Breastfeeding Older Children (family, problems, better, ignorant)

[mainerwoman]

[quote=Woof Woof Woof!;5998604]Well spoken!

I agree with 2girlsand2boys --

She hasn't been insulting. She speaks from experience as a mother, and a good one at that!
So the experience that I have had as a mother speaks for nothing?
And she makes a good point. People in our society get totally brainwashed into thinking something is wrong with extended breastfeeding.
She is attempting to convince everyone participating in this thread that breastfeeding a 7/8 year old child is beneficial. She would like everyone to share her view point. That is a form of "brainwashing". No one has ever said to me that breastfeeding a child of that age is abnormal or wrong. I can form my own opinions without the help of others.
Nothing wrong with it and the kids probably come out a lot better balanced than half the folks in our society![/quote]
I really don't think so. Since everyone else has felt so free to quote countless studies, I will as well. Psychiatrists have found that children who form a "unnatural" bond with their parents do not grow up to be competent, productive members of society. I feel that if children are still nursing away at mommy's breasts when they should be forming relationships with their own peer group, then that may cause some problems relating to others.
You can form your own opinions. I don't believe in forcing anyone to share my opinions.

[fierce_flawless]

[quote=mainerwoman;6009164]

Originally Posted by Woof Woof Woof!

Well spoken!

I agree with 2girlsand2boys --

She hasn't been insulting. She speaks from experience as a mother, and a good one at that!
So the experience that I have had as a mother speaks for nothing?
And she makes a good point. People in our society get totally brainwashed into thinking something is wrong with extended breastfeeding.
She is attempting to convince everyone participating in this thread that breastfeeding a 7/8 year old child is beneficial. She would like everyone to share her view point. That is a form of "brainwashing". No one has ever said to me that breastfeeding a child of that age is abnormal or wrong. I can form my own opinions without the help of others.
Nothing wrong with it and the kids probably come out a lot better balanced than half the folks in our society![/quote]
I really don't think so. Since everyone else has felt so free to quote countless studies, I will as well. Psychiatrists have found that children who form a "unnatural" bond with their parents do not grow up to be competent, productive members of society. I feel that if children are still nursing away at mommy's breasts when they should be forming relationships with their own peer group, then that may cause some problems relating to others.
You can form your own opinions. I don't believe in forcing anyone to share my opinions.

I am sincerely curious as to how an older child who is nursing MAYBE once a day, (most likely not even that), and most likely only at night, cannot be simultaneously forming relationships with their own peer group?

Would you say the same about a child who still has a story read to them at night? Or who occasionally wants a backrub, or who still sleeps with a particular toy?

[Woof Woof Woof!]

Originally Posted by mainerwoman

Psychiatrists have found that children who form a "unnatural" bond with their parents do not grow up to be competent, productive members of society. I feel that if children are still nursing away at mommy's breasts when they should be forming relationships with their own peer group, then that may cause some problems relating to others.
You can form your own opinions. I don't believe in forcing anyone to share my opinions.

You're making two huge assumptions. One is that breastfeeding forms an unnatural bond between the child and mother. Two is that breast feeding keeps a child from forming relationships with peers.

Neither of your assumptions is backed by any research or real world data. Your opinions are not based on facts. They are based on fear.

[2girlsand2boys]

[quote=mainerwoman;6009164]

Originally Posted by Woof Woof Woof!

Well spoken!

I agree with 2girlsand2boys --

She hasn't been insulting. She speaks from experience as a mother, and a good one at that!
So the experience that I have had as a mother speaks for nothing?
And she makes a good point. People in our society get totally brainwashed into thinking something is wrong with extended breastfeeding.
She is attempting to convince everyone participating in this thread that breastfeeding a 7/8 year old child is beneficial. She would like everyone to share her view point. That is a form of "brainwashing". No one has ever said to me that breastfeeding a child of that age is abnormal or wrong. I can form my own opinions without the help of others.
Nothing wrong with it and the kids probably come out a lot better balanced than half the folks in our society![/quote]
I really don't think so. Since everyone else has felt so free to quote countless studies, I will as well. Psychiatrists have found that children who form a "unnatural" bond with their parents do not grow up to be competent, productive members of society. I feel that if children are still nursing away at mommy's breasts when they should be forming relationships with their own peer group, then that may cause some problems relating to others.
You can form your own opinions. I don't believe in forcing anyone to share my opinions.

I thin kyou are just grasping at straws here that don't exist. You have obviously missed all of the links posted in this and other related threads about how full term breastfeeding DOES NOT cause psychological damage. I believe there may also have been studies posted about how weaning too early can cause MORE problems! I would love to read your "studies" if you care to prove me wrong...

Yet another link about breastfeeding beyond infancy: LLLI | Breastfeeding Beyond a Year: exploring benefits, cultural influences, and more

[yodi]

Originally Posted by Woof Woof Woof!

You're making two huge assumptions. One is that breastfeeding forms an unnatural bond between the child and mother. Two is that breast feeding keeps a child from forming relationships with peers.

Neither of your assumptions is backed by any research or real world data. Your opinions are not based on facts. They are based on fear.

Well said!

[mainerwoman]

Originally Posted by 2girlsand2boys

How are my posts any more attacking than the people who referred to women nursing an older child as "sickos" and "disgusting"? That is obviously just their opinion, and I find that to be insulting!
What you are attacking is the right of others to form a opinion. My opinion differs from yours and because of that you call me a "sheeple" You inform me that my opinion isn't based on my experience as a mother but on what I've been programmed to believe. That is insulting!! Your opinion, however, is some how worth more because of..... well I guess because it's your opinion.
Originally Posted by 2girlsand2boys
Okay, you are right. It isn't insulting at all for you to call people who practice CLW and extended breastfeeding "creepy".

Ignore all you want, Grandma. You feel the way you do because society has told you you should.
So, because people disagree with you, you feel that we do not have the intelligence to form our own opinions. My feelings on the subject of extended breastfeeding didn't come from society, it came from breastfeeding two children. I know what is the right thing to do, and breastfeeding a 7/8 year old isn't right. You can list what ever study you can dredge up, every organization under the sun, but it doesn't mean you are right. I would never dream of breastfeeding my almost 8 year old. I love her, and I hug and kiss her all the time. When she's had a tough day at school, I tell her what a wonderful, smart, thrilling, incredible person she is. I am able to comfort her without shoving my breasts in her face. Please don't tell me that is because I can't separate the sexual /nurturing sides of my breasts. The idea that anything on my body was meant for anything except a device for children to hang off of flew out the window a long time ago.
That isn't insulting. It's true. Maybe it's true that everything you believe you read in a Dr. Sears book. Maybe it's true that all of your thoughts, feelings and beliefs came from Oprah. That could be as insulting as you saying that society informs Kali's Grandma what to believe.

You said that YOU know what is right. What is that based on? Certainly not fact! It is based on your opinion! The same as MY opinion that it is healthier for a child to be nursing at age 8 than to eating most of the crap found in the American's diet. I also believe that most people find extended breastfeeding "icky" because we do not live in a society where everyone does it. Like it or not, Americans are sheep that find it difficult to form their own opinions on things. No one wants to have an original thought for fear of being a social outcast! It is much easier for them to say, "Well, the Jones's do it this way, so I should too." or "no one breastfeeds a child for that long, so I shouldn't either".

Call it insulting if you like, but that is the way it is. If it was common in our society to see 8 year olds nursing, this would be a non-issue.

Just because something becomes common does not make it a non-issue. A non-issue means that most everyone accepts it and obviously that isn't going to happen.

[2girlsand2boys]

Originally Posted by mainerwoman

Just because something becomes common does not make it a non-issue. A non-issue means that most everyone accepts it and obviously that isn't going to happen.

Uh, yeah it does! There was a time when it would have been completely unacceptable to NOT nurse your baby-- they would have died! Parents didn't have any other options until like the 30s! More and more people started using artifical baby milk and THAT became the social norm. If more and more women choose to nurse older and older children, it will become more normal!

[mainerwoman]

[quote=Woof Woof Woof!;6009505]You're making two huge assumptions. One is that breastfeeding forms an unnatural bond between the child and mother. I didn't say that breastfeeding causes unnatural bonds. You have misstated what I posted. Two is that breast feeding keeps a child from forming relationships with peers. Children form bonds with their peer group around the age of 7/8. They start to separate themselves from their parents and build these new relationships. How can a 7/8 year old separate themselves from their mother if they are still dependent on her to such a level that they seek comfort from nursing?

Neither of your assumptions is backed by any research or real world data. Your opinions are not based on facts. They are based on fear.[/quote]
Fear of what? Because I disagree with you I am afraid?

[ADVentive]

Originally Posted by 121804

Publicly nursing an infant is percieved differently than publicly nursing a 4yr old or 8 yr old....

I've yet to ever see an 8yr old being nursed in public but I've seen many an infant & never batted an eye.

Do I think there is a possible bais? Sure. Do I hold that bais? Yes, based on the belief that nursing an 8yr old has issues that are not along the same line of nursing an infant or young toddler.

I'm sorry, I can see how what I said may be confusing, but I was not referring to nursing an older child in public - I was referring to nursing a young baby in public. (Most people who nurse older children do not do so in public anyway because 1) the child does not nurse that often and 2) the child has the ability to comprehend waiting) Your argument was that if nursing an older child was of nutritional value/needed that it would be socially accepted. I argued that even nursing a young baby, which I think we can agree has great nutritional value and is needed, is not necessarily socially accepted (in the US).

When I was criticized for nursing in public, my baby was only about 5 weeks old, an age when almost anybody would say that it is nutritionally needed. It wasn't an issue about my being covered. It was an issue of that they didn't want me to do *that* there (I was at the mall). Whenever I post this, I still always get responses saying things like, why couldn't I have just found a more private location, like a nursing room/ bathroom/ dressing room/ etc, OR why couldn't I just pump and give her a bottle if I must go out. Clearly, there are still MANY people who don't want to see nursing in public at all, regardless of the age of the baby or how discreet the moms is. The message society sends then is more like "breast is best... but not in public (and only for 6-12 months)."

I have met and heard from many, many moms who have never had any problems or criticism nursing in public, which is great. But I have also heard of many, many moms who DID experience criticism, and others whose fear of criticism affected their decisions regarding nursing. First Right, an organization that attempts to help women who feel they've been a victim of discrimination due to breastfeeding, reports 52 cases in the past year (its first year), and this is a brand new organization that most folks have probably never even heard of yet. I definitely feel that this is a reality that negatively affects both initiation and duration of breastfeeding in America.

[121804]

Originally Posted by ADVentive

I'm sorry, I can see how what I said may be confusing, but I was not referring to nursing an older child in public - I was referring to nursing a young baby in public. (Most people who nurse older children do not do so in public anyway because 1) the child does not nurse that often and 2) the child has the ability to comprehend waiting) Your argument was that if nursing an older child was of nutritional value/needed that it would be socially accepted. I argued that even nursing a young baby, which I think we can agree has great nutritional value and is needed, is not necessarily socially accepted (in the US).

When I was criticized for nursing in public, my baby was only about 5 weeks old, an age when almost anybody would say that it is nutritionally needed. It wasn't an issue about my being covered. It was an issue of that they didn't want me to do *that* there (I was at the mall). Whenever I post this, I still always get responses saying things like, why couldn't I have just found a more private location, like a nursing room/ bathroom/ dressing room/ etc, OR why couldn't I just pump and give her a bottle if I must go out. Clearly, there are still MANY people who don't want to see nursing in public at all, regardless of the age of the baby or how discreet the moms is. The message society sends then is more like "breast is best... but not in public (and only for 6-12 months)."

I have met and heard from many, many moms who have never had any problems or criticism nursing in public, which is great. But I have also heard of many, many moms who DID experience criticism, and others whose fear of criticism affected their decisions regarding nursing. First Right, an organization that attempts to help women who feel they've been a victim of discrimination due to breastfeeding, reports 52 cases in the past year (its first year), and this is a brand new organization that most folks have probably never even heard of yet. I definitely feel that this is a reality that negatively affects both initiation and duration of breastfeeding in America.

Now, you are starting a whole other topic within a topic but a good one.

A Victoria's Secret in our neigborhood grew huge attention when it asked a woman to leave the store who was breastfeeding near the entry. Now, mind you, this woman had made public announcements that she was planning on testing V.S. on this issue...so, I sorta had some issues with her sincerity, BUT, it is ironic that a store that stores bras & panties & displays half naked women has an issue with breastfeeding in public

I find it very concerning that society would have an issue with mothers publicly nursing an infant or young toddler. Unless you have no tolerance (I'm a little heated tonight based on this election & some of the outcomes), I can't see the issue unless a mother is not covered up...even then, I would use caution b/c sometimes we forget the blanket or sweater or diaper bag & when your 2 month old needs to eat, he/she needs to eat...it's not like the mom is doing this as a publicity stunt.

I just feel that there comes a point in a child's life where it is the parent's responsibility to lead them from the breast & onto the next milestone. An 8 yr old is fully integrated in society & interacting with his/her peers. At this age, it's vital to start giving them the tools to get through that stage. Breastfeeding takes it back to infancy or toddler.

Are there any tribes or cultures where it is the norm to nurse at this age? We obviously now that in western culture & most Asian culture this is not something that is common practice based on many different values, beliefs & needs.

Anyway, I feel that breastfeeding an infant or toddler in public is not an issue. I do stand behind that nursing an 8yr old in public would be a little odd & social unacceptable in western culture.

What people do in their own homes is their own business. But I guess coming from teaching middle school, I've seen a lot & hold some very strong opinions on giving children the necessary tools to survive this very crazy world!!