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I don't see the fiscally irresponsible saying anything of the sort; they fully enjoy life and couldn't care less what responsible people do or how they live.
However, I do wish to point out that among wage-earners, unless you are in one of the bizarre fields like finance, the "successful" person generally won't have much free time. Big Business seems pretty unified in the belief that if you make over $100,000 a year, you should be at work at least 80 hours a week, and on the phone the rest of the time. This is particularly true in fields where the "work" covers 24 hours a day (like a power plant): often there is still only one "shift" even though the plant runs 24/7/52.
I just wish that modern corporate America would stop taking advantage of the fact that labor has NO power in our economy, and making anyone who earns a decent salary work twice the hours of previous generations. When every business in the industry does the same thing, you can't even hope to move to a different job (even if that were possible). Our generation went straight from "You have to work 80 hours a week to pay your dues," to "You're in charge now, so you better arrive at 6 am and don't leave until midnight, because every minute the plant is down or not at peak capacity, it's YOUR fault."
I never thought I see the day where, after 25 years of experience and getting a relatively high position in the corporation, you STILL have to work 80 hours a week and are only allowed to take 2 weeks of vacation out of the 4 to 6 weeks you technically earned, but that day is here. The rank of super-paid executives in a 10,000 person corporation is limited to the top 100 jobs--and those are ALL non-productive jobs that have nothing to do with providing the "product."
We have created a reality where the hardest workers sacrifice everything, while those who work "once in a while" are equalized by the tax structure and other subsidies. I wouldn't even recommend that young adults work hard to get ahead in our society. They won't be rewarded for it; they'll simply lose all the time and energy of youth, and be no better off later.
It's pretty hard to enjoy life when one or both of you have almost NO time off, and the time you do have off is so filled with stress and anxiety and pent-up frustration, that half of it is miserable too.
How about just even this: I don't derive enjoyment out of owning the latest doodad or ipoop or fancy shoe. It's not fun for me. I don't need them, I don't use them, and it just turns out being something I have to look after and take care of.
Forget finances...why can't people just acknowledge a difference in taste?
I think I have an ipoop and can't figure out how it works. **** I paid a lot of money for that too.
What do you mean you don't socialize with them? Most people are like this. Aside from a couple of friends and my immediate family, I am totally surrounded by spendaholics. Especially at work. I sit there minding my own business, and people who don't make a tenth of what I do enjoy making derisive comments about how I should spend money just because I can.
Buy a new phone. Buy a new truck. Buy an iPad! Go out to eat more! Buy a home theater!
Maybe if I ever sound like I have a snotty attitude (though I usually just shrug or whatever), it's because I am constantly being bombarded by these fiscal morons and their obnoxious opinions.
No, I don't want your stupid iPhone. But yes...I will probably upgrade to first class on my way to The Four Seasons Hualalai.
You are right most people are like this. I wouldn't have many friends at all if I didn't socialize with the over spenders. I don't think they bring nothing to the table if they are deep down good people that I enjoy being around. My financial stuff is kept as confidential as I can keep it. Bragging about how frugal you are is in just as much poor taste as bragging about what you have. And it's no one's business anyhow.
I don't see the fiscally irresponsible saying anything of the sort; they fully enjoy life and couldn't care less what responsible people do or how they live..
Oh -- I Have Examples....
I had a purse that's over 20 years old. I carried that thing until the bitter end, and I spent a year looking for a replacement. By the time I found the new one, the old one's strap started disconnecting constantly. (let's just say I have wild requirements and restrictions in a purse)
For five years I was chided about this bag by a friend. My attitude was that it worked and I loved it. She wouldn't give it up. When we went shopping -- rarely, because I hate it -- she'd take to the bags and try to get me to buy a Coach or some other thing. She wouldn't listen.
My crazy bag that I spent 50 bucks on lasted TWENTY YEARS. She's got a whole closetful of huge bags that she uses for a season and then never uses them again -- at the cost of thousands, since she only buys Coach or Fendi or Dooney.
My next bag was 135 bucks. About three years into that bag -- thefts increased where I worked, to the point women were getting knocked in the head for their purses.... so I went purse free.
We have created a reality where the hardest workers sacrifice everything, while those who work "once in a while" are equalized by the tax structure and other subsidies. I wouldn't even recommend that young adults work hard to get ahead in our society. They won't be rewarded for it; they'll simply lose all the time and energy of youth, and be no better off later.
True dat.
I don't know why so many people took out college loans when the economy was supposedly doing well and it seemed like a good idea when
that same college education would have been free through financial aid and pell grants to other people that did not take loans out.
I'm not sure why people are so stressed out about having medical insurance when someone without it, or an illegal immigrant can just walk into an emergency room, while having an emergency and have the state pick up the bill because they can't pay it.
Why do people bother trying to pay off credit card debt and other bills whent he federal government sanctions the discharging of it through Chapter 7 bankruptcy.
Working 50-70 hours a week as a "supervisor" and making more money only to get taxed at a higher rate and then worked into the ground until you get some kind of medical problem from all of the stress and don't have a life, when someone working 30 hours a week can maintain the same standard of living, with the help of section 8 housing assistance, food stamps and other social welfar programs that basically equalize their lifestyle with someone that actual works and produces.
Over the last few decades, our own government through social engineering, (and the tax code) has created a world where it is hard to differentiate between people that work hard and earn the things they have and those that chose to barely get by. So when this nation goes through a social stratification phase where it becomes the top 5% the lowest 5% and then the remaining 90% all lumped into the middle like rats in a cage fighting for what little remains, it will all become obvious. It was part of the plan. Wake up people - the threat is real.
I don't see the fiscally irresponsible saying anything of the sort; they fully enjoy life and couldn't care less what responsible people do or how they live.
However, I do wish to point out that among wage-earners, unless you are in one of the bizarre fields like finance, the "successful" person generally won't have much free time. Big Business seems pretty unified in the belief that if you make over $100,000 a year, you should be at work at least 80 hours a week, and on the phone the rest of the time. This is particularly true in fields where the "work" covers 24 hours a day (like a power plant): often there is still only one "shift" even though the plant runs 24/7/52.
I just wish that modern corporate America would stop taking advantage of the fact that labor has NO power in our economy, and making anyone who earns a decent salary work twice the hours of previous generations. When every business in the industry does the same thing, you can't even hope to move to a different job (even if that were possible). Our generation went straight from "You have to work 80 hours a week to pay your dues," to "You're in charge now, so you better arrive at 6 am and don't leave until midnight, because every minute the plant is down or not at peak capacity, it's YOUR fault."
I never thought I see the day where, after 25 years of experience and getting a relatively high position in the corporation, you STILL have to work 80 hours a week and are only allowed to take 2 weeks of vacation out of the 4 to 6 weeks you technically earned, but that day is here. The rank of super-paid executives in a 10,000 person corporation is limited to the top 100 jobs--and those are ALL non-productive jobs that have nothing to do with providing the "product."
We have created a reality where the hardest workers sacrifice everything, while those who work "once in a while" are equalized by the tax structure and other subsidies. I wouldn't even recommend that young adults work hard to get ahead in our society. They won't be rewarded for it; they'll simply lose all the time and energy of youth, and be no better off later.
It's pretty hard to enjoy life when one or both of you have almost NO time off, and the time you do have off is so filled with stress and anxiety and pent-up frustration, that half of it is miserable too.
I work in Finance and I don't make anywhere near 100K (or work 80hr weeks.)
Some people genuinely enjoy what they do and the 80 hour weeks don't bother them a bit. Some work those long hours just to get by on unrealistic budgets.
One thing I never understood is why you need to buy an overly expensive house if you work 80 hours a week.. if I were in that position, I'd just get the minimum I can get away with having a roof in a safe neighborhood. The money I pocket is for me to enjoy, and there's not that much time to enjoy that nice, luxurious mansion when you're spending half of your waking life at work (and the vast majority of your free time sleeping.)
Work smart and focus on productivity. Spend money on necessities, investments, and things/activities that bring enjoyment. You'll come back to work refreshed, being even more productive - a virtuous cycle!
My financial stuff is kept as confidential as I can keep it. Bragging about how frugal you are is in just as much poor taste as bragging about what you have. And it's no one's business anyhow.
I agree. I don't talk about how much I save, etc, in front of other people. In fact, I don't talk about money at all...it's always one of those nincompoops who brings it up.
however, the government is trying it's best to screw over those responsible and who save.
If there is high inflation in the next few years those debtors who lived it up are going to be the ones having the last laugh....
That's true, but it's still not enough to make me want to be a debtor. Of course, inflation may not really help debtors. Back in the 70s, there was high inflation, but wages generally kept pace with it. Today, we have lower inflation than in the 70s, but wages are definitely not keeping up with it.
Last edited by mysticaltyger; 11-09-2011 at 01:10 AM..
Because for some reason in human nature, we can't see the middle of the road. So either we spend all our money and go into debt as far as we can to "enjoy" life, or we save every penny we can and live a miserly cold existence to honor the almighty dollar.
And while there are people who are like this black and white example, the vast overwhelming majority of us live on a spectrum of gray in between.
But for some reason it's hard to see that, and we willfully go straight back to Aesop's grasshopper and ant.
I see it all the time in questions of I have this extra hundred dollars a month -- should I save it, or pay down my mortgage, or put it on my credit card. My answer is to do all three. BECAUSE YOU CAN -- and each one gets you to a goal a little sooner.
You are exactly right . Humans like to think in all-or-nothing terms. The Buddhists even have a term for this---it's called "duality". It takes effort and practice, but dualistic thinking is generally to be avoided.
i think you're right, but being better with money doesn't mean not spending much. i think some people spend quite a bit and are good with money. i believe there's such a thing as over-saving, but it's not as risky as overspending. but if you do over-save, and you miss out on opportunities in life, that's a loss in my opinion.
I am a recovering oversaver and I agree with you. However, I would say that, clearly, overpending is far, far, more common than oversaving. Oversaving has almost completely died out since most oversavers were folks who lived through the Great Depression--and most of them are now dead.
Last edited by mysticaltyger; 11-09-2011 at 01:11 AM..
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. Humans like to think in all-or-nothing terms. The Buddhists even have a term for this---it's called "duality". It takes effort and practice, but dualistic thinking is generally to be avoided.
