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Old 12-28-2018, 06:59 AM
 
640 posts, read 323,099 times
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Child "Free" here by choice, DW & I have travelled a lot with my work before retiring, and we thought it better the way we are. Some people were down right nasty about our choice (You learn who your friends are), some were very supportive. This way of life as DINKs allowed us to retire early, with a respectable life style. To answer the OPs initial question the $3m - $5m is very doable.
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Old 12-28-2018, 08:45 PM
Status: "Excited to move to Vegas!" (set 4 days ago)
 
Location: Beaverton, OR
5,379 posts, read 5,825,119 times
Reputation: 6001
Quote:
Originally Posted by markg91359 View Post
This is an example of what is wrong with the FIRE mentality or "retirement at all costs" mentality.

Yes, retirement is important, but so is living a normal life. For most people, getting married and raising a family is high on life's priorities.

Sure, not having kids will add to your portfolio. However, you will also miss what for me were the intrinsic joys of parenthood. Few things in life compare with watching a child earn their high school diploma, their college degree, and walking your daughter down the aisle to be married.

I feel sorry for someone who thinks about children the way you do. Either you are trying to rationalize not having a family or had one and things didn't work out.

My kids caused my wife and I a number of sleepless nights. Yet, we would not have given up raising kids for anything in this world. Heck, I'd rather live on my social security than do without a family.
And I feel sorry for people who canít come up with bigger life goals than as you said yourself just mundane things that ďpeople doĒ but that donít separate you from an animal frankly. Sure a rabbit doesnít graduate college but to act like the big point of your life is just kicking the can down the field is sad. Thereís so much more to life than that, and I hope for all parents that itís just part of their lives and not the only thing they got going on. I have no problem with people wanting kids, of course not, but I take issue with them acting like itís a big life achievement and like they donít really need to do anything else to be a success. Thatís not a success.

I am not part of any ďFireĒ movement and didnít even know what any of this was until this forum. Iím just a person with large life goals and ambitions and having kids would extremely negatively impact both my time and money for accomplishing MY goals. The ďgoalsĒ of potential unborn children arenít important to me because theyíre not here, I am, so itís my goals and dreams that matter not someone elseís. I think Nietzsche said it best that the average person isnít able to posit themselves as a goal, maybe theyíre just not ambitious enough or confident enough, I donít know Iím not a psychologist, but ďa goal is lacking.Ē Surely you have to hope and believe that one day, whether itís your kids or their kids, someone in the chain stops kicking the can downfield and realizes the potential of the lineage and does something worthy. Otherwise what at all was the point of it all?!

Itís great you found joy in something Iíd find miserable. Iím not a morning person, I never will be, and having my sleep interrupted for kids doesnít sound like fun, it sounds like misery. Having my free time taken away for soccer practices and nonsense wouldnít be enjoyable.
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Old 12-30-2018, 01:17 PM
 
25,960 posts, read 28,355,008 times
Reputation: 24608
Quote:
Originally Posted by JonathanLB View Post
It’s great you found joy in something I’d find miserable. I’m not a morning person, I never will be, and having my sleep interrupted for kids doesn’t sound like fun, it sounds like misery. Having my free time taken away for soccer practices and nonsense wouldn’t be enjoyable.
What you and Markg share in common is you're both uber-rigid and rather snide about people who make life choices different from your own. You also both make some off base assumptions about what those choices entail and people's though processes that led to those choices.
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Old 12-30-2018, 03:08 PM
 
11,678 posts, read 7,006,876 times
Reputation: 6387
Quote:
Originally Posted by JonathanLB View Post
And I feel sorry for people who canít come up with bigger life goals than as you said yourself just mundane things that ďpeople doĒ but that donít separate you from an animal frankly. Sure a rabbit doesnít graduate college but to act like the big point of your life is just kicking the can down the field is sad. Thereís so much more to life than that, and I hope for all parents that itís just part of their lives and not the only thing they got going on. I have no problem with people wanting kids, of course not, but I take issue with them acting like itís a big life achievement and like they donít really need to do anything else to be a success. Thatís not a success.

I am not part of any ďFireĒ movement and didnít even know what any of this was until this forum. Iím just a person with large life goals and ambitions and having kids would extremely negatively impact both my time and money for accomplishing MY goals. The ďgoalsĒ of potential unborn children arenít important to me because theyíre not here, I am, so itís my goals and dreams that matter not someone elseís. I think Nietzsche said it best that the average person isnít able to posit themselves as a goal, maybe theyíre just not ambitious enough or confident enough, I donít know Iím not a psychologist, but ďa goal is lacking.Ē Surely you have to hope and believe that one day, whether itís your kids or their kids, someone in the chain stops kicking the can downfield and realizes the potential of the lineage and does something worthy. Otherwise what at all was the point of it all?!

Itís great you found joy in something Iíd find miserable. Iím not a morning person, I never will be, and having my sleep interrupted for kids doesnít sound like fun, it sounds like misery. Having my free time taken away for soccer practices and nonsense wouldnít be enjoyable.
I think raising children to the best of oneís ability somewhat requires going ďall inĒ on viewing your children as a huge life achievement. The same can be said for marriage - all in or nothing. The process of raising decent children is an achievement, IMO.

How do you define success? To me, success is largely a state of mind.
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Old 03-24-2019, 04:19 PM
 
17,066 posts, read 10,046,192 times
Reputation: 28511
Some seriously bad planning in some of these cases.

These people left their jobs behind to retire early — then life got in the way. Here’s how they coped with FIRE plans gone wrong
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Old 03-24-2019, 04:29 PM
 
7,077 posts, read 8,570,343 times
Reputation: 8862
They didn't understand the definition of FI and they didn't calculate what it would take to cover their entire retirement horizon. If someone believes they can retire at age 30 or 35 or even 40, they're going to need a nest egg that's larger than someone who retires in their 50's and 60's and they're also not going to have much, if any, social security if they don't have earned income, so they'll have to cover all of their retirement costs.
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Old 03-24-2019, 04:47 PM
 
Location: SoCal
12,974 posts, read 6,190,591 times
Reputation: 9528
Quote:
Originally Posted by eddiehaskell View Post
I think raising children to the best of one’s ability somewhat requires going “all in” on viewing your children as a huge life achievement. The same can be said for marriage - all in or nothing. The process of raising decent children is an achievement, IMO.

How do you define success? To me, success is largely a state of mind.
It’s a big life achievement to me too. My kids turned out well. There plenty that don’t. Don’t undermine my effort. Hell, that’s my contribution to life, a better gene pool for the future.
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Old 03-24-2019, 08:42 PM
 
25,960 posts, read 28,355,008 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lieqiang View Post
It's incredible how off he is on his views of these folks. Despite the "early" part of it the process is still a tortoise game not the hare. Decades of financial and lifestyle discipline, it's a grind and for many they do without things that their peers have because of this goal. To summarize it was people who want something for nothing is just retarded.

To the bolded: Spot on.
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Old 03-25-2019, 07:43 AM
 
207 posts, read 70,133 times
Reputation: 452
We retired early and have had to change our plans several times already. That's OK, though. We expected to do so in our original plan to retire.



Our withdrawal rate could be 0% and we could pay our monthly bills. We've been withdrawing 2-3% the last few years and I'll withdraw 5% this year for a couple of major projects. The current plan for 2020 is to withdraw 2-3% and put it into our taxable account.


I do think retiring at 35-40 is risky, but I'm not the one taking the risk, so I have nothing to say about it. It doesn't impact my life in any way that is meaningful. I worry only about my own expenses and lifestyle.
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Old 03-25-2019, 03:38 PM
 
11,800 posts, read 21,373,538 times
Reputation: 11486
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburban_Guy View Post
None of those examples are what a FIRE person would do.
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