Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Pennsylvania
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 11-08-2011, 07:19 PM
 
4,684 posts, read 4,553,077 times
Reputation: 1588

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Velvet Jones View Post
You do realize that it was Sandusky that is accused of the crime?
Others have now been charged, including the director of the athletic program and a vice-president. And as I've said above, just because the police are saying they don't intend to charge JoePa at the moment doesn't mean he won't be charged later. This isn't just a small thing like fiddling grades to keep a "scholar" on the squad, after all.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 11-08-2011, 07:25 PM
 
2,538 posts, read 4,693,226 times
Reputation: 3356
Quote:
Originally Posted by squarian View Post
There is some evidence of moral turpitude (cough). In most academic institutions that's enough to break tenured profs, and certainly coaches.
Yes, but that still requires evidence. The problem I have with it is people assume it as up to JoePa to start some sort of investigation. Having worked for two decades in private industry and dealt with things similar, though much less disgusting and criminal, it is usually up to HR or corporate security to investigate. To me PSU did a horrible job here, which is why two of their staff have already been arrested. I'm not a JoePA or PSU fan, but I do believe in due process. Don't hang him based on perceived wrongs without knowing the facts. If his guilt was so clear then he would be in jail with the others.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-08-2011, 07:40 PM
 
Location: SouthEastern PeeAye
889 posts, read 2,561,114 times
Reputation: 407
Quote:
Originally Posted by carolinacool View Post
This. And I am also gobsmacked by the actions, or inactions, of the grad assistant in 2002. From what I understand, he walked in, saw something and left?! Who does that when you see a child being violated? My mind is spinning.
Agreed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Velvet Jones View Post
And you would be fired from your job. It is a common rule at large companies that employees are not allowed to call the police or report crimes on company premises, other than in emergency situations. Usually you are to report such incidents to either a supervisor or head of security. This would be further muddled by the fact that JoePa wasn't the actual witness and received the information second hand.

I'm kind of baffled by these calls for imprisonment and such. Joe hasn't been accused of any crime and the police have already said that based on the current known information that he would not be charged and in fact did the right thing.
On the report such incidents to either a supervisor or head of security, you are aware Mike McQueary, who per the GJ report was a witness to one incident, did neither? He had to telephone his father for advice on what to do. How it is that an adult, who is also a toughened athlete/former college quarterback, doesn't even know to stop a sexual assault on a child by an adult? The same thing happened with a janitor, he was too afraid to report something he witnessed, as were his coworkers.

These are the basis of the complaints and the outcry for a house cleaning and for heads to roll. JoePa may not have violated any laws, but he was responsible for this culture where multiple people did nothing, in fact were conditioned to do nothing, which in this case is almost the same as looking away.

Reading the GJ report, McQueary gets a slim amount of credit here, but not much. What kind of person turns and walks away from something like this?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-08-2011, 07:41 PM
 
4,684 posts, read 4,553,077 times
Reputation: 1588
Quote:
Originally Posted by Velvet Jones View Post
Don't hang him based on perceived wrongs without knowing the facts. If his guilt was so clear then he would be in jail with the others.

There's an ironic statement. "Wait for the evidence, but he'd got to be innocent because he hasn't been charged."

What if, in the course of the investigation, some new evidence provides grounds for a charge?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-08-2011, 08:12 PM
 
Location: southwestern PA
22,266 posts, read 47,198,180 times
Reputation: 47191
Quote:
Originally Posted by PeeAye Native View Post

Reading the GJ report, McQueary gets a slim amount of credit here, but not much. What kind of person turns and walks away from something like this?
Turns and walks away from the assault, but comes back when offered a full time coaching job the next year.
What kind of person does THAT?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-08-2011, 08:12 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,316 posts, read 120,209,612 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by Velvet Jones View Post
Yes, but that still requires evidence. The problem I have with it is people assume it as up to JoePa to start some sort of investigation. Having worked for two decades in private industry and dealt with things similar, though much less disgusting and criminal, it is usually up to HR or corporate security to investigate. To me PSU did a horrible job here, which is why two of their staff have already been arrested. I'm not a JoePA or PSU fan, but I do believe in due process. Don't hang him based on perceived wrongs without knowing the facts. If his guilt was so clear then he would be in jail with the others.
This is about child abuse, sexual abuse of children. The usual CYA stuff shoul not apply here.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-08-2011, 08:38 PM
 
7,112 posts, read 10,086,463 times
Reputation: 1781
Quote:
Originally Posted by PeeAye Native View Post
These are the basis of the complaints and the outcry for a house cleaning and for heads to roll. JoePa may not have violated any laws, but he was responsible for this culture where multiple people did nothing, in fact were conditioned to do nothing, which in this case is almost the same as looking away.

Reading the GJ report, McQueary gets a slim amount of credit here, but not much. What kind of person turns and walks away from something like this?
I've worked in a university environment and there's a lot of stuff that gets hushed up so as not to embarrass the university. Nothing as bad as this but some of it is pretty bad. I'm not justifying it, just saying that being a whistleblower can be bad if no one backs you up. It takes courage to step forward and say this is wrong and JoePa didn't. JoePa has more immunity from administrative backlash than anyone else at Penn State.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-08-2011, 09:17 PM
 
2,538 posts, read 4,693,226 times
Reputation: 3356
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
This is about child abuse, sexual abuse of children. The usual CYA stuff shoul not apply here.
I agree. I think the the GA should have went to the police at the time if he walked in on something happening. The sticky area is after the fact. How does an administration act on the word of a sole witness? In this case the PSU PD, who works for the university, should have been notified and have followed up. Apparently that didn't happen, or nothing came of the investigation.

BTW, just because it is abuse of children or even murder doesn't mean laws and legal procedure don't apply. That is what disturbs me about so many comments, both on this site and all over the net today. People are making nooses and lighting torches, ready to issue frontier justice. The case is 10 years old, no one is in immediate danger now. Take the time and do it right. If heads have to role in the end, even Joe Pa, so be it. Just make sure all of the i's are dotted and all of the T's crossed.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-08-2011, 10:55 PM
 
Location: North Oakland
9,150 posts, read 10,826,539 times
Reputation: 14503
Quote:
Originally Posted by Velvet Jones View Post
Fire him based on what?
Obviously, your reading comprehension isn't all it could be. You missed where I said:
Quote:
Originally Posted by jay5835 View Post
This is a story about a ten-year old (+/-) coverup of a child sex abuse scandal, maybe the biggest coverup ever not to originate in a Catholic rectory.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Velvet Jones View Post
What did you want him to do, storm in to Sandusky's office and drag him out of the building? What happens if it turned out to be false?
Basically, yes. And I am not getting that it's turning out to be false.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Velvet Jones View Post
Is your hatred of PSU and JoePa so great that you just can't wait to see him thrown in jail?
My "hatred of PSU and JoePa"? That's beyond laughable. Until yesterday, I had no feelings whatsoever for Penn State or "JoePa." I don't hate football teams that don't screw up CBS' Sunday night TV schedule, and I didn't know the universe contained a person named "JoePa" before Coachgate.
Moderator cut: orphaned

Last edited by Yac; 11-09-2011 at 04:29 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-08-2011, 11:07 PM
 
Location: southwestern USA
1,823 posts, read 2,117,723 times
Reputation: 2440
This is going to be a sad ending to an otherwise storybook career for Coach Paterno.

There is no doubt that he should have made the morally correct decision to notify the authorites after he discoved the alleged sex abuse accusations. It would have been an enormous burden to turn his friend and assistant in------it should have been done, but we need to put ourselves in his shoes and would we have been able to turn in a valued friend and co worker to the police???

Im not begging the question and evading the fact that in my opinion, he should have done the right thing. I just dont want this sad ending to his brilliant career taint the fact that his legacy to the school and to college football is enormous.

Listening to Matt Millen on Espn today was a difficult-----he agreed there was a morality gap here, but in a very articulate and passinate manner offerred that Paterno is a good man with a strong character. He agreed Penn State needed to clean house, but asked us not to bury Paterno----and I agree.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Settings
X
Data:
Loading data...
Based on 2000-2020 data
Loading data...

123
Hide US histogram


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Pennsylvania
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top