Just how bad is Harrisburg? (Lancaster, York: crime, house, neighborhoods)

[Debaroo]

Thanks to all who gave me info..I highly doubt if I am moving to Shermans Dale after hearing all this. I don't want to live in the middle of redneck country and have to deal with shot guns and white trash wackos. Sounds like alot of ignorance there. It's a shame, I really thought I found someplace decent to live. I was going there Friday to look at a house, thanks for saving me the trip.

[BackToTheCityMouse]

Originally Posted by Debaroo

More great info..THANKS..Now I have a few questions. Why is there trouble getting someone to work on your house, such as repair men and contractors. Is it because there is a shortage of them OR they just don't want to work for newcomers.

We found that calls or messages were not returned by many tradespeople if they did not recognize your last name as one from a local family. (One of the editors of the county weekly used her maiden name hyphenated with her husband's name, not because she was feminist but so she kept her local gal status -- and wrote about the coolness of doing this in one of her newspaper columns. She thought it was perfectly natural that locals prefer to deal only with other locals. Ugh!) We did find a wonderful car dealership where the owners and mechanics were truly 'salt of the earth' honest and skilled people. The well driller dude was also friendly and responsive. We could not get appliances serviced though -- had to call Sears in State College after trying to get someone to call us back for 3 weeks. Sears had a guy over the next day!

Originally Posted by debaroo

My husband is a home improvement contractor and is retiring in about 5 years but hope to get his businesss re-established in Perry County and work in the Carlisle/H'burg area until then. If those contratcors there are not working because they don't like newcomers in the neigborhood they must be total idiots. I would go by the mighty buck, everyones money is green.

But that is coastal thinking Not that I think your view is wrong. I was shocked that our money wasn't perceived as 'green' enough.

At the time we moved my husband was telecommuting to his same job for a tiny engineering company located in West Chester (he's a hardware/software design engineer). When that company lost most of its business to Asian competitors, we found out about the supposed demand for qualified tech professionals in central PA. Don't know if the same slammed doors in the face would result if your husband tried to set up biz here, but it is possible. If you folks already have business connections here or relatives going back 3 generations, you won't have a problem I expect. Otherwise, you are taking a chance.

Originally Posted by debaroo

My husband has had so many customers in the past 35+ years but soon as new people came in the area, NY'ers and people from all over invaded NJ like NJ invades PA LOL , the old faithful customers go by who the cheapest contractor is. They are no longer loyal.

That's what happened to us in the 1980s. New Yorkers invaded Mercer County. Farms disappeared and became subdivision sprawl and the traffic became impossible. We moved south to Burlington County to escape. Worked out OK for me while I was working evenings, but daytime commutes were horrible. I was working in Princeton, and living in Burlington County (east of Medford Lakes). My employer (a fortune 10 company) refused to allow flex time. In fact, I was constantly hassled about the fact that I purchased a home over 40 miles away. (Anywhere you live and work there are issues, just different ones ) Originally I was working evenings (in the data center) and driving was pretty much a mile per minute. When I got promoted to cubicle world, the daytime commute averaged about 2 hours -- and over 3 hours on Mondays, Thursdays, and Fridays during summer from the heavy Philly traffic crossing my route headed for the shore. A nightmare!

Originally Posted by debaroo

It suprises me that any repairman in Perry would shun newcomers when it comes to money, IF that is the case. Where did you work at that took 3 hours one way, that must have been hell. I live in Hillsborough, my sister lives in Hamilton, which I am sure your familar with. "Booze, firearms and motor vehicles"..where am I moving to anyway..what kind of place is it that people drive around drunk with guns? Please tell me more, this is the only forum I can depend on.

To clarify, our home was in Juniata County, but it's pretty likely that many parts of Perry are similar. The few people I knew slightly from Sherman's Dale were cool, but I guess I would have never gotten to know anyone who truly shunned outsiders.

Unfortunately, some people are driving around drunk anywhere you might live. In rural PA most folks do own guns, and often have them in the vehicle (it makes sense to be armed if your area doesn't have a local police force, and the state cops can be 30 minutes or more away). I'm not suggesting that many people are intoxicated and shooting stuff up. But a few incidents I found rather shocking -- the worst was a guy chasing his ex-wife's car in his truck, shooting at her out the window driving on SR35 towards Selinsgrove comes to mind (not in Perry County). I mean, who was keeping track of where those bullets were going?

[BackToTheCityMouse]

Originally Posted by Debaroo

What happened when you got "shaken down for a bribe"?

The attorney for the seller was a local elected official. He insisted that we, the buyers, pay his fee! We thought it was a joke because who doesn't know that the buyer and seller have to pay their own attorneys? But he insisted, and refused to complete the transaction unless we wrote him a check. We were gonna walk out, but our real estate agent paid him -- wrote him a check right on the spot!

The sellers had moved out of state years ago leaving the house empty, and we never met them. But the wife had called the electric company to turn power off days before the closing (luckily we had called them first and our power never went out). She also had left a set of keys with her family. They got in during the closing and sawed off valves on a water tank in the basement that flooded it with 5 feet of water (which was not there during the walk thru). Oh, and they took the sump pump away with them, heh. Our first evening in the house was a mad dash to the local K-Mart for new locks and a new sump pump.

It was kinda funny in a sad sort of way...when I wondered to my husband if he could hear something like water waves under our feet in the living room! Not exactly "howdy neighbor"

[BackToTheCityMouse]

Originally Posted by Debaroo

Thanks to all who gave me info..I highly doubt if I am moving to Shermans Dale after hearing all this. I don't want to live in the middle of redneck country and have to deal with shot guns and white trash wackos. Sounds like alot of ignorance there. It's a shame, I really thought I found someplace decent to live. I was going there Friday to look at a house, thanks for saving me the trip.

It's supposed to be warm here this weekend, so if you don't mind spending the time (and $$$ for the gas) maybe you should come out and have a look. Relocating -- as all things in life -- really is Your Mileage May Vary. Our unpleasant experiences are things that happened to us.

After reading here, you can look at the area without mistaking it for Mayberry RFD or Hooterville (of Green Acres fame). You don't have to give up on your plan...just keep your eyes open when you visit and give yourselves time to think things over before committing to the move.

[Debaroo]

Thanks A MILLION,Backtothecitymouse...I was leary about going that area from the start. I like country but they sounds nuts there. My husband is a hunter/fisherman but not a redneck. He would have liked that area but he needs work too. I read that Perry County is #1 redneck county in PA. I always thought redneck applied to the south, boy was I wrong. You were a angel sent with this info. Mind you I don't believe everything I hear but this site is excellent for info and your a Jersey gal so I know you know our area here and what you are talking about there. I live 20 min. from Princeton, I can only imagine the traffic you hit when you worked here. It's awful on Rt. 1 rush hour.

We used to go up by Lake Wallenpaupack area and several towns below there to camp. Pococo area is beautiful, so is Bucks County. Too much snow up there tho in the Pokes. I have changed our destination and going to try Delaware/MD border. Maybe the rednecks there are better LMAO AKA "Pineys". I knew it was too good to be true there in Shermans Glen, the house was on Woodridge Circle. That would be a nice scernario to tell my visitors. "When you pass the trailer park make a left at the prison and my house is 2 miles on the right"!!!!!!!!!!!!

That sucks about your locks and sump pump. Bad right from the start. Are you heading to the city and moving out soon? I just want someplace normal, few acres, trees around and normal people. There has to be someplace. Maybe DE, I can be down the shore at the same time! Normal people???-that's hard to come by!

[openless]

i mean... perry county... there was a killing where a girl killer her lesbian lover like in 2006 or 2007 that was front page news... and it is true there are all sorts of minor crimes... yeah i think the driving the lawnmower down the street while DUI might have been a stretch, but it could happen. there are a few trailer parks in that area, its not bad, beleive it or not, they have had a lot of development in the past 10 years, especially in shermans dale and cove area. they have apartments in that area too. i mean in the sense that you wont be shot at or robbed, but you will have to put up with minor nuisance problems liek that. yeah drunk hillbillies shooting their rifles off. beleive it of not, in perry county... the most commonly reported crime is like ... rape... usually between babysitters or family memebers watching kids or something. its almost always a 50 year old uncle molested a 10 year old girl, or a 22 year old furnished alcohol to minors. always stupid stuff like that. alcohol seems to be a big factor.

i think i can kind of agree with what someoen said about 'if your an outsider visiting' they will accept you, just dont plan on moving there and changing everyone's way of thinking. you you want to join a church or afire company and get to know your neighbors, just with a hello or maybe a baked goodie.

perry county is nice and in the mountains, very beautiful... theres just those small minor problems that you 'might' encounter.

if you like i could email you some pictures, im on my laptop and dont have any...... its's really not bad at all, but yeah it kind of is semi-hill billy country.

[Debaroo]

Originally Posted by openless

i mean... perry county... there was a killing where a girl killer her lesbian lover like in 2006 or 2007 that was front page news... and it is true there are all sorts of minor crimes... yeah i think the driving the lawnmower down the street while DUI might have been a stretch, but it could happen. there are a few trailer parks in that area, its not bad, beleive it or not, they have had a lot of development in the past 10 years, especially in shermans dale and cove area. they have apartments in that area too. i mean in the sense that you wont be shot at or robbed, but you will have to put up with minor nuisance problems liek that. yeah drunk hillbillies shooting their rifles off. beleive it of not, in perry county... the most commonly reported crime is like ... rape... usually between babysitters or family memebers watching kids or something. its almost always a 50 year old uncle molested a 10 year old girl, or a 22 year old furnished alcohol to minors. always stupid stuff like that. alcohol seems to be a big factor.

i think i can kind of agree with what someoen said about 'if your an outsider visiting' they will accept you, just dont plan on moving there and changing everyone's way of thinking. you you want to join a church or afire company and get to know your neighbors, just with a hello or maybe a baked goodie.

perry county is nice and in the mountains, very beautiful... theres just those small minor problems that you 'might' encounter.

if you like i could email you some pictures, im on my laptop and dont have any...... its's really not bad at all, but yeah it kind of is semi-hill billy country.

I don't think a uncle molesting his 10 year old niece is "stupid stuff", that wacko redneck pervert should be in jail. I wouldn't move there if they gave me a house. Sounds like good audience members for "Jerry Springer" . Thanks for offering the pictures but I pass on this one. They sound like a bunch of losers. I'll stick to the NJ/DE area. Thanks alot for your info

[onmywaytoPA]

Dear Debaroo -- I am an architect and moving home to Carlisle where I grew up. I can assure you that there will be PLENTY of work for your husband if he is an honest worker. We bough a place we will be making improvements to, and after my mother died, we did some cleanup of her house to get it ready for sale. There is room for more and better contractors, as just a few people have a lock of a lot of that work.

Our family moved to the area in 1957, and it took a long time to feel at home. I think the advice you have had here is right. Keep your own counsel and make your own way. Don't expect open welcoming arms but rather just quietly go about your own business. Soon enough, you will be the establishment. To be honest, I think Central PA is in the midst of transformation, and the old guard is falling fast. There is fear of change, which newcomers represent, so just keep your head down.

I would not worry too much about crime and violence but rather be normally prudent. The rural areas are always deceiving, wherever you are. They seem so peaceful, but they can have their problems. (Remember that movie "Deliverance" that played upon this theme?) Don't make yourself crazed over this. Perry County is utterly beautiful. Come enjoy it!

[Debaroo]

Originally Posted by onmywaytoPA

Dear Debaroo -- I am an architect and moving home to Carlisle where I grew up. I can assure you that there will be PLENTY of work for your husband if he is an honest worker. We bough a place we will be making improvements to, and after my mother died, we did some cleanup of her house to get it ready for sale. There is room for more and better contractors, as just a few people have a lock of a lot of that work.

Our family moved to the area in 1957, and it took a long time to feel at home. I think the advice you have had here is right. Keep your own counsel and make your own way. Don't expect open welcoming arms but rather just quietly go about your own business. Soon enough, you will be the establishment. To be honest, I think Central PA is in the midst of transformation, and the old guard is falling fast. There is fear of change, which newcomers represent, so just keep your head down.

I would not worry too much about crime and violence but rather be normally prudent. The rural areas are always deceiving, wherever you are. They seem so peaceful, but they can have their problems. (Remember that movie "Deliverance" that played upon this theme?) Don't make yourself crazed over this. Perry County is utterly beautiful. Come enjoy it!

Nice info but I'm not going near the whole area. I won't keep my "head down" and hide from anyone, espically some derelict redneck or anyone else that lives there. Good luck with your move

[Checkers]

As a central Jersey transplant living in Susquehanna township, I would say that the Harrisburg area is quite similar to central NJ about 10-20 years ago.

Harrisburg City reminds me a lot of Somerville with a dash of Plainfield - both good and bad. However, I think Harrisburg is a little bigger than both towns combined. It is the county seat and the state capitol, and just like any growing city, there is no shortage of construction projects and road closings.

The beltway consists of Routes 81, 83 and 581, and like 287, 22 and 78 back then, is always under construction and traffic usually sucks too - especially on Fridays, starting around lunchtime.

Your choice of real estate varies greatly and, for the most part, is a good investment. Since relocating here, real estate prices have increased about 10-15% per year while still being affordable. There is a huge selection to choose from too. The market can support the million dollar McMansion and the $20k row home and you can probably find both within a 10 minute drive of each other.

My wife and I have no children, so schools are not important to us. However, taxes are. For the most part, when compared to NJ, there are a lot more taxes out here, but all of the combined taxes don't even come close to what you're probably paying in NJ. Also, if you do relocate to the area, expect to save some on your insurance coverage(s). We just received our annual auto insurance bill and it was well under $700 for the year. We have better coverage and newer cars than we had in NJ too.

There is plenty of work available and, depending on your career path, you should be able to maintain your NJ salary and benefits. But, as others pointed out, major manufacturing companies are being forced south or overseas by their stockholders. So, trade, service related or government positions probably would be more stable and readily available.

After 7 years of living here, there are still no real shopping malls to speak of. The former "East" mall has gone under some major renovations, but it still is nothing like the Commons or Woodbridge Center. Perhaps, picture a nice Menlo Park Mall before it expanded and upgraded. Expect to travel some distance for anything better.

I think central NJ had a lot more to offer when it comes to entertainment. But, this area is catching up here rather quickly and, perhaps passing NJ. Just remember though, there's nothing like the Jersey shore or a NJ transit ride into NYC.

Checkers