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Safety nets or not, most early retirees don't want to sit around and watch TV all day. They didn't do that before they retired and they don't do it after they retire, either. They work, but at things they care about that may or may not bring in money.
Yeah, how many people that were early retirees in the boomer generation did that? My dad retired at 56 and after about 9 months he got another job just for something to do. This is why I typically refer to it as financial independence because for some reason the notion of retirement brings up a picture of a 65 year old couple from the silent generation hanging around the house all day and heading to an early bird special dinner.
1. If you can't think of anything else to do, then that just shows what a programmed existence you're living (as well as most people). Kept so busy you don't have the time or the energy to think about anything else. That's exactly where the elites who rule over us want us--too busy and tired to think of anything outside the boxes they've provided for us.
2. Even if you can't agree with #1. Mr. Money Mustache makes a point of saying "Work is better when you don't have to do it for money.". I don't know how anyone could disagree with that. So keep working your job if you want to. But set yourself up so that you're doing it because you want to, not because you have to.
This is such an excellent point, mysticaltyger
Many of us who have worked for 25+ years in corporate 'merica (over 30 years off and on for myself), have been what I call "institutionalized." To remain in the kind of desk jobs that most people end up in (again, speaking of corporate 'merica), one often becomes a semi-deadened zombie, at least partially numb in order to keep going. Most companies don't want wild creativity, they value conformity and no rocking the boat. They'll claim they want leaders/entrepreneurs/free-thinkers, but that's just mostly hype and good PR.
And when you spend 40 hours a week working, and your friends do as well, who do you hang out with when you're not working? It can get lonely if you don't have another plan, a plan that goes far beyond the existence most embody during working stiff years.
My definition of "retirement" is never having to earn another dime again from a job or any effort and investments sustain a chosen lifestyle level 100%. Working part-time or a side gig or blogging for $$$, if it's not for a hobby, but is needed to help fund a lifestyle, is not really retirement as I define it. YMMV.
Yeah, how many people that were early retirees in the boomer generation did that? My dad retired at 56 and after about 9 months he got another job just for something to do. This is why I typically refer to it as financial independence because for some reason the notion of retirement brings up a picture of a 65 year old couple from the silent generation hanging around the house all day and heading to an early bird special dinner.
That was my parents (and now just my mother), although my dad retired in his early 70's and actually kept working part time for some of those later years because he did enjoy it. No interests, no hobbies, just hanging out. My mother sleeps her days away and has for decades. TV was our entertainment or going out to eat.
Safety nets or not, most early retirees don't want to sit around and watch TV all day. They didn't do that before they retired and they don't do it after they retire, either. They work, but at things they care about that may or may not bring in money.
My point was not the TV, but rather the safety net. Life throws all of us curve balls that are not going to fit in some $2K budget, especially with kids involved.
I see MMM as an evangelist, which is fine. But people who read his blogs need to carefully look at what he's doing himself, and not what they think they might be reading... let's see, I have a budget of $2k/mo, four percent rule says I need $600K, bada bing I'm done and I never ever have to work again for money.
That's not what MMM is doing himself. He kept working for money, just not at a corporate job. His assets are enormous. It's all fine, and I applaud what he's done. But I can easily see others being steered down a path that's not prudent.
MMM is a odd ball, his blog alone makes $500k+/year (he posted income about it)
Whether he spends $2k/month or not is by choice and not really relevent
He can "fund" more but choices not to. This is the difference between having money and not. You have the options to choose your lifestyle and not have it forced on you
To me, mmm and trump are in the same category, they have the money to spend how they want without others telling them they cant
Yeah, how many people that were early retirees in the boomer generation did that?
Not too many. It goes back to that programmed existence thing I was talking about in earlier posts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mizzourah2006
My dad retired at 56 and after about 9 months he got another job just for something to do.
He was unwilling or unable to break the "work for money is the only option for a meaningful life" program. That needs to change.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mizzourah2006
This is why I typically refer to it as financial independence because for some reason the notion of retirement brings up a picture of a 65 year old couple from the silent generation hanging around the house all day and heading to an early bird special dinner.
Yes, I agree 100%. I prefer the term "financially independent" for the same reason.
Many of us who have worked for 25+ years in corporate 'merica (over 30 years off and on for myself), have been what I call "institutionalized." To remain in the kind of desk jobs that most people end up in (again, speaking of corporate 'merica), one often becomes a semi-deadened zombie, at least partially numb in order to keep going. Most companies don't want wild creativity, they value conformity and no rocking the boat. They'll claim they want leaders/entrepreneurs/free-thinkers, but that's just mostly hype and good PR.
Yep. I agree with all of that 100%. I work a public sector job and it's the same. I see I'm getting "institutiionalized" myself and I don't like it.
Interestingly enough, I worked in a prison for a year and that was the term they used for inmates and staff who were so programmed by the institution's rules and regs, they couldn't think any other way. There were actually inmates who would screw up before being released so they could stay in prison. Prison was what was familiar to them. Most of humanity lives in a prison without bars. It's very insidious because it's not as obvious to people that their minds are imprisoned. It's much easier to control people via a prison without bars than via a prison with them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lottamoxie
And when you spend 40 hours a week working, and your friends do as well, who do you hang out with when you're not working? It can get lonely if you don't have another plan, a plan that goes far beyond the existence most embody during working stiff years.
I think this is why financial independence appeals to introverts more than extroverts. Introverts don't need as many friends and don't care as much about what other people think. But I definitely agree that you need to have a plan for what you're going to do after financial independence--and it definitely has to be more than just spending a lot of time in various forms of leisure. That gets old real fast.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lottamoxie
My definition of "retirement" is never having to earn another dime again from a job or any effort and investments sustain a chosen lifestyle level 100%. Working part-time or a side gig or blogging for $$$, if it's not for a hobby, but is needed to help fund a lifestyle, is not really retirement as I define it. YMMV.
Yes, I get it. Nothing wrong with that. But based on what I've read from early retirees....while typically not 1 percenters, they seem to be above average earners for the most part. So earning money isn't super hard for them. I do think financial independence is a continuum. Some people are ok with leaving the corporate life with a modest 600K portfolio and if they have to part time work, so be it. Others want a higher amount, and that's ok, too. The only thing I'd add is I really think the money system--at least the way it's currently set up--is actually the ultimate means of social control as well. Ultimate freedom pretty much means you have to break out of the money system, which is admittedly tough to do.
... Military under 35 who own properties and have pensions.
To 'retire' under 35 from Active Duty military means that you were 'medically retired'. It happens but it is rare. You got hurt seriously bad on Active Duty, you fought to stay in, they tried rehab but then realized you are 100% disabled, so the military 'medically retires' you. Most servicemembers who are injured that badly are discharged, so they deal with the VA for a decade and eventually the VA gives them a disability rating.
Generally, if you enlist at 18 and serve for 20-years [the minimum to get a pension], your youngest possible age to retire is 38.
I enlisted at 18, served for 6 years, got out, did 4 years in college, re-enlisted and served 14 more years. Reaching retirement at 42.
A 20-year military pension is only 50% of base-pay. Base-pay may commonly be half of a servicemember's take-home pay. So that pension could a quarter of your previous take home pay. I received a lot of bonus money, extra allowances, incentive pays, and much of my career was tax-free. My pension is a lot less than a quarter of my average take home pay from when I was on Active Duty.
The vast majority of military retirees can not support a family on their 20-year pension. They get their pension but they do not own a house, and they have often carry a lot of debt.
Not too many. It goes back to that programmed existence thing I was talking about in earlier posts.
He was unwilling or unable to break the "work for money is the only option for a meaningful life" program. That needs to change.
Yes, I agree 100%. I prefer the term "financially independent" for the same reason.
I can certainly tell you it had nothing to do with money. He went from making $175-$200k/yr to working at a grocery store for $11/hr. He did it for the social aspect and because it keeps him active. Plus his wife is 20 years younger than him and still wants to work.
@MysticalTyger.......I don't disagree with you, but unless I come up with a plan or something that interests me, I'm not going to stop working and sit around the house. Work does get easier and somewhat more enjoyable when you don't HAVE to drag yourself into the office every day. The idea of not having to worry about getting fired and living pay check to pay check is very comforting.
I think the term "retiring early" is when you don't need to make another dime, and can do whatever you want without having to make any more income in your life as you have enough assets already. Not all, but many of these young guys retire early but still work part time on a blog or whatnot, and I don't think its a 100% true hobby. I think they enjoy doing it, but they also do it for the income. I could never live the rest of my life wondering if I had enough to give my daughter and wife everything they wanted. I think I'd rather put in another 5 to 10 years to grow the egg and be positive I have enough and myself and family will be taken care of no matter what happens in life.
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