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Old 04-10-2018, 10:04 AM
 
Location: Cumberland Co., TN
18,547 posts, read 19,498,023 times
Reputation: 19289

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katarina Witt View Post
I suggest you do some actual research on that first statement. I have read a lot over the years in professional journals; many sources say otherwise. It takes some experience to learn how to judge speed of oncoming cars, etc. If I didn't have a lot of work to do this afternoon d/t non-functioning refrigerator and company coming next week who is allergic to cats, meaning I have to vacuum, vacuum, and then vacuum some more (after I clean up the kitchen mess) I'd do some perusing myself.

Yes, accidents are going to happen, but there are certain things one can do to mitigate them, and that includes supervision.

https://www.verywellfamily.com/at-wh...l-alone-620535
Says age 9-11.

https://www.aap.org/en-us/about-the-...hool-Tips.aspx
Also 9-11.

I've read articles that say 10 before they can judge the speed of motor vehicles properly. Going to the store involves more than just walking there, too. It involves carrying money on their person, and carrying the purchases back with the change.
I have seen hundreds of kids in the 9-11 year old age range cross the street, several streets. I have not heard of hundreds of kids in the 9-11 year old age range run over crossing the street.


I will take life experience, logic and common sense over articles written by "child safety experts" whose job it is to tell people the obvious on how to keep their children safe.


Now if you can link studies with actual numbers or studies showing 9-11 year olds actually not being able to cross the average neighborhood street I might be persuaded to think more on it.
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Old 04-10-2018, 12:28 PM
 
9,785 posts, read 5,840,558 times
Reputation: 22338
When I was 7 and my sister was 9ish my mom was away every day, all day for a week at some training thing. She was a SAHM and we weren't used to that at all. My dad wasn't attentive.

We knew where she was so we decided to walk there. It was 2 miles away, crossing busy road and...a freeway! We actually crossed a free way. I guess we could judge the speed of cars.

When we got to my mom she was angry...told us to walk home! LOL. Wow things have changed. She did tell us how to use the underpass which had cross walks and lights. So that's a plus.

Honestly, from 5 and up, we were quite free range and crossed busy streets all the time.

I don't know if I am paranoid...but even though I let my 12 year old son walk a mile and cross a major road (only where a lighted cross walk is), I have him take my cell phone and stalk him on find my phone app. I just don't know if I am paranoid, times have changed that much, or maybe my parents were a bit too free range?

Its really hard to know what to do now.
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Old 04-10-2018, 12:39 PM
Status: "Springtime in the Rockies" (set 19 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
82,794 posts, read 95,258,752 times
Reputation: 29376
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2mares View Post
I have seen hundreds of kids in the 9-11 year old age range cross the street, several streets. I have not heard of hundreds of kids in the 9-11 year old age range run over crossing the street.


I will take life experience, logic and common sense over articles written by "child safety experts" whose job it is to tell people the obvious on how to keep their children safe.


Now if you can link studies with actual numbers or studies showing 9-11 year olds actually not being able to cross the average neighborhood street I might be persuaded to think more on it.
Not that you'll like these, but here: https://now.uiowa.edu/2017/04/why-ch...streets-safely
"The results: Children up to their early teenage years had difficulty consistently crossing the street safely, with accident rates as high as 8 percent with 6-year-olds. Only by age 14 did children navigate street crossing without incident, while 12-year-olds mostly compensated for inferior road-crossing motor skills by choosing bigger gaps in traffic.

“Some people think younger children may be able to perform like adults when crossing the street,” says Jodie Plumert, professor in the UI’s Department of Psychological and Brain Sciences. “Our study shows that’s not necessarily the case on busy roads where traffic doesn’t stop.”"

https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...42698912002544
Very long, dry report. Interesting.

Here's one from Canada:
http://www.parachutecanada.org/downl...port_07:08.pdf
" Child pedestrian injuries are a leading cause of injuryrelated
death for Canadian children aged 14 years
or younger.
• Pedestrian-related injuries contribute almost 15 per cent
of all injury-related deaths of children younger than
14 years.2
• On average, 30 child pedestrians younger than 14 years
are killed and 2,412 are injured every year.3,4
• Children aged 10 to 14 years have the highest risk
of pedestrian injuries and deaths.5,6"

Last edited by Katarina Witt; 04-10-2018 at 12:54 PM..
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Old 04-10-2018, 01:36 PM
 
Location: Cumberland Co., TN
18,547 posts, read 19,498,023 times
Reputation: 19289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katarina Witt View Post
Not that you'll like these, but here: https://now.uiowa.edu/2017/04/why-ch...streets-safely
"The results: Children up to their early teenage years had difficulty consistently crossing the street safely, with accident rates as high as 8 percent with 6-year-olds. Only by age 14 did children navigate street crossing without incident, while 12-year-olds mostly compensated for inferior road-crossing motor skills by choosing bigger gaps in traffic.

“Some people think younger children may be able to perform like adults when crossing the street,” says Jodie Plumert, professor in the UI’s Department of Psychological and Brain Sciences. “Our study shows that’s not necessarily the case on busy roads where traffic doesn’t stop.”"

https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...42698912002544
Very long, dry report. Interesting.

Here's one from Canada:
http://www.parachutecanada.org/downl...port_07:08.pdf
" Child pedestrian injuries are a leading cause of injuryrelated
death for Canadian children aged 14 years
or younger.
• Pedestrian-related injuries contribute almost 15 per cent
of all injury-related deaths of children younger than
14 years.2
• On average, 30 child pedestrians younger than 14 years
are killed and 2,412 are injured every year.3,4
• Children aged 10 to 14 years have the highest risk
of pedestrian injuries and deaths.5,6"

A commonality among your links is busy street, speed, congestion.
I have no doubt that most adults have better skills for judging speed and crossing busy congested streets than do children and the elderly. The studies/statistics I have looked at also say most pedestrian accidents happen other than intersections, in urban areas in the evening/night, on the weekends and to males.
Your forgetting we are talking about allowing your child to walk and go places you are familiar with in your neighborhood using your judgment concerning safety, traffic etc. and the experience and maturity of your child.
By nine most children have been taught safety and are familiar with the area and traffic. Will accidents still happen, of course. If anyone choses to make their choice bases on the statistics that is fine. Individuals should be do what they are comfortable with but they should not try to force others to abide by their opinions.
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Old 04-11-2018, 05:32 PM
 
671 posts, read 557,893 times
Reputation: 947
Got a small infraction for my use of a cuss word apparently. I still think it was because of my largely oppositional stance on social services.

I get that there are accidents, some crime, children requiring extra supervision, orphans of other circumstances that require a child agency but, I still maintain that a major concern for parents is an investigation by social services because of someone nosy. It's a variant of when game nerds get salty at an opponent and call in a BS police report (sometimes called swatting). So anything that reduces the capacity of social services to forcefully impose themselves in people's lives is welcome.

...I was around a park about 2 years ago eating Taco Bell on a bench. I saw a mom and her daughter. The daughter was like 12 feet away. Some brutish black woman went up to the kid asking loudly "where's your mama?" The kid got scared and ran to her mommy, which took all of 2 seconds. The black woman approached the mother (a smaller woman) in a very gruff manner talking about calling social services. It was at this point I started recording (it's a public place) while eating. The mother was almost crying saying her daughter was right there. Then the father rolls up saying, rightfully, you don't need to be talking to yer like this. The black woman goes back to a posse of some sort about 100 ft away.

They start rolling up. I call the cops but, there are some cops already walking up. The posse disperses and the woman tells the cops about how the mother is bad and needs social services. I pull one cop aside show the video. The black woman gets arrested and I ask the cop, hey I know it shouldn't be my business but social services ain't gonna involved, right?. The cop said they wouldn't call, no because of the video and, they logged it in the report.

I don't know exactly where I was going with this except for, I'm glad I had the courage to intervene and ensure the bad experience for this family wasn't made worse by the lies of people who had no intent but to bully someone and, I can say that having seen the whole altercation from start to finish.
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