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Old 01-06-2015, 01:52 PM
 
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, originally from SF Bay Area
29,594 posts, read 54,170,050 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dayton Sux View Post
It means being able to afford food/clothing/shelter/transportation, and being able to raise a family, on one persons wage.

(vs having dual incomes--husband & wife working--- or maybe even three or four jobs to be able to afford this).

I guess I see this as a family wage vs a mere subsitance living wage.
I disagree, to me Living Wage is enough for one person to live on (without roomates). Having enough to raise a family on one income is a Family Wage and there's a big difference.
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Old 01-06-2015, 01:57 PM
 
Location: Northern Virginia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neosec View Post
There's been a lot of talk lately about minimum wage and earning "a living wage".

What, in your opinion, should you be able to afford to buy with - a living wage?

Cell phone? Smart phone? Cable TV? High Definition Cable TV? A new car? Vacations abroad?

Is a living wage well above the poverty line?
A Living Wage is enough to afford basic necessities without assistance. In addition to food, shelter, & clothing:

Transportation? Yes, be it public or private. A new car? No.

A phone? Yes. I don't care that it's a cell phone or landline but IMO, one or the other is a necessity (not both).

Computer/Internet? I think having access to these things is a necessity to better one's position. Such as being able to job search (most places only advertise online now) or for continuing education/taking classes. Perhaps one could have free access at a local library, but that's not always an option.

It sounds like your question is more facetious than honestly looking for opinions, though.
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Old 01-06-2015, 02:16 PM
 
Location: "Daytonnati"
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Quote:

It's crazy how things used to be though. My grandpa used to work for his
local city in the 1950's. I'm not sure what his wage was back then but maybe
$15,000 a year seems about right for a maintenance person back then. My Grandma
told me they bought a property for $2500 and it cost him about $3000 to build
their home (based on what I was told) . How many people today can say they built
their home on 4 months of salary.
That would be my dads generation and believe it or not this was the way it was back then.
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Old 01-06-2015, 02:17 PM
 
Location: "Daytonnati"
4,245 posts, read 5,971,309 times
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Quote:

disagree, to me Living Wage is enough for one person to
live on (without roomates). Having enough to raise a family on one income is a
Family Wage and there's a big difference.
Yeah, that's why I put that qualifier at the end of my post. But I guess it's how one looks at society, too.....
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Old 01-06-2015, 02:53 PM
 
1,997 posts, read 1,184,162 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UntilTheNDofTimE View Post
So $25-30 an hour for one person is your living wage (or minimum wage)? In most parts of the country you will need at least 40k per year to be able raise a family of four. This would be on the bare minimums. Although 40k for a family of four is much different in taxes than I'd pay on 40k so maybe im overstating.

It's crazy how things used to be though. My grandpa used to work for his local city in the 1950's. I'm not sure what his wage was back then but maybe $15,000 a year seems about right for a maintenance person back then. My Grandma told me they bought a property for $2500 and it cost him about $3000 to build their home (based on what I was told) . How many people today can say they built their home on 4 months of salary.
The bolded is exactly the reason that I don't buy the argument that standard of living was so much poorer back then than now. If one can own a house outright on 4 months of salary, do you really believe that people back then couldn't afford smartphones if they were available? A mansion was probably a couple years salary, so the 'less space' argument doesn't work either.
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Old 01-06-2015, 03:00 PM
 
Location: "Daytonnati"
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Quote:

The bolded is exactly the reason that I don't buy the argument that standard
of living was so much poorer back then than now. If one can own a house
outright on 4 months of salary, do you really believe that people back then
couldn't afford smartphones if they were available

Here's an example I use.

Dayton Ohio, the city, has housing stock dating...mostly...from the 1880s through the 1920s, with some 1940s and 1950s stuff. But most of the city was built before WWII.

This city housing stock is nearly totally built as single family homes, with a smattering of duplexes (locally called 'doubles') and a few older apartment houses. So, back in ye olden days....before unions and minimum wages and stuff like that....the local economy here was able to pay enough wages so that most of their own people could own their own home (or 1/2 of a duplex). Yeah they weren't McMansions but they were bigger than small apartments.


So historically it was possible to pay wages were people could afford homeownership, or the physical evidence of a city of single family homes wouldn't be there to demonstrate this.
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Old 01-06-2015, 03:09 PM
 
Location: DFW
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Being able to afford the basics in life without working more than 40 hours a week:

- Renting your own room (doesn't have to be a 1 bedroom apartment)
- Having a basic smartphone plan and/or a basic high speed Internet connection at home.
- Having health insurance
- Having enough money to eat out once a week and cook the rest.
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Old 01-06-2015, 04:44 PM
 
Location: Pennsylvania
276 posts, read 244,926 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HokieFan View Post
...It sounds like your question is more facetious than honestly looking for opinions, though.
My apologies if it came off sounding that way, it was not my intention. I actually am looking for opinions to try to get a feel for what others feel/think. I'm trying to educate myself and there have already been some posts that are enlightening to me.

I don't consider "minimum wage" and a "living wage" to be the same thing. The managing of the economy and governing people is a complex task and you can't please all the people all the time.

As I look around today I get the feeling that there are more people than there are jobs available. So disability, unemployment compensation, etc. are doled out to prevent poverty. Then those that are working for only slightly more money than the programs provide get angry.

It's a complex issue and it doesn't matter whether you lean left or right you still have the same basic problems to deal with.

I will continue to read and learn. I'm hear to gain perspective, not promote an agenda.
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Old 01-06-2015, 05:33 PM
 
25,975 posts, read 28,395,061 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UntilTheNDofTimE View Post
To me it's the bare minimum in living arrangements with little room for savings unfortunately. I won't put dollar signs next to anything besides groceries since I'm not implying that someone should be eating gourmet food daily. "Living Wage" to me is not what people seem to think it means because they are 'owed' that simply by working low skilled labor.

Splitting rent with a roommate
$200/mo groceries
Public Transportation
Basic Cell phone
Subsidized Medical Insurance
$100/mo savings
I vote for this^^^

I would also emphasize that this should be for a single person with no kids.

If you're making minimum wage and you can't afford to raise a kid, then please do yourself and your kid a huge favor and give him/her up for adoption.

And as I've said in other posts, part of the problem we have isn't a wage problem. It's that we expect everyone to live in a single family detached house and have their own car type standard of living. So we have inadequate/nonexistent public transporation, no/limited bike and walking infrastructure, cities & towns that sprawl everywhere that force people to go long distances for every errand, etc. This type of development costs a small fortune and it is not affordable for a large swath of the population.

We also have a lot of large cities on the coasts with uber restrictive development policies. The result is they do not build enough housing. Raising minimum wage to $15 as Seattle is doing, doesn't fix this problem because the people at the bottom end of the wage scale are always going to be outbid for housing if it is in short supply. See article entitled Why Middle Class Americans Can't Afford to Live in Liberal Cities

Last edited by mysticaltyger; 01-06-2015 at 05:55 PM..
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Old 01-06-2015, 05:39 PM
 
8,891 posts, read 5,052,649 times
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there is no such thing as a living wage, that is a catch all phase that was invented by the liberal side of society, to have something to complain about. the only thing an employer owes you is pay for what you agreed on and a safe place to work. He doesn't owe you benefits, vacation time , overtime hours, just pay for hours work.

you want a better living standard, then that will be education. job skill, job risk.
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