Thoughts on withdrawing from my 401k early (savings, medical, average)
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But something's not right if you chucked that and let other people's guilt trips cause you to move back to OKC and buy an expensive car on credit. Emotionally stable and confident people don't do that.
I'm sure you'll say you've learned your lesson. I say you've got more inner work to do, whether you move or not. Other people on here are seeing the same thing. I think we're saying that because you seem to have this focus that all/most of your problems are "out there". This focus is apparent on a lot of your other posts as well. (I'm talking your general posting history here on CD). A lot of us don't agree.
Please, please, don't take this the wrong way, but you just don't come off as an emotionally stable person. I think you're probably very angry (and perhaps, rightly so). You, yourself have said that your father was abusive. It doesn't surprise me to hear you say that. Because based on your posts (like I said, your general posting history on CD, not just this thread), it's evident you're still carrying the wounds from that abuse around inside of you. Moving away may be a partial salve, but it's not going to get to the core of why you're not happy.
I would agree for the most part. I'm better now than I was then but I still have a lot of issues. And believe me, I'm working on getting through it. One of the most difficult things I've ever done was come out to my parents. I did it in January so that's done and over with.
However, I think being in a different environment where my face won't be rubbed in my mistakes day in and day out will make it easier to move past them. Living in OKC, my reality is still shaped by these bad decisions. Everything around me is a constant reminder of them. It makes it very difficult to move forward. That's in addition to the fact that the town just isn't a good fit for me. I'd have the same issues in Arkansas, Alabama, or Mississippi or pretty much anywhere in the rural South. There's really only a few places in the South I could live and those are cities large enough and/or liberal enough that they are somewhat insulated from Bible Belt conservatism. Outside of that, I really need to get out of the Bible Belt.
As for why I'm not happy? I guess it's the fact I've never really been able to feel like my life was MY life. I had very strict, authoritarian parents and I was raised in a very strict, almost cult-like Christian denomination. I was never allowed to make my own decisions or develop my own autonomy.
Do you know that I was actually happy, for a short time, when I was living in North Carolina, was openly gay, and was living my own life? A time when I was doing what I wanted to do without the consideration of other people who may not have my best interests at heart? Now I've actually tried doing all of that here but no matter what I do, I'm still in Oklahoma City.
I HATE Oklahoma City. This place is a terrible fit for me. Anybody who says if I can't be happy here I can't be happy anywhere has either never tried to live in Oklahoma City or is a devout Southern Baptist and therefore resonates with the culture. When I left the first time I told myself I was a total failure if I ever moved back. Here I am.
I moved back here basically throwing up the white flag to my parents. I went back in the closet, got heavily involved in church, and did conversion therapy. Because of the pain in my soul associated with this place, I trusted that God would use this place to heal me of my pain and of my homosexual attractions. Of course, that didn't happen. In addition to this, when we moved to OKC growing up, it was around the time my childhood went from happy to sad and my dad became very abusive. I cannot live here and be happy. I don't have to move to Phoenix. I don't have to move to NYC. I don't have to move to downtown Denver of Boulder. I just can't be in Oklahoma City.
If I wait two years I might as well wait five because I'll have to wait out a recession. I'll be pushing 40 by the time I get out of here and that's a future I just cannot accept.
The only reasonable way to fix this is to keep pounding the pavements searching for jobs in other locations. If you're limited to a certain area, shotgun resumes all over the country. Something will turn up.
Withdrawing money is, at best, a band-aid measure.
The only reasonable way to fix this is to keep pounding the pavements searching for jobs in other locations. If you're limited to a certain area, shotgun resumes all over the country. Something will turn up.
Withdrawing money is, at best, a band-aid measure.
Which is why it will be a last resort. I'll run up my credit cards before I withdraw money from the 401K, but if I'm open to it, it will allow me to be a little more risky than I otherwise could be. I'd only cash out that money if the alternative was being homeless.
And speaking of job interviews, I have one tomorrow for a position in Phoenix. I really hope I'm able to pull it off.
Which is why it will be a last resort. I'll run up my credit cards before I withdraw money from the 401K, but if I'm open to it, it will allow me to be a little more risky than I otherwise could be. I'd only cash out that money if the alternative was being homeless.
And speaking of job interviews, I have one tomorrow for a position in Phoenix. I really hope I'm able to pull it off.
--The tricky part is having a solid plan so you don't jump from the frying pan (living somewhere you don't like) into the fire (i.e. being a typical broke/indebted person with minimal retirement savings)...that's kind of the path you're on already. We don't want you to make it worse by raiding an already meager 401k. Most of us would argue that raiding the 401k is NOT a viable plan, not even as a Plan B, C, or D. We don't want you to escape your authoritarian family/community only to find yourself in another kind of slavery (perpetual debt/being broke).
--If you must borrow money, doing it on a credit card is the lesser evil, but it's still very much an evil and it should be done as a Plan B.
--Most people s*ck at accumulating a decent amount of retirement savings. People with abuse issues like yourself tend to be even worse than average at this (and what passes for average is already pretty abysmal). If you want REAL freedom, you're going to need money in this world. There's almost no way around that (unless you're a spiritual person, which I'm guessing you're not because of the abuse you suffered).
--Since most people s*ck at accumulating decent retirement savings, and you're not the exception to this, then any advice given isn't going to resonate with you. It's outside your comfort zone. You're not going to want to do it, because it means your life will s*ck more or for longer before it gets better. But that doesn't mean you shouldn't do it or that it's bad advice. Good advice usually is hard to take. It's better for your life to s*ck a little while longer than for you whole life to suck.
--If you don't get the money thing right, it will be very hard to get the rest of your life right. That's because how we handle money is a symptom of a lot of underlying attitudes and behaviors (especially emotional issues). If you don't face the underlying issues, then your financial life will s*ck, and your whole life will s*ck--not just because of a lack of money, but also because of the underlying emotional issues that led to the lack of money.
--Moving may bring you some temporary relief, but those emotional wounds will resurface after the honeymoon period ends (if not sooner) if you don't address them (and I'm 99% certain you have some serious emotional wounds that need to be addressed).
That's pretty much all I can say.
Best wishes.
Last edited by mysticaltyger; 05-16-2019 at 05:53 PM..
I like Mysticaltyger’s advice with one caveat. Spirituality is not the same as religiosity. There is a HUGE difference. Look into “mindfulness.” I think you will find it very beneficial in learning to live with your current situation (regardless of what choice you make)
I like Mysticaltyger’s advice with one caveat. Spirituality is not the same as religiosity. There is a HUGE difference. Look into “mindfulness.†I think you will find it very beneficial in learning to live with your current situation (regardless of what choice you make)
Yes, I absolutely agree with that, but I don't think Bawac is currently in a place where he's willing or able to make that distinction, and it was a bit off topic, so I left it alone.
But maybe I underestimate him.
I do think regular mindfulness meditation would benefit Bawac greatly. It might be found more easily in Phoenix than in OKC, although you really can learn to do it on your own by reading a book or watching a YouTube video. It's really not hard to learn. The hard part is just doing it consistently.
Which is why it will be a last resort. I'll run up my credit cards before I withdraw money from the 401K, but if I'm open to it, it will allow me to be a little more risky than I otherwise could be. I'd only cash out that money if the alternative was being homeless.
And speaking of job interviews, I have one tomorrow for a position in Phoenix. I really hope I'm able to pull it off.
I would run up the cards, take out a personal loan, etc., something you can default on if things fall to pieces. When I made my major moves, I just kept pushing forward each day trying to find a job.
--The tricky part is having a solid plan so you don't jump from the frying pan (living somewhere you don't like) into the fire (i.e. being a typical broke/indebted person with minimal retirement savings)...that's kind of the path you're on already. We don't want you to make it worse by raiding an already meager 401k. Most of us would argue that raiding the 401k is NOT a viable plan, not even as a Plan B, C, or D. We don't want you to escape your authoritarian family/community only to find yourself in another kind of slavery (perpetual debt/being broke).
--If you don't get the money thing right, it will be very hard to get the rest of your life right. That's because how we handle money is a symptom of a lot of underlying attitudes and behaviors (especially emotional issues). If you don't face the underlying issues, then your financial life will s*ck, and your whole life will s*ck--not just because of a lack of money, but also because of the underlying emotional issues that led to the lack of money.
--Moving may bring you some temporary relief, but those emotional wounds will resurface after the honeymoon period ends (if not sooner) if you don't address them (and I'm 99% certain you have some serious emotional wounds that need to be addressed).
That's pretty much all I can say.
Best wishes.
I feel like my two options are to either get out of OKC as soon as I can or get therapy to try to figure out how to live in OKC happily and accept the circumstances that brought me here. And yeah I'll even look at getting new credit cards before I'll do the 401k. I have pretty decent credit. I've had a debt problem but I've always been good about paying it. Having the car paid off is a huge relief.
Just having this interview though later today has greatly improved my emotions because it's a sign there is hope. If I can get calls about jobs in Arizona while still living in Oklahoma, it should be fairly easy for me to find something if I were to just pack up and move and I wouldn't need to come anywhere close to cashing out the 401k.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mysticaltyger
Yes, I absolutely agree with that, but I don't think Bawac is currently in a place where he's willing or able to make that distinction, and it was a bit off topic, so I left it alone.
But maybe I underestimate him.
I do think regular mindfulness meditation would benefit Bawac greatly. It might be found more easily in Phoenix than in OKC, although you really can learn to do it on your own by reading a book or watching a YouTube video. It's really not hard to learn. The hard part is just doing it consistently.
I'm actually open to spirituality, just not fundamentalist/evangelical Christianity. I guess if there's one thing religion is good for is that it kind of has these types of things, that really can be beneficial to people, built into it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serious Conversation
I would run up the cards, take out a personal loan, etc., something you can default on if things fall to pieces. When I made my major moves, I just kept pushing forward each day trying to find a job.
Yeah I would have to believe that people who it takes them months and months to find something seriously aren't even looking very hard. They may apply only to a couple of jobs per day or week. If you scour the Internet and apply for every job you are qualified for as well as apply directly with as many companies in your area as possible, it should happen much quicker. I've always been able to find jobs pretty quickly, even during the recession. However, there are exceptions to that so it's always good to be prepared.
I was clinically dead and i " know" more than they do.
As for spirituality and faith, that has nothing to do with organized religion. One actully has little to do with the other. You can have spirituality and faith without organized religion. You can meditate and be spiritual in a garden, and one can always have a faith.
Religious beliefs ARE a personal thing, and an organization can help you but is not the being of your spirituality and faith.
The Bible itself says " I am that I am...lift a rock and I am there, split a piece of wood and I am there ...."
So DON'T let organized religion guide you in your quest for your own faith and spirituality.
And many organized religion groups/churches/entities ARE run cult like with many dazed blind followers.
I hope by now youve had your interview and put your best foot forward and were successful. If not, do not let that get down, keep trying.
You might have to take a job, any job, to get out of OK city, then you can pursue a career goal job later.
The primary thing is that you probably will need to get some therapy...positive therapy to unwind the damage that the gay conversion therapy did. As i said ive seen news clips of it, and very sorry you went through that.
Gay straight bi, red yellow, pink with purple polka dots, do not ever again let someone else dictate how you should think or feel. Even us here who are trying help you. We can only offer advice, its up to you to take what works for you and work it. Take the advice sift through it and decide what will best work for you ( just dont complain if you dont take our advice and your plan fails)
I sincerely hope you dont cash in your 401k it is your only bastion of strength for the future.
I really wish i had not cashed mine in, i didnt know i could save it as it would not be counted as an asset for certain help programs. But back then information wasn't at your fingertips on the net like it is now. The net didnt exactly exist like today back then.
I hope the continued best for you...do let us know how the interview came out....
Last edited by galaxyhi; 05-17-2019 at 06:17 PM..
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