No Income Tax State vs. No Sales Tax State (funds, Colorado, Florida)

[hoffdano]

Originally Posted by capoeira

Complete nonsense not supported by facts. Look at the SAT/ACT scores. South Dakota,Washington and Wyoming are in the top 20 and have no state income tax. North and South Carolina are 49th and 50th and have state income taxes in the 7% range.

SAT and ACT Average Scores by States

Facts!

[M3 Mitch]

Originally Posted by golfgal

Having lived in states that have high income tax/low/no sales tax vs states with no income tax/high property tax (which I know isn't sales tax) the high income tax state wins hands down. If you look at information on the quality of life in a state there is a direct correlation between high taxes and high quality of life.

You have specific examples? What 2 states are you comparing in your previous posts?

Keep in mind that public golf courses are not an essential quality of life issue for many.

I'm serious! For me "keeping more of what I earn" is a serious quality of life issue...

I guess it comes down to tastes and preferences - to me the quality of life somewhere like Wyoming or Montana beats NY or Cali like a drum. (In general of course, one could find spots in Upstate NY or Northern Cali that would beat certain downtown areas in Montana or Wyoming, I guess, if one looked long and hard.)

I guess this also comes down to what you mean by "quality of life" - As a hardcore libertarian, to me it's Big Brother getting out of my way and staying out of my pocket so I can persue happiness according to my own ideas and abilities - to some, heavy public infrastructure is important, some limited parts of it are important to me, roads, fire, police etc. - BUT I'm not certain that just increasing the budgets for these items will necessarily give me "more and better" of what I need/want. And public schools - please - if spending more meant better schools, figured however you want to figure "better" - why are D.C.'s schools bad by most any measure, given thieir high specific spend rate?

[drshang]

If you are poor, you will pay more taxes in a sales tax heavy state. If you are rich you will pay more in an income tax state. Depends on your income level.

I suspect all but the top 20-25% of incomes will pay much more in a no income tax state/sales tax state than they would in a no sales tax state/income tax state. Sales taxes are regressive, the bottom 75% of incomes will pay a LOT more in taxes in most cases than they would in a state with no sales tax and a high income tax.

Even in states like California the amount of income tax you pay is very little if you run a 45-50k salary after all the deductions. Most people really fail to realize this. In most states you pay basically 0 income tax (or less than 1%) if you make less than 30-35k..after you deduct things. Many people forget how generous a lot of states are with deductions, personal exemptions, etc., and they just look at the absolute brackets without taking into account all the deductions they get.

[hoffdano]

Originally Posted by drshang

If you are poor, you will pay more taxes in a sales tax heavy state. If you are rich you will pay more in an income tax state. Depends on your income level.

I suspect all but the top 20-25% of incomes will pay much more in a no income tax state/sales tax state than they would in a no sales tax state/income tax state. Sales taxes are regressive, the bottom 75% of incomes will pay a LOT more in taxes in most cases than they would in a state with no sales tax and a high income tax.

Even in states like California the amount of income tax you pay is very little if you run a 45-50k salary after all the deductions. Most people really fail to realize this. In most states you pay basically 0 income tax (or less than 1%) if you make less than 30-35k..after you deduct things. Many people forget how generous a lot of states are with deductions, personal exemptions, etc., and they just look at the absolute brackets without taking into account all the deductions they get.

This is true - but possibly more in theory than in reality. In Texas, a "sales tax state" - most areas of Texas collect 8-8.25% in sales tax. Most food and health care supplies are exempted.

Virtually every municipality in California collects HIGHER sales taxes:

http://www.boe.ca.gov/sutax/pdf/Pending_Rates.pdf (broken link)

[golfgal]

The question was what do "I" think so I gave my option from my own personal experiences. I could care less if you agree with me or not but I will gladly pay our high taxes for the programs, services and excellent education we have here. For those in the snowbelt, it IS a big deal how well they clear snow--ask anyone on the east coast how much fun they have had this year with no snow removal equipment.

[Submariner]

Originally Posted by golfgal

The question was what do "I" think so I gave my option from my own personal experiences. I could care less if you agree with me or not but I will gladly pay our high taxes for the programs, services and excellent education we have here. For those in the snowbelt, it IS a big deal how well they clear snow--ask anyone on the east coast how much fun they have had this year with no snow removal equipment.

I live on the East Coast, we had very little snow this year.

In fact we have not seen a single normal snow dump at all this winter.

[Pilgrim21784]

Originally Posted by forest beekeeper

I live on the East Coast, we had very little snow this year.

In fact we have not seen a single normal snow dump at all this
winter.

Amigo - count your blessings, Maryland set records in my area (over 70" in two weeks during February. Perhaps small change by Maine standards but huge for Maryland). Fortunately, we were in Costa Rica during the mess .

Golfgal's point is quite reasonable for many NE locations. I was born and raised in PA and now reside in Maryland. Blindfold me and I'll tell you when we are on Maryland versus PA roads. It is that noticeable.

My higher Maryland taxes buy me better roads and related services. The taxation issue is so obviously specific to a particular individual's situation that I am constantly amazed and surprised why CD folks don't run the numbers for their specific situation. Virginia has some extraordinarily lovely areas I would like to live in, but no way in "Hades" am I willing to pay their personal property tax on my motor home.

It is simply a cost/benefit analysis that folks need to make for their individual situation. There is no "one size fits all" answer. JMO

[texdav]

We have p[roperty taxes but they are local taxes. I would rather a sales tax because it is about the only tax that is proportion to spemding. It gives everybody some skin in the game.Without it it is too easy for someone to say they want this and have these peopel pay for it thru rasing only their taxes.

[Gandalara]

Originally Posted by M3 Mitch

Keep in mind that public golf courses are not an essential quality of life issue for many.

I'm serious! For me "keeping more of what I earn" is a serious quality of life issue...

I guess it comes down to tastes and preferences - to me the quality of life somewhere like Wyoming or Montana beats NY or Cali like a drum. (In general of course, one could find spots in Upstate NY or Northern Cali that would beat certain downtown areas in Montana or Wyoming, I guess, if one looked long and hard.)

I guess this also comes down to what you mean by "quality of life" - As a hardcore libertarian, to me it's Big Brother getting out of my way and staying out of my pocket so I can persue happiness according to my own ideas and abilities - to some, heavy public infrastructure is important, some limited parts of it are important to me, roads, fire, police etc. - BUT I'm not certain that just increasing the budgets for these items will necessarily give me "more and better" of what I need/want. And public schools - please - if spending more meant better schools, figured however you want to figure "better" - why are D.C.'s schools bad by most any measure, given thieir high specific spend rate?

Agree with everything.
Except.

Please don't call it Cali. Valley grrrls went away a long time ago.

Hate it hate it hate it!

[AADAD]

Imagine buying a $40K vehicle with no sales tax...........Welcome to Alaska