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Old 10-21-2018, 08:34 AM
 
Location: The Triad (NC)
27,264 posts, read 59,169,522 times
Reputation: 30026

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Getting away from the OP's specific situation...
If you know an adult who would be considered a loser...

How often in their early life did the signs show up?
I have a teacher friend who asserts it can be seen by the end of 3rd grade
with very few kids changing much later on.

And/or at what point did the signs begin to change?
They have a similar opinion regarding the end of 8th grade

(when academic vs vocational aspirations should be sorted (or not).
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Old 10-21-2018, 08:35 AM
 
625 posts, read 429,777 times
Reputation: 945
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fullofdispair View Post
I know this sounds awful, and it probably is but no matter how much I have tried to help, my 36 year old daughter really is. She graduated HS but has dropped out of college 3 times always with excuses; I just can't learn, I just don't like it, I think it's stupid, it's too hard etc etc etc I have heard it all. Even the boyfriends she has had have dumped her because she won't get a job and she constantly goes back and forth between living with friends who eventually get sick of her.

She has had menial jobs but only ever lasts a few months at most. I have offered to pay for counseling but she refuses. Thankfully she doesn't have any kids and I don't give her any money or allow her to move back in. On the other hand I have a 31 year old son that is very successful and is married with a great wife and son. Of course I don't want this, but it's the reality. And as far as I know she doesn't have any drinking or drug problems. Am I being a bad mother for saying this?
Compared to some others, like my brother and sister at home, both on drugs, sister couldn't care for her own daughter, brother in jail at times in and out of trouble. They never really moved out, parasites at about 50 years old. Your daughter? She's a winner!
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Old 10-21-2018, 08:36 AM
 
Location: Houston, TX
13,691 posts, read 7,757,443 times
Reputation: 27996
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fullofdispair View Post
I know this sounds awful, and it probably is but no matter how much I have tried to help, my 36 year old daughter really is. She graduated HS but has dropped out of college 3 times always with excuses; I just can't learn, I just don't like it, I think it's stupid, it's too hard etc etc etc I have heard it all. Even the boyfriends she has had have dumped her because she won't get a job and she constantly goes back and forth between living with friends who eventually get sick of her.

She has had menial jobs but only ever lasts a few months at most. I have offered to pay for counseling but she refuses. Thankfully she doesn't have any kids and I don't give her any money or allow her to move back in. On the other hand I have a 31 year old son that is very successful and is married with a great wife and son. Of course I don't want this, but it's the reality. And as far as I know she doesn't have any drinking or drug problems. Am I being a bad mother for saying this?
Yes it sounds awful. Don't compare your son to your daughter. They are different people, life is difficult, and things might have happened to her that you aren't aware of (sexual assault or domestic violence from a partner for instance?) She could be depressed or suicidal or ill in some other way. Or she may just be a drifter in life. Besides, marriage and kids is not always a yardstick for success. If she doesn't want to be married or have kids, that would not make her a winner in life; it would make her miserable. Leave her alone and she may come around. Or she might not. It's her choice. And offer her emotional support if she needs it.
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Old 10-21-2018, 08:38 AM
 
4,581 posts, read 1,924,325 times
Reputation: 12902
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
Would love to get more info on the daughter's upbringing and school experience, from the OP.
Me too but I doubt we'll see the OP again...
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Old 10-21-2018, 10:32 AM
 
2,579 posts, read 4,554,568 times
Reputation: 6326
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
Would love to get more info on the daughter's upbringing and school experience, from the OP.
I sense an attempt to blame mom, but the OP pointed out her son is successful and married with kids.

I've seen this so often - vastly different outcomes for children in the same family - that I'm very careful not to blame parents for the foibles of their kids except in obvious cases like abuse, extreme neglect or indifference.
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Old 10-21-2018, 10:43 AM
 
Location: State of Transition
74,579 posts, read 66,219,136 times
Reputation: 71146
Quote:
Originally Posted by ukiyo-e View Post
I sense an attempt to blame mom, but the OP pointed out her son is successful and married with kids.

I've seen this so often - vastly different outcomes for children in the same family - that I'm very careful not to blame parents for the foibles of their kids except in obvious cases like abuse, extreme neglect or indifference.
No, blaming mom isn't the point at all. It's to try to ferret out whether there were signs of some kind of problem at some earlier stage in life, that's all. Sometimes these things can blow up in high school; a child might be plodding along ok until hormonal changes throw them off track. Or maybe she she has an undiagnosed condition. Did the child struggle with reading? Or was she always disorganized? These can be signs of dyslexia, or ADD, or something else.
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Old 10-21-2018, 10:56 AM
 
Location: North Idaho
21,355 posts, read 26,627,230 times
Reputation: 40393
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
........... It's to try to ferret out whether there were signs of some kind of problem at some earlier stage in life, that's all...............
My best guess would be a lifetime of indifference to life from the child. Some people just lack motivation. But it doesn't really matter. School was long past and it is way too late to do anything about it now. OP just has to learn to accept her daughter as she is because the chances of imposing change upon the daughter are just about zero.
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Old 10-21-2018, 11:06 AM
 
2,401 posts, read 1,349,004 times
Reputation: 2568
Quote:
Originally Posted by NDak15 View Post
Not being able to keep a job is the definition of loser. At 36? That's pathetic. Honestly I'd say kudos to this parent for not thinking their daughter is a special snowflake.
Those are extremes, calling one's own child a loser or a snowflake. That is now how you parent.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrRational View Post
Getting away from the OP's specific situation...
If you know an adult who would be considered a loser...

How often in their early life did the signs show up?
I have a teacher friend who asserts it can be seen by the end of 3rd grade
with very few kids changing much later on.

And/or at what point did the signs begin to change?
They have a similar opinion regarding the end of 8th grade

(when academic vs vocational aspirations should be sorted (or not).
I have heard that the future success of a child can be determined not by their academic success at 3rd grade but by their social skills by the end of 3rd grade.
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Old 10-21-2018, 11:07 AM
 
2,579 posts, read 4,554,568 times
Reputation: 6326
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
No, blaming mom isn't the point at all. It's to try to ferret out whether there were signs of some kind of problem at some earlier stage in life, that's all. Sometimes these things can blow up in high school; a child might be plodding along ok until hormonal changes throw them off track. Or maybe she she has an undiagnosed condition. Did the child struggle with reading? Or was she always disorganized? These can be signs of dyslexia, or ADD, or something else.
Ok, I see I missed your point. I guess because I'm a mother myself, I get concerned when moms get all the blame. Thanks for clarifying.
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Old 10-21-2018, 11:32 AM
 
Location: Fairfield, CT
5,594 posts, read 8,315,689 times
Reputation: 5900
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fullofdispair View Post
I know this sounds awful, and it probably is but no matter how much I have tried to help, my 36 year old daughter really is. She graduated HS but has dropped out of college 3 times always with excuses; I just can't learn, I just don't like it, I think it's stupid, it's too hard etc etc etc I have heard it all. Even the boyfriends she has had have dumped her because she won't get a job and she constantly goes back and forth between living with friends who eventually get sick of her.

She has had menial jobs but only ever lasts a few months at most. I have offered to pay for counseling but she refuses. Thankfully she doesn't have any kids and I don't give her any money or allow her to move back in. On the other hand I have a 31 year old son that is very successful and is married with a great wife and son. Of course I don't want this, but it's the reality. And as far as I know she doesn't have any drinking or drug problems. Am I being a bad mother for saying this?
I sympathize with your frustration. I have a sister who has been a chronic problem. She keeps doing things to get fired from jobs, is a financial disaster, etc. There's a barricade she puts up for every possible solution to her problems. It's exhausting after a while, and after you've dealt with it for years and years, you stop caring what the cause is, since it will never be addressed anyway.
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