State Stores Are an Abomination (Philadelphia, Harrisburg: unemployment, purchasing, tax)

[thecoalman]

Originally Posted by Mr Yuk

Plus, privately owned stores will hurt the economy, because instead of a state store clerk making 11 bucks an hour, those jobs will be replaced by minimum wage jobs in private stores.

Not necessarily because you're going to have a variety of places to purchase from, simple stores that sell booze to upscale shops that will cater to afflunet people.

Really besides the point because you're robbing Peter to pay Paul. The clerk may make more than someone in the supermarket but they are doing it on my dime.

[Boompa]

This argument has been going on since the 1940s.

[Duderino]

Originally Posted by Ohiogirl81

See what I mean?

I never claimed that there were not things that could be changed about the system (particularly related to cronyism, inefficiency and lack of quality customer service) and am certainly not opposed to some significant restructuring.

However, those who make state store privatization out to be one of our state's most pressing issues are just absurd. Bluntly, there are plenty more things in PA to get much more frustrated about. To me, and many others, this is pretty low on the totem poll.

[pman]

Originally Posted by Duderino

I never claimed that there were not things that could be changed about the system (particularly related to cronyism, inefficiency and lack of quality customer service) and am certainly not opposed to some significant restructuring.

However, those who make state store privatization out to be one of our state's most pressing issues are just absurd. Bluntly, there are plenty more things in PA to get much more frustrated about. To me, and many others, this is pretty low on the totem poll.

I disagree, it's pretty high. what's worse, most people don't like it, yet they still can't kill it, what makes you think they'll be able to tackle issues where the public is more divided?

Originally Posted by Mr Yuk

Liquor store clerks make between 10 and 11 bucks an hour, and most are part-time....hardly exorbitant salaries, and I highly doubt that includes an "outrageous" pension.

no, I'm sure the outrageous pensions is in addition to $11/hr plus benefits and not having to be good at your job, or even competent.

Originally Posted by Mr Yuk

And somehow I would venture that a state store clerk is better trained than some dumpy privately owned corner liquor store, and less likely to be selling to underage buddies.

and yet PA isn't significantly different than other states in drinking problems.

Originally Posted by Mr Yuk

Honestly, I think if someone drinks enough that they find the state stores to be incovenient and overpriced, they may want to look into a 12 step program

and here it goes....you may want to come clean and admit you're a shill rather than someone capable of honest debate.

Where I live, there are multiple state stores within 5 minutes of my house, and most have convenient hours and are open on Sunday.

Originally Posted by Mr Yuk

Plus, privately owned stores will hurt the economy, because instead of a state store clerk making 11 bucks an hour, those jobs will be replaced by minimum wage jobs in private stores.

really, how do you know? $10/hr is entirely attainable in the private sector. there will also be more stores which means more people paying rent, more sales which means more revenue, and landlords will have to compete for stores rather than call their political friends. let's face it, you work as a state employee, you don't drink, and probably insult your own customers.

[greg42]

Originally Posted by Duderino

It has an extremely negligible effect on our state's quality of life, especially now that beer/wine is sold in many grocery stores in PA. It's just one of those quirky PA things that basically everyone gets used to.

Beer wasn't under control of the state stores, and wine is not sold in grocery stores.

The effect is has is that there's no competition. No stores that can specialize, no stores that can make a name for having good service, etc. They have to be all the same, uniformly mediocre to bad with employees who know squat, often don't even know where things are in their own store.

[Ohiogirl81]

Originally Posted by Mr Yuk

I would venture that a state store clerk is better trained than some dumpy privately owned corner liquor store, and less likely to be selling to underage buddies.

Apparently you've never been to a private wine shop or private liquor store?

Where I live, there are multiple state stores within 5 minutes of my house, and most have convenient hours and are open on Sunday.

And they all sell at the same prices. There's no competition.

those jobs will be replaced by minimum wage jobs in private stores.

Doubtful. Again, since you've never been to a private liquor store, you have no idea how well trained or how specialized the employees are.

[PeterRabbit]

Originally Posted by Mr Yuk

Liquor store clerks make between 10 and 11 bucks an hour, and most are part-time....hardly exorbitant salaries, and I highly doubt that includes an "outrageous" pension. Probably no pension if they're a part timer. And there's definitely no outrageous benefits....for any state employee. They pay for their health insurance, and its an HMO. And somehow I would venture that a state store clerk is better trained than some dumpy privately owned corner liquor store, and less likely to be selling to underage buddies.

Honestly, I think if someone drinks enough that they find the state stores to be incovenient and overpriced, they may want to look into a 12 step program. Where I live, there are multiple state stores within 5 minutes of my house, and most have convenient hours and are open on Sunday.

Plus, privately owned stores will hurt the economy, because instead of a state store clerk making 11 bucks an hour, those jobs will be replaced by minimum wage jobs in private stores.

Nothing you say is true. Provide us with links.

[Mr Yuk]

Here is the job posting for liquor store clerk...almost all positions are part timers making a whopping 11.34 an hour...they're not getting rich: http://www.portal.state.pa.us/portal...toreClerks.htm

Only 3 counties initially hire full timers, the rest are part timers. No pensions for part timers, and part time state employees must pay more for their health insurance than full timers if they want insurance.

I don't get how people think that the state store clerks are "unknowledgable." Like some Arab or Indian that can barely speak English running some crappy corner liquor store in another state is some expert, or some teenager running a cash register in a supermarket. If you want an expert, go to a winery rather than either a state-owned or privately-owned liquor store.

There are much more pressing issues in this state than where you buy your booze.

[julian17033]

I've lived in quite a few states where the sale of beer and wine was available in grocery stores and liquor was available at privately owned stores.

I have lived in various parts of the state since moving to PA in 2009.

I've been to many state run stores and have found the selection of liquor to be on par with other states.

Wine not so much.

I'm not a wine drinker but I can see that specialized wine shops are needed in order to provide the best selection and the best advice.

I frankly don't care one way or the other concerning state run stores.

I've never had an issue with staff nor have I had an issue with the selection of the whiskey and bourbon that I like.

[PAhippo]

The OP talked about the rudeness of the employees. I don't think it's the state stores that cause it. Must be a city thing because I've been in several over the yrs and have never had a problem; employees have been very friendly and helpful.

As for changing the system, (my opinion) you're tilting at windmills when there's dragons to slay.