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Old 01-16-2012, 08:41 PM
 
Location: Western Washington
8,004 posts, read 9,633,080 times
Reputation: 19408

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Quote:
Originally Posted by thanksforthehelp View Post
A friend has a 16 year old child that is very uncooperative, getting into trouble, threatening her and her daughter and generally destroying their family life and home.

His bedroom is beyond a mess. It's literally difficult to move in the room because there is so much stuff piled everywhere. She has told him that she is going to go in and clean his room and get rid of everything.

He, of course, has stated that she has no right to touch his property. I think he actually has no right to any property in the house and that everything actually belongs to his mother. I believe she has the right to do whatever she pleases with "his" property.

The parents are divorced and the mother has full custody of the children. The father has no custody at all. He has now called and told her that she had better not take away anything from the child that he gave to his son, or he will take her to court. Again, I believe that she has the right to determine what happens to any property in her home. I believe the father has no right to tell her to leave it alone.

Of course, my opinion really means nothing. It comes down to the law. Anyone else here have experience with these issues? I just want to help her find factual information to determine what her rights are in her home. Any resources would be especially appreciated.

Thanks a lot.
Your friend needs to set up an appointment with her local CPS office and have a discussion with them, in order to find out what she can and should do. They will likely be most happy to give her all of the advice she needs. It is most likely that they will inform her that she is only required to provide that boy with food, a place to sleep, plumbing, clothing and an education. They will likely also inform her that she needs to be reporting any property damage, emotional and physical abuse to the proper authorities.

If his father has issues with keeping the gifts he purchased for his son at his house, perhaps he'll open the doors for him and take his turn at raising an out of control teenage son. Absentee parents have all the answers until they get the "problem" dropped into their lap. It's easy to blame the parent the child is living with until you take over the parenting and realize that it's actually the CHILD who is the problem.

I had an out of control teen. CPS informed me that the only thing I had to provide him was food, clothing, shelter and toileting/showering access, AND ensure he made it to school. They said that anything I had purchased for him, I had the right to take back. Anything he was using....like a stereo, television, radio, computer....was not required by law and could be prohibited. I had the right to prohibit ANYTHING in my house that was not on that small list above. If he had music that we didn't approve of, we had the right to lock it away until he turned 18 AND prohibit him from listening to it in our house. Kids don't have as many "rights" as people think they do.

In response to a personal comment...at least in our state, if THEY bought it..if THEY own it, you still have the right, in your home, to prohibit it. If that means locking it in a safe until they are 18, you have the right to do so. If it is illegal, you have the right to contact the police and report them. Some kids can get pretty out of hand. I have a dear friend, who has tried everything with her teenage daughter. The 14 yr old is now on her 5th stay in Juvenile detention...24 days this time. Some kids do not learn.

Last edited by beachmel; 01-16-2012 at 09:27 PM..
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Old 01-16-2012, 11:15 PM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,668 posts, read 71,387,412 times
Reputation: 35856
If the home owner deems the disorder in the room to be a danger to her life, health or property, she has a right to move it out of the home, but needs to protect it, such as by arranging to have it put in storage or in the custody of some other responsible person. Probably requiring advance notice, unless she can hold that the danger is imminent. Like if there are raccoons or other vermin living in there, or there are toxic, dangerous or illegal substances or materials, or fire exits are obstructed.
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Old 01-17-2012, 05:59 AM
 
Location: The Hall of Justice
25,907 posts, read 34,896,860 times
Reputation: 42368
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonChick View Post
Whose property is the house? The kid's? No? The mom's? Yes? Well then. The kid's bedroom is not the kid's property. Last I heard, the kid doesn't have any -right- to use his mother's property as his personal storage bin. Tell him he can keep anything and everything he wants that's his. Just not on her property. He's welcome to have it shipped to his father's house. Everything. Every last stitch of clothing, down to his dirty socks.

OR - he can pretend to be a near-adult, living in someone else's house, abide by the rules of the person who owns the property in which he resides, get a job, contribute to the household expenses, and THEN he can PAY RENT to use the property in which he currently resides, that is not his.
Sounds right to me!
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Old 01-17-2012, 09:03 AM
 
9,721 posts, read 5,676,440 times
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I think she should just close the door and forget about it until he's eighteen. Then he follows the rules or gets the boot. But don't touch his stuff.
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Old 01-17-2012, 09:13 AM
 
Location: Western Washington
8,004 posts, read 9,633,080 times
Reputation: 19408
Quote:
Originally Posted by tamajane View Post
I think she should just close the door and forget about it until he's eighteen. Then he follows the rules or gets the boot. But don't touch his stuff.
I disagree! If she considers his room to be a health (filth) or physical hazard (tripping) or fire hazard, she most certain can and probably SHOULD go in there and muck it out. Although my daughter always kept her room safe, my sons have not always done so. In the event of a fire, I would much rather have my child ticked off at me because I mucked out their room, than dead because I simply closed the door and forgot about it til they were 18. Teens can be less than safety conscious, especially where heaters/flammables and electrical outlets/flammables are concerned as well. Personally, I like to keep an eye on things and take care of problems before they occur.

If this kid is completely out of hand....there may also be things in there that she needs to find.
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Old 01-17-2012, 09:21 AM
 
15,819 posts, read 18,375,717 times
Reputation: 25586
Quote:
Originally Posted by thanksforthehelp View Post
A friend has a 16 year old child that is very uncooperative, getting into trouble, threatening her and her daughter and generally destroying their family life and home.

His bedroom is beyond a mess. It's literally difficult to move in the room because there is so much stuff piled everywhere. She has told him that she is going to go in and clean his room and get rid of everything.

He, of course, has stated that she has no right to touch his property. I think he actually has no right to any property in the house and that everything actually belongs to his mother. I believe she has the right to do whatever she pleases with "his" property.

The parents are divorced and the mother has full custody of the children. The father has no custody at all. He has now called and told her that she had better not take away anything from the child that he gave to his son, or he will take her to court. Again, I believe that she has the right to determine what happens to any property in her home. I believe the father has no right to tell her to leave it alone.

Of course, my opinion really means nothing. It comes down to the law. Anyone else here have experience with these issues? I just want to help her find factual information to determine what her rights are in her home. Any resources would be especially appreciated.

Thanks a lot.
She needs to take pics of the condition of the room. She also should consult her attorney because this father is undermining the mother. Which is against what the normal court rules in custody, and may even be emotional abuse. A parent has to be able to control the child in her custody, otherwise courts have to be involved. Father is not thinking of what is best for child, he is punishing Mom. She may need to take steps.....or last result...even give custody to the father. Her house, her rules. If Dad wants his stuff, he should have it at his house...period. Mom should take everything except the bed away, doors off. Kid needs to earn items back. Seek counseling from guidance counselors, or soc. services re; what Dad is doing. Kid has to behave, or Mom gets to pay off debts etc. til 18. Get the kid into some tough counseling asap.
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Old 01-17-2012, 09:24 AM
 
Location: Western Washington
8,004 posts, read 9,633,080 times
Reputation: 19408
Quote:
Originally Posted by JanND View Post
She needs to take pics of the condition of the room. She also should consult her attorney because this father is undermining the mother. Which is against what the normal court rules in custody, and may even be emotional abuse. A parent has to be able to control the child in her custody, otherwise courts have to be involved. Father is not thinking of what is best for child, he is punishing Mom. She may need to take steps.....or last result...even give custody to the father. Her house, her rules. If Dad wants his stuff, he should have it at his house...period. Mom should take everything except the bed away, doors off. Kid needs to earn items back. Seek counseling from guidance counselors, or soc. services re; what Dad is doing. Kid has to behave, or Mom gets to pay off debts etc. til 18. Get the kid into some tough counseling asap.
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Old 01-17-2012, 09:25 AM
 
Location: Brooklyn New York
15,214 posts, read 23,684,656 times
Reputation: 19795
My rule is as follows.

My house, I make the payments, I make the rules.
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Old 01-17-2012, 09:36 AM
 
15,819 posts, read 18,375,717 times
Reputation: 25586
Quote:
Originally Posted by icecoldhearted View Post
why can a parent who didn't buy some for a child take it away. What if the child is buying the things themselves and has a job paying for whatever it is they have? how can a parent take that from them, because i'm not understanding that.
Naw.....this kid isn't responsible enough to have a job. Any kid paying for his own things would appreciate them more.

Mom needs to lay down the law. And (ex) Dad should be backing her up! Instead of giving kid permission to disrespect his Mom. Dad is the male role model. Take his butt to court!! Otherwise Dad will be "Bailing" teen son out at some point.

Mom, talk to your divorce attorney, the court system works too! Sue your kid, let a judge tell him. There is CPS, or school counselors, where ever you need to get help straightening this teen out, believe me if you don't you will wish you had shortly....18yrs.

Do the right thing now, so you have a good relationship in future, it can happen. Teens need boundaries!! It can/does save their lives. Even rebelling teens need boundaries....and when they are older, they will thank you......It does happen.

Hang in there Mom. It was the hardest time in my life, and one of the hardest things that I ever had to do was call police on my own child. Thank god I did. I had to plead w/ courts to get help. Hopefully you can get this resolved w/out that.

I can appreciate your position, my ex used anything to torture me for years, and it make parenting twice as hard when that happens. They do have laws now, they can hold your ex responsible for your son's delinquency....tape calls, copy texts etc. go to your attorney. Maybe supervised visits will stop the ex before your son gets into real trouble.

Last edited by JanND; 01-17-2012 at 09:38 AM.. Reason: spacing
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Old 01-17-2012, 10:09 AM
 
9,721 posts, read 5,676,440 times
Reputation: 9583
It sounds like a messy room was the least of the problems here if the kid was threatening people. But if it's just a kid being "uncooperative" that is normal rebellion. Most teens are messy, especially boys, and if the stuff isn't piled against heaters or outlets, and food isn't spoiling there it's not a big deal. Went through this as a teen with my mother, it damaged the relationship permanently so I think mom should pick her battles.
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