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View Poll Results: Which option would you choose to assist your adult child with kids?
I'd spend 2k a month providing my son with a very nice apt, paying his psych bills, & ignoring his kids' needs. 0 0%
I'd provide my son w/some basic help, a CHEAP apt, psych care but send some of the $$ saved to cover the child support obligation ($275/mo). 3 10.00%
I'd invite my son to live in my home, still help him with the basics & psych care but focus as well on the fact that his kids need support. 10 33.33%
I wouldn't send any money. My son is my son but he's an adult and he and his children are not my problem. 6 20.00%
Other 11 36.67%
Voters: 30. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-26-2008, 09:09 PM
 
Location: USA
1,952 posts, read 4,789,491 times
Reputation: 2267

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fierce_flawless -

Wow.

Don't even know what to say....

I read your post and I understand EVERYTHING you are saying. Just the irony, the almost unbelievable lack of self-awareness of these people is STAGGERING.
It's so ironic.

I understand your rage, all of it.

But - I would not send the letter.

Yes, they should be helping your children much more than they are - ideally. But they are much more interested in continuing to enable your ex-husband, for whatever reasons people do that sort of thing.
This is a pattern in their family, and it's not going to change now.
There is nothing to be gained by your sending the letter.
I just wouldn't do it - not now, probably not ever.

The sad truth is....they don't "have to" help your kids - yes, they SHOULD; but many people just don't see it that way, and they are probably among them.
Yes, it's wrong that they are enabling your ex instead of helping these two innocent children, but you know what? LIFE ISN'T FAIR.
You're in the valley now.
Yes, I have been there.

My best advice to you?

Stand up, hold your head up, and forget about these fools!
Focus on those 2 precious children. You may not be able to buy them much but money doesn't make a home - LOVE MAKES A HOME!
Be the very best mother you can be. Show them love, caring, and dignity.
Don't worry about your ex and his parents; they're not deserving of your attention. Concentrate on those 2 sweet kids.
Forget the letter.
Work on making a happy home, a decent home where there is love and respect; that is what matters to kids.
Hold your head high and do the best for your children. Don't become bitter. They may have money, but you have those 2 sweet kids and that's worth more than anything their money can buy.

Good luck to you
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Old 06-26-2008, 09:27 PM
 
3,191 posts, read 9,182,553 times
Reputation: 2203
clap clap for sundance....after I read it was the Mom posting, I hardily agree with sundance

forget them, they are a waste of air space

heck send me their email and I'd be glad to tell them that
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Old 06-27-2008, 07:25 AM
 
Location: Texas
8,672 posts, read 22,268,428 times
Reputation: 21369
Yep, we can only control the facet of life that faces us. For the most part, we can't control what others could/should do...expecially when there is no legal obligation which might (or might not) be able to be enforced. You would do yourself and your kids a favor IMO to try to forgive your ex-in-laws and psychologically "move on" from concerning yourself with what they do or do not do. Take whatever they feel like they can offer and not worry about the rest. I know that's not easy, but I think this is what needs to happen. I wouldn't deny your kids the opportunity to go and visit, however, and have grandparents in their lives, however minimally. (It's heart-breaking that it is so difficult on your youngest, but IMO some contact with their father will be less hurtful in the long run than none at all.)

Last edited by kaykay; 06-27-2008 at 08:51 AM..
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Old 06-27-2008, 07:43 AM
 
Location: Savannah GA/Lk Hopatcong NJ
13,404 posts, read 28,726,919 times
Reputation: 12067
I agree with Sundance i would wipe them out of my life..time heals all wounds and that's what your younger one needs. the sporadic visits keep reopening those wounds...

I would not even give them the satisfaction of an email pouring your heart out...

Keep up with the demand for child support papers....maybe he will get caught in a sheriffs round up of dead beat parents and spend a few nights in the clink till he pays up

Good luck to you...hang in there
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Old 06-27-2008, 08:35 AM
 
Location: Philly, Philly
932 posts, read 1,677,295 times
Reputation: 332
Default Gotta Find Peace Of Mind

AWW Fierce!

I think that the tiny vacation idea is a great way to get some of your worries off of your shoulder.

About the other folks, since you have told them over and over the situation that you are in and they have contributed only minimally,I think that it is time to cut them off. Letting them visit only sends the message that they can do whatever and still have the children in their lives. If you stop letting them go, even if just for awhile, maybe the in laws will see another picture of the situation and know that you mean business.

About the letter, This has helped me cope with a situation with my ex. Write the letter on paper, say whatever you feel like saying and then put it in the mail and mail it to yourself. Then never open it. I know it doesn't make any sense but this is what my mother told me to do and it helped me out a lot.

Also listen to some empowering music. I Gotta Find Peace Of Mind by Lauryn Hill is my theme song.
Lauryn Hill I Gotta Find Peace Of Mind - Song - MP3 Stream on IMEEM Music

All single mothers are an inspiration to me. You do so much! You are appreciated by those 2 children of yours and it may not seem like it now but when they get older, they will understand your sacrifices and they will understand the choices you had to make for them. Believe me everything will come full circle. I didn't understand it with my mother when I was younger, but she gave me all she could and I am a better person now because of her and I appreciate her so much now.

Good Luck.
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Old 06-27-2008, 09:52 AM
 
Location: in my mind
2,743 posts, read 14,295,043 times
Reputation: 1627
Quote:
Originally Posted by laysayfair View Post
Would it do any good to move to where your ex and the grandparents are? Your sons sound like they need their dad (even if he is a sorry excuse for one) and the grandparents would probably help a lot more if the kids were right there. i don't think it's any good emailing the grandparents because no matter what you say their son will tell them it's a lie and explain it away as you being unbalanced. You'll be antagonizing them for nothing. If you lived near them you'd also have your sister-in-law for support and the boys will have their cousins. I don't expect the parents to ever do right in the way you'd like them to. But I think you and your boys could get more support, help and benefits from them if you're right there. Some people are the "out-of-sight equal out-of-mind type". I think you should stop expecting these people to behave as you or I would behave. They're not gonna'.
As for moving there.... no. Never. Sorry. I hate that place (their city)... and I have a house here, that I worked hard to save up to put money down on. I do have a partner, who helps me with the children, and does more for them in terms of being a parent than their father ever has. They have my mom (their Grandma) who, while by no means rich, adores them both and understands what it means to have a REAL relationship with them. They have friends and have been in the same schools for years. My ex SIL would not socialize with me even if she is the current "odd girl out".

I was just not raised that it is in any way okay for a child to be "out of sight, out of mind"... my mom kept up a very close relationship with my brother's daughter, who lived 4 states away her entire life... distance was never an allowable excuse. Same with my grandmother. I grew up in TX, and she lived in Maryland, and she called me and wrote me letters and I never ever felt like she was a stranger even though I didn't see her but once or twice a year.

So no, I'm not moving to their city. When we split, my ex made the choice to move away from the kids, despite my begging him to reconsider. He had a super cheap apartment here, and the job market is no better one place over the other... he could have stayed here but he chose not to. His parents would have "supported" him here just the same!
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Old 06-27-2008, 09:54 AM
 
Location: in my mind
2,743 posts, read 14,295,043 times
Reputation: 1627
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundance View Post
fierce_flawless -

Wow.

Don't even know what to say....

I read your post and I understand EVERYTHING you are saying. Just the irony, the almost unbelievable lack of self-awareness of these people is STAGGERING.
It's so ironic.

I understand your rage, all of it.

But - I would not send the letter.

<snip>
Thank you for understanding. I really needed to hear that I'm not crazy in thinking that they're just awful people! LOL!

I will think about all you said. I am having a hard time NOT writing the letter. I was raised by my mom, and my mom is not one to mince words. She'll tell you and anyone else straight up if you're doing wrong. So I get the "urge" from her I guess. I just keep thinking they must not REALIZE how wrong they are!?

As for the mini-vacation, we actually did something similar last month... so that's out for now... but a good idea nonetheless.

Rep points all around to all. thanks for letting me rage about this!
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Old 06-27-2008, 10:04 AM
 
3,414 posts, read 7,143,022 times
Reputation: 1467
Quote:
Originally Posted by fierce_flawless View Post
As for moving there.... no. Never. Sorry. I hate that place (their city)... and I have a house here, that I worked hard to save up to put money down on. I do have a partner, who helps me with the children, and does more for them in terms of being a parent than their father ever has. They have my mom (their Grandma) who, while by no means rich, adores them both and understands what it means to have a REAL relationship with them. They have friends and have been in the same schools for years. My ex SIL would not socialize with me even if she is the current "odd girl out".

I was just not raised that it is in any way okay for a child to be "out of sight, out of mind"... my mom kept up a very close relationship with my brother's daughter, who lived 4 states away her entire life... distance was never an allowable excuse. Same with my grandmother. I grew up in TX, and she lived in Maryland, and she called me and wrote me letters and I never ever felt like she was a stranger even though I didn't see her but once or twice a year.

So no, I'm not moving to their city. When we split, my ex made the choice to move away from the kids, despite my begging him to reconsider. He had a super cheap apartment here, and the job market is no better one place over the other... he could have stayed here but he chose not to. His parents would have "supported" him here just the same!
I'm glad you have someone helping you and I see all your points. I have dealt with people like your ex's family. They don't seem to have a conscience. They look and act like normal people so you think they can be reached but they never can. They're something wrong with them.
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Old 06-27-2008, 10:23 AM
 
Location: in my mind
2,743 posts, read 14,295,043 times
Reputation: 1627
Quote:
Originally Posted by laysayfair View Post
I'm glad you have someone helping you and I see all your points. I have dealt with people like your ex's family. They don't seem to have a conscience. They look and act like normal people so you think they can be reached but they never can. They're something wrong with them.
Pod People!

Seriously. Not to get political about this but my ex FIL is a huge Rush Limbaugh fan and likes to go on and on about "personal responsibility" and welfare mothers and so forth. My ex MIL is very very haughty about anyone "beneath" her (which is anyone w/o money)... and like I said they make a big show out of donating to children's charities, doing the Angel Tree at Christmas each year, and my ex FIL being the Chairperson for a kid's charity! Ugh! If those people in his "group" only knew (and yeah, I've fantasized about "outing" him too!). It's just all so hypocritical. I can stand just about anything but hypocrisy! I don't care what your political beliefs are, just don't spout it if you don't live it, that's all!

Then again maybe they're all just as screwy. But yes, these people are messed up, they don't talk about ANYTHING unpleasant, ever. I am not making excuses for him but I can totally see just why my ex is so dysfunctional!
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Old 06-27-2008, 10:32 AM
 
Location: in my mind
2,743 posts, read 14,295,043 times
Reputation: 1627
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaykay View Post
Yep, we can only control the facet of life that faces us. For the most part, we can't control what others could/should do...expecially when there is no legal obligation which might (or might not) be able to be enforced. You would do yourself and your kids a favor IMO to try to forgive your ex-in-laws and psychologically "move on" from concerning yourself with what they do or do not do. Take whatever they feel like they can offer and not worry about the rest. I know that's not easy, but I think this is what needs to happen. I wouldn't deny your kids the opportunity to go and visit, however, and have grandparents in their lives, however minimally. (It's heart-breaking that it is so difficult on your youngest, but IMO some contact with their father will be less hurtful in the long run than none at all.)

See, that's what tears me up.

My parents divorced when I was 7, but my father had been living out of the house since I was 5 and before that he was gone a lot anyway (Air Force).

I totally romanticized my "Daddy" and blamed my mom for "making him leave". Of course, I was a little kid, I had no clue about the truth and my mom never badmouthed him. I learned in time though. I used to go see him in the summers.. for a little bit.

Then I walked in the room once when I was about 9 or 10 and overheard my mom on the phone w/him saying "But she misses you and NEEDS to see her father, please, can't you make time for her??"

My mom was basically begging my dad to take me for his scheduled summer time. He was telling her he couldn't be inconvenienced (by that time he had an active dating life)....

I ended up going that summer, and was shuffled between 3 sitters the entire time. Actually the sitters were all nice to me and I learned how to make home made tortillas that summer. After that I stopped asking to go and my mom stopped pushing it. The following year he got married and told me about it after the fact. I did go up briefly to meet the "step-monster" (and she was BAD).... but basically I didn't go back until I was 13 and due to circumstances HAD to live with him for a while.

I guess I just feel like even though my ex doesn't stay in touch with them the way he should, they do see him 3x a year, and he is at least nice to them when they are there. My dad was a drunk too but a mean one. It just tears me up and makes me wish I'd divorced him back when I first realized I'd made a huge mistake... then the kids would have been young enough to forget more easily.

When we were married we'd have these conversations about my own father, and my ex was always sad for me and would swear to me that no matter what happened with us he would ALWAYS be a good father. Well, he wasn't much of a father when we were married but he was there in the house by default and he wasn't mean so I guess that's his idea of being a good father, when compared to my own dad...? I dunno. To hear him talk you'd think he was raised by the Dad of the Year, but I think there's more to it than that... with people like this there's always "more to it" and they'll never ever talk about it. So, who knows. I suspect his father was much like he is, minus the alcohol and depression and resulting financial irresponsibility. Officially there, but not really.


But what's done is done and here we are, huh?
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