Time for PA to become right to work? (Philadelphia, Penn: employment, inspection)

[wanneroo]

I've long said the way the state is set up with unions has held it back decades. I remember thinking in 1990's that it would change when the old guard started to die off. It's getting there.

My uncles and other relatives were all in the coal and steel unions in western PA. I watched in the 1980's as they repeatedly striked for more wages and eventually these companies couldn't afford it and went out of business. They all ended up out of jobs and all have been bouncing around in a variety of work that never seems to last since then. So much for the union when an industry is destroyed. Ironically they all have stories about how inefficient it was working under a union.

The Hostess saga recently is a great example of the inefficiencies the unions smoother companies with.

Time to change and make PA a right to work state and get the unions out of the mix. The state will have a chance at a future that will attract investment and business rather than unions driving up costs and being a funding machine for the democratic party.

[Magritte25]

Originally Posted by PAhippo

I agree with Bloom. There was a time unions were useful. I don't believe they are anymore. The dues don't benefit anyone but the union bosses.

Get rid of the unions and just watch your rights dissipate.

[thecoalman]

Originally Posted by Magritte25

Get rid of the unions and just watch your rights dissipate.

What about the rights of a private individual and a private company?

Why should a third party be able to inject themselves in an agreement between the two?

[wanneroo]

Originally Posted by thecoalman

What about the rights of a private individual and a private company?

Why should a third party be able to inject themselves in an agreement between the two?

You have to remember in the mind of a statist only collectivism matters and the unity of the group think organization or government. To have that they have to minimize the individual and his dreams and desires and squash him down especially if he is a good worker or producer. Private individual rights and private companies mean nothing to them in the advancement of statism and collectivism.

I've seen unions in action throughout my life, mostly in PA and I've never seen them do anything but skim and enrich themselves, while putting their slavish workers out of work.

I think it's great if employees want to have an organization to represent themselves, but I also don't believe they should have to ability to force people to be in their union, nor be able to hold businesses hostage.

Unions may have had their place over 100 years ago, when communication and transportation were not what they are today and most people never traveled further than 20 miles from their house their whole lives. Now it's very easy to quit jobs and move anywhere you want and people do all the time. Unions are an old relic like the horse and buggy or the rotary dial telephone. The people clinging to the unions cling to the past.

I think PA has some difficult decisions to make going forward. Back in 1944, New York State was the most populated state and considered the best state in the country to do business in. Now it is ranked #50 out of all states to do business in. Do we want to move into the 21st century and attract business investment or continue to live under archaic old rules and act like this is still 1950?

[Magritte25]

I don't think people should be forced into unions. But then they shouldn't benefit from union negotiations either. Please, allow them to get non-union pay, non-union benefits and non-union rights.

Unions champion the rights of the individual over the rights of a corporation. As they should.

[wanneroo]

Originally Posted by Magritte25

I don't think people should be forced into unions. But then they shouldn't benefit from union negotiations either. Please, allow them to get non-union pay, non-union benefits and non-union rights.

Unions champion the rights of the individual over the rights of a corporation. As they should.

Unions champion the rights of the unions and how to line their pockets. The individual matters little to them. If the individual did mean so much as you say they would not oppose right to work.

Also corporations are people. Without people they don't exist. They are merely another form of a legal arrangement for a business. Lefties try to make out corporations as these faceless big meenie entities when they are nothing of the sort.

[Magritte25]

Originally Posted by wanneroo

Unions champion the rights of the unions and how to line their pockets. The individual matters little to them. If the individual did mean so much as you say they would not oppose right to work.

Do you even understand WHY unions oppose right to work???

Originally Posted by wanneroo

Also corporations are people. Without people they don't exist. They are merely another form of a legal arrangement for a business. Lefties try to make out corporations as these faceless big meenie entities when they are nothing of the sort.

No, corporations are not people. They are not Americans and they are not entitled to rights like people are. They are classified differently because they are different.

[pman]

Originally Posted by Magritte25

Do you even understand WHY unions oppose right to work???

because it weakens their ability to force people into union thus reducing their rolls.

Originally Posted by Magritte25

No, corporations are not people. They are not Americans and they are not entitled to rights like people are. They are classified differently because they are different.

agreed 100%. they should be banned from all political activity and taxation.

[thecoalman]

Originally Posted by Magritte25

I don't think people should be forced into unions. But then they shouldn't benefit from union negotiations either. Please, allow them to get non-union pay, non-union benefits and non-union rights.

I'd agree they shouldn't be tied to the union contract but that works both ways and as pointed out the unions will never agree to that.

[bolillo_loco]

Originally Posted by track2514

Pman

It was a news story I saw here in Erie and the worker in Fort Worth said Taco Bell paid $10 per hour and GE paid $10 per hour. I never investigated the validity of what the guy was saying, I just thought it was interesting that any worker would be seriously considering Taco Bell over GE. I guess I was just surprised when I saw the story, because having mostly lived in unionized states, I have never even thought that the people in these right to work states might not really be that excited about these "new" manufacturing jobs that are coming to their area, especially if the pay is similar to unskilled work.

To add to this, I watched quite a few jobs close up in Pennsylvania, and move to right to work states. The lion's share of factories that closed and moved south took place during the 1980s - 1990s. However, it still happens to this day. Without exception, the jobs paid considerably less than what they did up here in Pennsylvania. There were a few people that went along to help get things going. The major problems was the type of workers that they attracted because the significantly lower wages didn't pay much more than fast food jobs, so the average person figures why take a semi-skilled blue collar job that has a lot of responsibilities and requires a lot of specific skill sets be learned, when they can just flip burgers or wait on customers in fast food joints for the same amount of pay. Quite frankly, I agree. As far as being lazy goes, I've never seen one of these low paying jobs go on to pay considerably more once I learned specialized skills. All that generally happens is that my workload increases exponentially, and at the end of the year, I'm lucky to get a nickle an hour raise, so it makes more sense to just work a primitive brain job that's easier for the same amount of pay, and I already know how to do most of the work. Many of the factories that moved south couldn't find the skilled workers they wanted due to the low pay, so the company struggled along for a year our two and eventually just went overseas because even paying minimum wage cannot compete with manufacturing in a foreign county devoid of laws, regulations, and taxes.

Quite frankly, I'm sort of sick of the union bashing. Since unions have been long busted since the 1980s, and much of the work has already gone overseas, we're seeing all that unions fought for disappearing. Anybody that's worked in this nation since 1980 or longer can see just how wages have been out paced by inflation, too many people competing for the same job because our country's hemorrhaged so many jobs that 25% of all Americans are now redundant, and most of the right to work states have numerous issues other than the union that cause factories to leave the north. Up here, high taxes, strict regulations, and numerous other problems drive businesses out of the area. Furthermore, right to work states offer up all sorts of incentives like generous tax and utility cuts for deal sweeteners.

Furthermore, we lost the lion's share of our blue collar work to foreign countries. If the average American would take pride in their nation and only buy American, we wouldn't be discussing this. Nobody cares about how corrupt politics is, those that do are stuck on stupid about left vs right, when they are in fact both striving for the same agenda, and the bread and circuses keeps everybody distracted. I bet more time and energy is spent watching super bowl Sunday by the average person than they put into selecting politicians, reading up on agendas, corruption, and the like during the entire year.

The only shops that should not be union are ones that are paid by tax dollars. Teachers, city workers, cops and the like should not be unionized. They're public servants. If we were to take away all the unions that are involved with public servants, we would have very few unions left. Private unions have long ago been busted by Americans that can't read a label and buy things that are clearly tagged "Made in the USA."