCKED. But I'm the one that got the ticket, why should my parents have had to pay more for insurance? Welcome to the school of hard knocks.
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Old 01-11-2018, 08:57 AM
 
4,853 posts, read 3,209,873 times
Reputation: 4631
Quote:
Originally Posted by confused5596 View Post
Sorry long rant-

My situation:

Daughter is 23 with a bachelors in bio, graduated with good grades and lived away from home for 4 years.

College is paid for(never had to work), car is paid for, insurance is paid for, cell, health insurance, all expenses other than what she may spend on herself is paid for by me and wife.

Moved back home after graduation and worked at my company briefly, maybe 2 months, said it sucked and left. She then took off 4 months(summer was her excuse) and finally due to our pressure, got a job recently.

She has done minimal in the past 8 months to find employment, maybe sent out 6 resumes and had 1 interview (where she works now). She works as a waitress at a local food place, maybe 10-20 hours on a busy week and takes home minimal money. I think her biggest paying night was $120 for doing a double but usually comes home making an average of maybe $8 an hour.

She doesn't pay rent or any bills, fights with us frequently, dates an older guy(7 years older, divorced with young daughter), who also has minimal money and does nothing to advance himself(works at my company, which is another whole can of worms). They spend a significant amount of time at our house despite us asking her not to or to find someplace else to go. They used to go to his place(he lives with his parents) but she hasn't been there in a while and I'm thinking they got asked not to be there, but just a guess.

She drinks frequently but more of a I'm an adult and can have a beer type of thing and not always hammered or anything although it can get to that point some nights. I disagree with drinking just about every night but do enjoy a few beers on occasion, so I'm not innocent there and have had my share of having a few too many. It's not really the drinking, it's more the lifestyle and the no rush to do anything attitude I think but it's still a sore spot for me.

Wife(retired) and I were/are both hard working professionals and have always had a strong work/success ethic. We have a nice home but nothing extravagant.

The other day, my wife found a big stain on the carpet in her room from a spilled drink and daughter thinks nothing about it, says it will come out. Daughter is supposed to clean her room today but wife is out running errands and I'm at work, we'll see if she did clean her room when we get home. There will be trouble if she did not. I'm sure she'll be peppering for the BF to come over tonight also. All the things that are driving us crazy.

We've laid down the rules multiple times and she may follow them for a while but eventually, it falls back into the same old sloppy, lazy, excuse riddled pattern. Says she needs aderall to focus because she had it in college but lost her prescription due to having thc in her blood work yet she hasn't made a Dr's appointment yet.

On days off, she sleeps til noon, trashes her room, leaves dishes everywhere and when she does have to work, she's always late. This is not a lifestyle I can bear to watch anymore and it is so painful to hear excuse after excuse about how tough it is to find a job. (Very tough when you don't apply). I see plenty of jobs she is qualified for and used to point them out to her but she'd say, I don't want to be stuck at a desk all day or I don't want to do lab work all day or don't want to do this or that. I think the problem is that she'd really prefer to do nothing all day and live at hotel Mom and Dad. I prefer she gets any job(s) until she finds her perfect spot on her own.

She's really a wonderfully bright talented young woman who has a lot of potential and we find it so painful to watch what she is doing. We tell her this frequently(not too frequently) and it usually escalates into a shouting contest about too much pressure, which nobody is happy about. The next day it's blown over and it's back to how it was.

I'm pretty much a softy but I'm really starting to feel that I'm not providing my daughter the guidance she needs to succeed on her own. By guidance, I mean guiding her to the door and making her provide for herself. Seems so harsh but yet seems like the right thing. My wife and I fight frequently about our daughter even though we both have the same opinion of what we feel is going to be the best path but we conflict on timing or feeling we are just being to aggressive with this.

We've had numerous discussions about applying for jobs, planning for the future and have even had some coaching done by well respected business associates about resumes, how to apply and interview for jobs(with suitable jobs openings), all to no avail.

This is my side. I feel mean for wanting her out but also can't take the stress or the crappy I can't/won't do that because it's not my perfect job thing anymore. My wife and I worked where and when we needed to and advanced ourselves along the way and we had our ups and downs but made it to where we are now.

I see so many opinions varying from "let them do what they want" to "pack their bags and change the locks". I've never been in this position before and although I truly believe on already having my mind set as to what I think is the best thing to do, it's very difficult to pull it off.

I'd like to read others experiences with similar situations and try to do this the right way with the least amount of hurt feelings and conflict.
A good start is to stop paying for everything for her.
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Old 01-11-2018, 09:04 AM
 
1,623 posts, read 1,975,330 times
Reputation: 2377
Quote:
Originally Posted by G-fused View Post
Executive Summary needed.
First time poster with an epic story about lazy, living at home, college grad daughter. Oh, and she's dating an older single dad who lives with his parents.
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Old 01-11-2018, 09:25 AM
 
4,722 posts, read 2,074,899 times
Reputation: 4283
Quote:
Originally Posted by confused5596 View Post
Sorry long rant-

My situation:

Daughter is 23 with a bachelors in bio, graduated with good grades and lived away from home for 4 years.

<snipped>

I'd like to read others experiences with similar situations and try to do this the right way with the least amount of hurt feelings and conflict.
One day my son told me that he thought it was time to move out. Different situation, but it wasn't going to happen without a little help. We put him in the car one afternoon and asked him what neighborhoods interested him. We drove around, phoned numbers on apartment vacancy signs, and arranged viewings that afternoon. We looked at several places, and lined up more. He was inexperienced in reading leases and ensuring that the rent was reasonable.

We offered to pay 40% of rent until he completes his studies and/or can fully afford to live independently. He has a copy of my visa for emergencies and uses it monthly. We discuss his expenses, and negotiate repayment of large amounts, such as car insurance. Review the expenses - uber and groceries are okay, bar bill is not.

Rather than tell her that you need to her to move out, tell her that she needs to pick a neighborhood because she's going to get her own apartment. Then schedule a time and take her to look at places until she gets the hang of it. Review leases with her until she understands what is fair, and what is too demanding. Offer to help her with rent for the first six months, or whatever seems reasonable to you. Show her how to buy cheap used stuff like a TV and kitchen table. Turn it from a problem into an adventure. Give her a deadline of three months until she's living independently - specify the date. Don't let her get a room in a shared place - she needs her own place because in a shared place she will not have to take responsibility for bills and upkeep. If the boyfriend stays with her, she'll figure out soon enough that he should be paying half of everything. Break it into baby steps and hold her hand until she gets there. There will be some hard lessons, but better now than later.
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