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Old 06-18-2007, 08:55 AM
 
Location: beautiful North Carolina
7,574 posts, read 9,559,659 times
Reputation: 5505

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"The reality is most kids are just going to be regular people. We still need garbagemen (er, sanitation engineers) and police just as much as we need doctors and even more lawyers. People can achieve a satisfying, fulfilling life outside of their parents' fantasies and neurotic pushing - and isn't that what's most important?"


How true this is. I believe this applies to children in sports also. Some parents tend to live through their kids, and place way too much pressure on them. If I understood things right, Heathercp was talking about Elementary School level and probably doesn't have to worry about Organic Chemistry as of yet. Elementary school children and high school children have different needs, and so you really need to take this into account when searching for "the great school" for your child, so to speak. Elementary school children are still in the developmental stages, so there really is more to consider than just advanced placement classes.
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Old 06-18-2007, 11:55 AM
 
615 posts, read 1,306,782 times
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GREAT post! My daughter sounds a lot like your son as far as school attitude...she'd rather not be there/do homework, but does fine once she is there and gets decent grades(A's B's...Going into 5th gr.---She also has some special-needs, so that also is a concern of ours).

We're moving out of our NJ area for many reasons...schools among them. Our middle school is violent and our rating is VERY low on Greatschools.com( "2" on a scale of 1-10). Much of that has to do with school violence and very low test schools..So ANY school above a 2 is a step up for us.

I'm also a teacher, and I feel that MOST teachers at all schools try to do a good job and do their best for their kids(of course there is always 1 or 2 undedicated teachers at ALL schools).....so even a school with a 3, 4 or 5 rating most likely has the majority of teachers that are doing the best job possible.

I agree with the person who said A LOT Of it has to do with status. Parents like to say, whether they admit it or not, their child is going to the "best" school according to test-scores, on-line websites(Greatschools) and community reputation, mostly stemming from expensive neighborhood schools. Money=status.

But for us, basically ANY middle school other than the one our daughter will go to next year will be "better". I prefer a mix of kids for our daughter.... a good mix of race, socio-economic status, academic ability(not ALL gifted kids, not ALL special-needs kids etc.), culture, various neighborhoos etc.

GOOD LUCK and I hope your son is enjoying his summer vacation!
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Old 06-18-2007, 12:19 PM
 
Location: in a house
3,574 posts, read 12,848,033 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heathercp View Post
...I suppose it depends on the child whether or not they're really going to be that much better off in the long run for having gone to the "best" school. In our case, a safe environment, a place to make friends, an encouraging teacher... these are the things we wanted from a school.
That and involved parents - not "helicopters", but parents who read to their kids, help with (not do) homework, etc. It's been my observation that parents themselves also get secondary gain from telling every and any one where their kids are enrolled. My kids went to and graduated from public schools and all have college educations and (most important) jobs they love with benefits! and their own homes (yipeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee)!!!
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Old 06-18-2007, 01:49 PM
 
Location: Youngsville, NC
560 posts, read 2,564,458 times
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there are two possible equations . . .

(good school or bad school) + good parenting = good student
(good school or bad school) + bad parenting = bad student

The school could score high on aptitude tests win all sorts of awards and have a stellar reputation, if you don't get involved with your child's education and/or let him/her wander away from his/her studies they will not succeed, with of course a few exceptions to this rule.
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Old 06-18-2007, 01:55 PM
 
76 posts, read 237,679 times
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Default For all posters..

Just think about your graduating class in high school. Whether your school was "the best" or average, or worse, here is what I bet is true....
*** You have a some kids who went on to get GREAT jobs and be wealthy.
*** You have some kids who are middle class, happy and paying the bills.
*** You have some kids who are still sitting at the same barstool since the mid 80's.

If they all went to the same school, and it was all about the SCOOL, then why did they end up so different? Because, it's not all about the school in the end. There are many other factors, parental involvement and expectations being one.
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Old 06-18-2007, 02:02 PM
 
Location: Youngsville, NC
560 posts, read 2,564,458 times
Reputation: 310
Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeguard_bss View Post
Just think about your graduating class in high school. Whether your school was "the best" or average, or worse, here is what I bet is true....
*** You have a some kids who went on to get GREAT jobs and be wealthy.
*** You have some kids who are middle class, happy and paying the bills.
*** You have some kids who are still sitting at the same barstool since the mid 80's.

If they all went to the same school, and it was all about the SCOOL, then why did they end up so different? Because, it's not all about the school in the end. There are many other factors, parental involvement and expectations being one.
CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP
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Old 06-18-2007, 02:18 PM
 
Location: beautiful North Carolina
7,574 posts, read 9,559,659 times
Reputation: 5505
Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeguard_bss View Post
Just think about your graduating class in high school. Whether your school was "the best" or average, or worse, here is what I bet is true....
*** You have a some kids who went on to get GREAT jobs and be wealthy.
*** You have some kids who are middle class, happy and paying the bills.
*** You have some kids who are still sitting at the same barstool since the mid 80's.

If they all went to the same school, and it was all about the SCOOL, then why did they end up so different? Because, it's not all about the school in the end. There are many other factors, parental involvement and expectations being one.
LOL! I almost choked on a pretzel, too funny!
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Old 06-19-2007, 12:12 PM
 
76 posts, read 237,679 times
Reputation: 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeannie216 View Post
LOL! I almost choked on a pretzel, too funny!
AHHH! They must not have taught you "anti-pretzel choking measures at your school!"

And I have always said that I learned FAR more during summer vacations than I ever did in school!
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Old 06-19-2007, 04:54 PM
 
Location: Durham, NC
2,024 posts, read 5,194,641 times
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Absolutely agreed on all counts -- it's the involvement and behavior modelling of the parents, along with the student's innate drive, desire, and... hate to say it... gifts of intelligence, or lack thereof.

I was fortunate (growing up in a city, Orlando, that had very bad public schools) to have family that could afford to send me to private school from K-12.

My wife, OTOH, grew up in a decidedly working-class town in NH that had very bad school funding, no college prep curriculum (a couple of classes where you "could" take the AP if you wanted afterwards, but almost no one did), and where everyone assumed you would go to one of the two state liberal arts colleges or -- if you really stretched -- UNH. And she came from a working-class family herself.

Not only did we both get into (and attended) Harvard, but she kicked my butt on grades... one of just seven women in our class of 1,600 elected to Phi Beta Kappa her junior year, and now at a local law school on an all-expenses scholarship.

She didn't have helicopter parents -- just a mom who loved her dearly, told her she could be anything she wanted, and brought love and care into the household.

As someone who's worked in higher ed for the past ten years in a professional/managerial role, I'm more frightened every year by the growing number of 'zombie kids' I see, those who seem completely disengaged from their studies, whose parents ask far more questions at orientations than the students, and who ultimately are there because mom and dad said college was a "must" rather than from an innate sense of drive, desire, and work ethos.
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Old 06-19-2007, 05:24 PM
 
Location: Durham, NC
141 posts, read 617,349 times
Reputation: 50
To a certain extent, the school is irrelevant. If you're intelligent, then you can succeed; however, the mediocre student probably won't excel even under the best circumstances. My fiance and I are both in Duke getting our PhD's. I attended a very good private school in Manhattan, where the tuition rivaled my private undergraduate institution, whereas my fiance went to a mediocre (and I am being generous) public school in Pennsylvania. Despite my high school education, I see no discernible difference between our current academic abilities.

I suppose the argument can be made that people who attend elite private schools receive better educations and therefore have a better shot at succeeding and matriculating at Ivies, although this is pretty deceptive. The reason that most of the top private schools (this is conjecture on my part, but seems like a reasonable argument) have a large percentage of their graduating class going to Harvard et al is because if you do not perform, you are asked to leave. Therefore, the only people who are able to graduate are the one's who survived the weed-out process, and who possess the drive to succeed.

The private school system is markedly different than most public schools, as I am assuming that publics do not expel you for marginal, non-failing grades. Therefore, I am willing to go out on a limb and assume that even at the best public high schools (at least the ones that do not require an entrance exam), the Ivy matriculation percentage will never match the best private high schools.

My point is that success is largely dependent on the individual student, and not the student's immediate academic situation.
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