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If you've been there already and love it then okay. But I wouldn't recommend anything ohio to anyone. Philadelphia is actually a city in the new england chain of atmospheres. I lived in Erie PA which is right beside cleveland and it is a "huge" city of wiggers and trash. We were on the "good" side of town and guns were pulled, stores had their windows smashed out, etc. And obviously drugged out hoodie wearing degenerates filled their central downtown. If cleveland is anything like that (which I would expect it is) then I would NOT recommend it.
Responded to your post in the NYC forum, below was my post.
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After reading through this thread. I think you were on the right track in considering Philly. It has the urban-ess, grit, decay, transit, ghettos you are looking for without the ridiculous costs, along with excellent cultural and entertainment offerings. NYC is just a cheap Bolt or Megabus ride away.
I spent some time in Philly in the mid-90s, and lately I have been having a hankering to revisit my times there. Priced the present offerings of my old area, a decent part of West Philly, and it is still affordable. You basically get everything NYC, Boston or DC offers at less than half the housing costs.
you shouldn't have a hard time finding a manufacturing or industrial job in Philly. One more thing, you will not need a car in Philly.
If you get a factory job its best to have a car. Especially since a lot of the active factories in the city are in harder to get places unless you live in the neighborhood. There's a fair amount of industrial jobs up in the Northeast, but unless you found a place nearby you'd need to drive for it to be convenient.
If you've been there already and love it then okay. But I wouldn't recommend anything ohio to anyone. Philadelphia is actually a city in the new england chain of atmospheres. I lived in Erie PA which is right beside cleveland and it is a "huge" city of wiggers and trash. We were on the "good" side of town and guns were pulled, stores had their windows smashed out, etc. And obviously drugged out hoodie wearing degenerates filled their central downtown. If cleveland is anything like that (which I would expect it is) then I would NOT recommend it.
While Erie is hardly right next to Cleveland, I would still stay to avoid it over Philly. Cleveland has a lot less going for it as far as economy and jobs go right now.
While Erie is hardly right next to Cleveland, I would still stay to avoid it over Philly. Cleveland has a lot less going for it as far as economy and jobs go right now.
edit: sorry, double posted.
yeah, if a smaller city needs to be in the running, I'd suggest Pittsburgh over cleveland which has less crime and more jobs.
1) Is $13,000 enough? I would like to get a place right when I get to town, so I will probably pay 6-12 months of rent right off the bat. That will take a large chunk ($6k or so) of the $13k, but will give me up to a year to recoup that money.
2) How "transplant friendly" would you say Philadelphia is?
I don't know if this is coming across as a crazy idea or just simply a good plan. I will say one thing though... I NEVER want to return to Wisconsin again!!! That's ultimately the plan. I need to grow up, and start a life for myself somewhere completely new.
3) How comparable is Philadelphia to NYC? Is it really the "poor man's New York" as I've heard before?
1. $13,000 is more than enough to get started in Philly. As big and as grand as Philly is, its dirt cheap compared to NYC (which really is the only other city that matters in the NE ) you could probably find a good spot in Northern Libs, University City or somewhere in South Philly if being close to Center City is the goal, for $750 (although it might be a room situation.) ****However if being close to Center City isn't as important I would also suggest you take a look in Northeast Philly..while further out its definitely a good way to stay in the city and still get a little bit of suburban lifestyle it also reminded me so much of Queens, where I moved from which is also why I loved it. I had a one bedroom in Northeast Philly in the far northeast in Bustleton and paid around $750. There are also a couple of factories I can remember seeing around like the Kraft factory, Pepsi and some others in the Northeast.**
2. Philly for me was very transplant friendly, I had no problem getting into the swing of things moving from New York at 18 years old fresh out of HS. Although I had often spent summers in Philly with my dad growing up so I knew a little more before moving to Philly. I found people in Philly to be chill yet very animated much like NY'ers..a lot of hometown pride, although I did get a lot of sh** from friends I made because I was from NY..but that only revolved around sports (which im not even that into) and was all in good fun. Overall my perception of Philly natives is they like to party, eat and DRINK..and have a good time. But don't get it twisted, they can pop off
3....this dreaded question.. isn't really fair to Philly..because its a gift and a curse. On one side..Philly is without a doubt the only city (in my experience) that can compare to NY..its the biggest, fastest, most vibrant city on the entire east coast after NY. Philly and the boroughs of NY share a lot of similarities at street level also (specifically Brooklyn I'm told, although I'm not too familiar with BK) However, its not NY. It will give you the most New Yorkish vibe, from a cultural standpoint and true city life..but its not New York. But no city is New York, so its not even worth going down the list of things that NY has that Philly doesn't. That same list would apply to every other city in the US, not just Philly. The good thing however is Philly is literally right next door so if you need a New York fix, its a short bus, train ride away. I used to go back to New York on the weekends sometimes when I lived in Philly, and leaving from the Northeast we would get there in an hour most times.
Now as far as Cleveland vs Philly goes..I mean its really a "no brainer" on the surface. However I do understand if you have a special love for Cleveland. Last time I was in Cleveland was about 8yrs ago..and it has its charm no doubt I thoroughly enjoyed Tower City, its a great piece of architecture and had a great mall inside, although I've heard its declined as of late. I don't really know what exactly Cleveland could offer you to choose over Philly, especially since Philadelphia is an option in the first place. But if you can afford Philadelphia, then I think it outweighs Cleveland across the board in every category no matter what your interest are.
Just throwing out an alternate plan of action but if you want to pay no more than $600 per month and have $13000 saved up already, I would buy a rowhome in an up and coming area. It seems so wasteful to pay $6000 in rent right off the bat when that could be used for a 10% down payment on a $60,000 home. The mortgage would be about $450 per Month including taxes and insurance and could not increase. If you are currently employed, obtaining a mortgage should not be a problem, especially because you have no debt. Interest rates are at all time lows and now would be a great time to lock in a rate.
I know others will disagree but to me buying can be less restrictive than renting as you are not binded by a lease. You could even rent a room or two out for additional income. Real estate values are still severely undervalued in Philly imo. If need be you could rent the whole house out for a profit and live wherever you damn well please. Germantown, West Philly, maybe Port Richmond, parts of South philly are places I would look for a rowhome in livable condition for less than $75000. The area would be economically diverse maybe somewhat depressed but then again so would an area with rent for less than $600.
Well long distance home buying is also pretty time consuming and expensive. I researched doing the idea of long distance moving into a $60k row home and I was told that even if I choose the place the very day I come down to search it'd still take a month and a half before I could move in. Also then there would be a few different stages of paper work and inspections etc that I'd either have to stick around for or come back for.
The best route probably is to suffer a craigslist month-to-month roommate situation because it's real people who are going to help you make a long distance move. Apartment complex's etc are going to make you sit on the curb until the application is done then secure themselves on your backside with a lease. This way you wouldn't need a hotel for a week, you live cheaply until your secure, then you can make the smart moves like buying a $60k row home and making sure you're in an area you like best.
If you get a factory job its best to have a car. Especially since a lot of the active factories in the city are in harder to get places unless you live in the neighborhood. There's a fair amount of industrial jobs up in the Northeast, but unless you found a place nearby you'd need to drive for it to be convenient.
There's also industrial parks in Sharon Hill and Eastwick, both of which have public transit going to them, as does the Ridley Park Boeing facility. Marcus Hook is on the R2 line if he can get a job at the refinery/whatever the hell it's going to be in the future there. There's industrial in Clifton Heights, used to be some in Darby though I'm going to guess not any more but the point is that these are all places along some sort of PT route.
But yes, I would recommend having a car in case you end up having to work in the Northeast or in Bucks County. Also, don't forget about places like Camden where the Campbell's Soup headquarters are, Chester, Wilmington, etc. All three places are along rail lines, and all three have industrial jobs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2e1m5a
Just throwing out an alternate plan of action but if you want to pay no more than $600 per month and have $13000 saved up already, I would buy a rowhome in an up and coming area. It seems so wasteful to pay $6000 in rent right off the bat when that could be used for a 10% down payment on a $60,000 home. The mortgage would be about $450 per Month including taxes and insurance and could not increase. If you are currently employed, obtaining a mortgage should not be a problem, especially because you have no debt. Interest rates are at all time lows and now would be a great time to lock in a rate.
I know others will disagree but to me buying can be less restrictive than renting as you are not binded by a lease. You could even rent a room or two out for additional income. Real estate values are still severely undervalued in Philly imo. If need be you could rent the whole house out for a profit and live wherever you damn well please. Germantown, West Philly, maybe Port Richmond, parts of South philly are places I would look for a rowhome in livable condition for less than $75000. The area would be economically diverse maybe somewhat depressed but then again so would an area with rent for less than $600.
This is a good piece of advice if you know how to understand the market and when to "get out" in order to make a profit. It could provide a nice financial cushion in the future.
Now as far as Cleveland vs Philly goes..I mean its really a "no brainer" on the surface. However I do understand if you have a special love for Cleveland. Last time I was in Cleveland was about 8yrs ago..and it has its charm no doubt I thoroughly enjoyed Tower City, its a great piece of architecture and had a great mall inside, although I've heard its declined as of late. I don't really know what exactly Cleveland could offer you to choose over Philly, especially since Philadelphia is an option in the first place. But if you can afford Philadelphia, then I think it outweighs Cleveland across the board in every category no matter what your interest are.
I really would like to go to Philly, but here is the "draw" to Cleveland. Tell me if this makes sense.
1) I will have $13,000. $13,000 that will stretch further in Cleveland than it would in Philadelphia I'm assuming. Remember the goal is to start a "New Life". This consists of NEVER having to return anywhere near my old life with my tail between my legs.
2) COL - This is the kicker. I'll be honest - No matter how much I love Cleveland, I really do feel that I will be happier in Philadelphia. Problem? I know (fact) that I can get a nice little apartment in a nice little area for less than $500/mo!!! Seriously!!! UNDER $500. So after internet, cable, electric (other utilities are usually included), I'll still probably stay around $600/mo or so. Now let's look at Philly... $600/mo will get me a place, but it might be in a "shady" area. And after the "extras", I'm still looking at close to $750/mo. Now you have to factor in likeliness of landing a job as well as the rate of pay. I'm sure Philly might be easier to find a job, and probably will pay better, but is this a gamble I'm willing to take when using X amount of my $13k?
3) Cleveland is going though a rebirth. Cleveland is "up and coming". There is a lot of money being put into the city right now.
4) Beaches. Enough said. I need a beach or somewhere that I can watch girls. I don't think Philly has beaches except in South Jersey which will take about an hour to get to via train.
5) Casino. I use to play poker for a living back when it was legal online (not a great living, but I made do), and I would like to have somewhere convenient to play when I have a bit of extra money. No I do not plan on going down that "career path" again. I simply enjoy the game. Also, I understand Atlantic City is only 90 minutes away (via Greyhound, MegaBus, ect) but that isn't exactly the convenience I was looking for.
So in short, could I see myself happier in Philadelphia? Sure!!! But I have to be 100% certain as well as realistic here. That's why I post on these forums. So I can get as accurate advice from people who are from the area, and have maybe done the same thing I plan on doing.
And on a last note - I have exactly $5,200 saved as of today. I save roughly $1,200 per month (as I stay with my parents right now. Going though a divorce, so that's why I'm home. I'm not the next 40 year old virgin or anything) , and they want me out by May, 19, 2013 (that's my mom's birthday). Therefore when factoring in my week vacation at work (where I could very well drop a grand to fly out to the chosen city), in Mid/Late April and apply for jobs, find an apartment, ect... I will end up with $13,000 (roughly) as a final moving fund. So the thought or suggestion of saving more money or anything else of the sort is kind of out of the question. Plus it's time I have my own place. After living here, and being married, I haven't had my OWN place for close to 8 years now!!! I did live in a Rooming House about 3 1/2 years ago, but I don't really count that as my own place. I'm talking about an actual place with a lease, a kitchen, a bathroom, a living room, and a bedroom of my OWN.
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) you could probably find a good spot in Northern Libs, University City or somewhere in South Philly if being close to Center City is the goal, for $750 (although it might be a room situation.) ****However if being close to Center City isn't as important I would also suggest you take a look in Northeast Philly..while further out its definitely a good way to stay in the city and still get a little bit of suburban lifestyle it also reminded me so much of Queens, where I moved from which is also why I loved it. I had a one bedroom in Northeast Philly in the far northeast in Bustleton and paid around $750. There are also a couple of factories I can remember seeing around like the Kraft factory, Pepsi and some others in the Northeast.**
Overall my perception of Philly natives is they like to party, eat and DRINK..and have a good time. But don't get it twisted, they can pop off 
How could Cleveland outweigh Philly?
I save roughly $1,200 per month (as I stay with my parents right now. Going though a divorce, so that's why I'm home. I'm not the next 40 year old virgin or anything) , and they want me out by May, 19, 2013 (that's my mom's birthday). Therefore when factoring in my week vacation at work (where I could very well drop a grand to fly out to the chosen city), in Mid/Late April and apply for jobs, find an apartment, ect... I will end up with $13,000 (roughly) as a final moving fund. So the thought or suggestion of saving more money or anything else of the sort is kind of out of the question. Plus it's time I have my own place. After living here, and being married, I haven't had my OWN place for close to 8 years now!!! I did live in a Rooming House about 3 1/2 years ago, but I don't really count that as my own place. I'm talking about an actual place with a lease, a kitchen, a bathroom, a living room, and a bedroom of my OWN.
