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Old 08-02-2020, 05:33 AM
 
15,639 posts, read 26,259,230 times
Reputation: 30932

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Quote:
Originally Posted by newtovenice View Post
Why are there so many anti-child posts???
I don’t know. We chose to not have children, and I never got any flak for it. Nobody questioned me, demeaned me, felt sorry for me. Actually once — and we set her straight, in a funny way.

But I hear that happening to a lot of childless people.

A number of close friends had a lot of heartbreak around children, and a lot of friends didn’t make it look fun or rewarding. That just confirmed our choice.
__________________
Solly says — Be nice!

 
Old 08-02-2020, 06:08 AM
 
Location: A safe distance from San Francisco
12,350 posts, read 9,720,028 times
Reputation: 13892
Quote:
Originally Posted by nobodysbusiness View Post
Definitely overrated.

Hard work.

No appreciation.

Crap shoot how they turn out (has to do with their personalty, disposition, and karma, more than "nurture," from my experience.
Sadly, I must agree with this.
 
Old 08-02-2020, 07:55 AM
 
6,706 posts, read 5,935,215 times
Reputation: 17068
No, it's not overrated. It's the most fascinating and fulfilling hobby you will ever have.

From the moment of conception, to the miracle of birth, to the minute-by-minute, day-by-day adventure of watching this fresh new human being develop... It's magic, fun, amazing, heartbreaking, challenging... There are no words to really describe.

I know many people in their 40s through 80s who chose not to raise children. Intelligent, highly educated people, who would have had gorgeous and talented kids. Some of them by now would have grandkids.

Most of these people, especially the ones in their 50s and above, wistfully comment to me that they wish they'd had kids. They chose a pleasant, fulfilling lifestyle of glamorous travel, cocktail parties, lucrative careers... and somewhat forgot what they are biologically designed to do. They began to notice an emptiness, a realization that all that money and fun and carefully protected sex was fleeting and momentary.

Children, however, are forever. A little piece of you that continues on. A chance for you to avoid making the mistakes your parents made, and to perpetuate the good things that your parents did.

You nurse your child, hold it, clothe it, sing to it. It teaches you why you are designed the way you are; we are all about having children.

The above is the emotional, raw, caveman aspect of having kids. It's an elemental, instinctual thing.

Then there is the social aspects. The minute you become preggers, you enter a whole new world of preggers & spouses. You (the female) walk into a store, and total strangers (usually older women) will walk up to you, ask how many months you are, and place their hand on your tummy. It's for good luck, they say. I as a male usually keep my mouth shut because I honestly can't tell, except in really obvious cases, the difference between pregnancy and obesity and better safe than sorry.

Then you have a baby, and everyone becomes the baby's godparents, dotes on him, gives you little gifts like woven blankets and toys, asks to hold her, makes cooing sounds. You the mom join a mom's group and push a stroller through the park with 3-4 others, instant friends with this enormous shared experience that bonds you.

Suddenly where you live becomes vitally important: is it a safe neighborhood for children, with wholesome and respectable neighbors? Are there good kids around, potential future playmates? Most importantly, are the schools decent? You join the parent-teacher association and get active in your children's education, and meet hundreds of other people.

People without children start to look a bit sad and lacking to you. Why don't they want to experience this amazing joy of raising a child? you wonder. They look at you and say "Why would they want to give up their careers and freedom like that? I don't get it?"

The great divide.

My wife and I started late, and it took a lot of work to have our one daughter, who is an angel from heaven, with all her flaws and annoyances and beauty and talent. Every day is a kind of rebirth as we learn how to deal with this soon-to-be adult, pushing the boundaries and fighting for her freedom. We have grown, as one must, developed patience and empathy, sacrificed some of what matters to us, and learned to let go of stuff that doesn't really matter.

When I meet young 20-somethings, I always suggest they have children. My wife says I'm a busybody and should leave them alone and respect their decisions. But they don't understand, and will never understand, until they experience it themselves.

Someone who at age 19 says "why would I want kids? would rather have a career, have fun etc." simply doesn't know what they're talking about. Of course they should have kids. Then they'll have loved ones, friends who will be there for them 50 years later when they're slowing down and starting to need assistance. No one should have to grow old alone.

My 2 cents (more like 50 cents)...
 
Old 08-02-2020, 08:51 AM
 
Location: A safe distance from San Francisco
12,350 posts, read 9,720,028 times
Reputation: 13892
Quote:
Originally Posted by blisterpeanuts View Post
No, it's not overrated. It's the most fascinating and fulfilling hobby you will ever have.

From the moment of conception, to the miracle of birth, to the minute-by-minute, day-by-day adventure of watching this fresh new human being develop... It's magic, fun, amazing, heartbreaking, challenging... There are no words to really describe.

I know many people in their 40s through 80s who chose not to raise children. Intelligent, highly educated people, who would have had gorgeous and talented kids. Some of them by now would have grandkids.

Most of these people, especially the ones in their 50s and above, wistfully comment to me that they wish they'd had kids. They chose a pleasant, fulfilling lifestyle of glamorous travel, cocktail parties, lucrative careers... and somewhat forgot what they are biologically designed to do. They began to notice an emptiness, a realization that all that money and fun and carefully protected sex was fleeting and momentary.

Children, however, are forever. A little piece of you that continues on. A chance for you to avoid making the mistakes your parents made, and to perpetuate the good things that your parents did.

You nurse your child, hold it, clothe it, sing to it. It teaches you why you are designed the way you are; we are all about having children.

The above is the emotional, raw, caveman aspect of having kids. It's an elemental, instinctual thing.

Then there is the social aspects. The minute you become preggers, you enter a whole new world of preggers & spouses. You (the female) walk into a store, and total strangers (usually older women) will walk up to you, ask how many months you are, and place their hand on your tummy. It's for good luck, they say. I as a male usually keep my mouth shut because I honestly can't tell, except in really obvious cases, the difference between pregnancy and obesity and better safe than sorry.

Then you have a baby, and everyone becomes the baby's godparents, dotes on him, gives you little gifts like woven blankets and toys, asks to hold her, makes cooing sounds. You the mom join a mom's group and push a stroller through the park with 3-4 others, instant friends with this enormous shared experience that bonds you.

Suddenly where you live becomes vitally important: is it a safe neighborhood for children, with wholesome and respectable neighbors? Are there good kids around, potential future playmates? Most importantly, are the schools decent? You join the parent-teacher association and get active in your children's education, and meet hundreds of other people.

People without children start to look a bit sad and lacking to you. Why don't they want to experience this amazing joy of raising a child? you wonder. They look at you and say "Why would they want to give up their careers and freedom like that? I don't get it?"

The great divide.

My wife and I started late, and it took a lot of work to have our one daughter, who is an angel from heaven, with all her flaws and annoyances and beauty and talent. Every day is a kind of rebirth as we learn how to deal with this soon-to-be adult, pushing the boundaries and fighting for her freedom. We have grown, as one must, developed patience and empathy, sacrificed some of what matters to us, and learned to let go of stuff that doesn't really matter.

When I meet young 20-somethings, I always suggest they have children. My wife says I'm a busybody and should leave them alone and respect their decisions. But they don't understand, and will never understand, until they experience it themselves.

Someone who at age 19 says "why would I want kids? would rather have a career, have fun etc." simply doesn't know what they're talking about. Of course they should have kids. Then they'll have loved ones, friends who will be there for them 50 years later when they're slowing down and starting to need assistance. No one should have to grow old alone.

My 2 cents (more like 50 cents)...
That's a wonderfully written fairy tale. What you don't realize is that many of us are not 19 year olds, but older than you are and have been through it all. Your experience is not ours. Many people grow old alone despite having children which began with the starry-eyed vision you describe.

It's wonderful that you have been lucky and that things have gone well for you. Everyone begins with that hope. Many have an altogether different kind of experience, however, through no more fault of their own than the next guy.

Deciding to have children in modern America is pot luck, at best.
 
Old 08-02-2020, 09:39 AM
 
Location: NC
1,225 posts, read 2,420,579 times
Reputation: 673
Overrated I dont think so. But you are basically sacrificing your life until they are 18.
 
Old 08-02-2020, 10:03 AM
 
374 posts, read 146,474 times
Reputation: 455
Quote:
Originally Posted by reebo View Post
I’m sorry, I missed the part of the OP’s initial post where these parameters were set.

It’s odd, and doesn’t give a full picture, if you don’t consider all the outcome possibilities.

My points are not irrelevant and you don’t get to set the discussion terms.

Goes both ways, Bucko .

Last edited by PerditaPanthera; 08-02-2020 at 10:17 AM..
 
Old 08-02-2020, 10:05 AM
 
Location: Townsville
6,796 posts, read 2,907,672 times
Reputation: 5519
Every homeless person, every prisoner, every unfortunate adult who is now friendless and unloved and perhaps unlovely should perhaps wear a locket around their neck containing a photograph of themselves as a baby to remind those that don't give a damn about them anymore that THEY were once a 'miracle sent from heaven' as described by some on this thread. You see, there are millions of 'former children' in this world who really don't feel this way and perhaps never did.
 
Old 08-02-2020, 10:12 AM
 
374 posts, read 146,474 times
Reputation: 455
Quote:
Originally Posted by blisterpeanuts View Post
No, it's not overrated. It's the most fascinating and fulfilling hobby you will ever have.

From the moment of conception, to the miracle of birth, to the minute-by-minute, day-by-day adventure of watching this fresh new human being develop... It's magic, fun, amazing, heartbreaking, challenging... There are no words to really describe.

I know many people in their 40s through 80s who chose not to raise children. Intelligent, highly educated people, who would have had gorgeous and talented kids. Some of them by now would have grandkids.

Most of these people, especially the ones in their 50s and above, wistfully comment to me that they wish they'd had kids. They chose a pleasant, fulfilling lifestyle of glamorous travel, cocktail parties, lucrative careers... and somewhat forgot what they are biologically designed to do. They began to notice an emptiness, a realization that all that money and fun and carefully protected sex was fleeting and momentary.

Children, however, are forever. A little piece of you that continues on. A chance for you to avoid making the mistakes your parents made, and to perpetuate the good things that your parents did.

You nurse your child, hold it, clothe it, sing to it. It teaches you why you are designed the way you are; we are all about having children.

The above is the emotional, raw, caveman aspect of having kids. It's an elemental, instinctual thing.

Then there is the social aspects. The minute you become preggers, you enter a whole new world of preggers & spouses. You (the female) walk into a store, and total strangers (usually older women) will walk up to you, ask how many months you are, and place their hand on your tummy. It's for good luck, they say. I as a male usually keep my mouth shut because I honestly can't tell, except in really obvious cases, the difference between pregnancy and obesity and better safe than sorry.

Then you have a baby, and everyone becomes the baby's godparents, dotes on him, gives you little gifts like woven blankets and toys, asks to hold her, makes cooing sounds. You the mom join a mom's group and push a stroller through the park with 3-4 others, instant friends with this enormous shared experience that bonds you.

Suddenly where you live becomes vitally important: is it a safe neighborhood for children, with wholesome and respectable neighbors? Are there good kids around, potential future playmates? Most importantly, are the schools decent? You join the parent-teacher association and get active in your children's education, and meet hundreds of other people.

People without children start to look a bit sad and lacking to you. Why don't they want to experience this amazing joy of raising a child? you wonder. They look at you and say "Why would they want to give up their careers and freedom like that? I don't get it?"

The great divide.

My wife and I started late, and it took a lot of work to have our one daughter, who is an angel from heaven, with all her flaws and annoyances and beauty and talent. Every day is a kind of rebirth as we learn how to deal with this soon-to-be adult, pushing the boundaries and fighting for her freedom. We have grown, as one must, developed patience and empathy, sacrificed some of what matters to us, and learned to let go of stuff that doesn't really matter.

When I meet young 20-somethings, I always suggest they have children. My wife says I'm a busybody and should leave them alone and respect their decisions. But they don't understand, and will never understand, until they experience it themselves.

Someone who at age 19 says "why would I want kids? would rather have a career, have fun etc." simply doesn't know what they're talking about. Of course they should have kids. Then they'll have loved ones, friends who will be there for them 50 years later when they're slowing down and starting to need assistance. No one should have to grow old alone.

My 2 cents (more like 50 cents)...
Beautifully said. Couldn't agree more. Life can certainly be fulfilling, enjoyable, and remarkable without kids, but is infinitely more so with them. And children, even if you have to go through the unspeakable grief of losing one, ALWAYS create an opportunity to be a better person--whether a parent has the integrity or character to ACT on that opportunity is up to the parent. Becoming better people is good for families, communities, societies, the world. If I didn't have kids, I would have cared a bit less about being a good example, I would be more self centered and I would definitely not be as concerned with how I leave this world....children make you think about the consequences of tomorrow more fully.
 
Old 08-02-2020, 11:09 AM
 
2,146 posts, read 3,061,436 times
Reputation: 12249
Quote:
Originally Posted by PerditaPanthera View Post
Goes both ways, Bucko .
I never said your points were irrelevant, but I imagine you twist everything to suit you. Carry on.
 
Old 08-02-2020, 11:16 AM
 
2,117 posts, read 1,323,605 times
Reputation: 6035
I have two children. One is very good, the other is so so. I have good times and bad times. And yes, I agree having children is overrated.

Having children is easy for most people. Just f and poop the babies out. A little bit pain for a few hours, or a day. A piece of cake. That's why people forget the pain and keep f*cking and continuously poop the babies out to the world.

Raising children is hard. But that's the consequences for people's pleasures for some moments to satisfy their down below. People are not sacrificing anything (for 18 years or forever). They just have to pay for their past actions, f*cking or making love (whatever people call it to make it nicer) and having pleasures.

Why do I say having children is overrated? When you are pregnant, you get all the attentions from everybody, you are treated like a queen from your husband or partner. You get to do light work. You can throw tantrums, and people give you sympathy, saying "oh, she's pregnant, she has mood swings, that's normal, etc ... " Why do people treat pregnant people like that? Because they're carrying a baby inside them, an heir for their men, not to mention their parents who dream to have someone to continue their legacy. Most people want to have children, so they can feel "normal" like the majority, and don't get gossip and sneers from others.

Nowadays, the world is over populated. And these "human" beings (children - young and old - created by their parents) are causing so much problems for the world. So, having children or not is just like making a plan for anything, like to find/have a job, making money, to make your life “richer” or poorer.

Don't want to go any further. Again, in short, yes, having children is overrated.
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