Which pro-sports league does Philadelphia have the best chance of acquiring a 2nd team? (NFL, NHL, NBA, MLS, and MLB) (Allentown: sales, lease)
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Unlikely we would get a second team in any sport, especially within the city limits. But maybe if they built a stadium in south Jersey... it's not out of the realm of possibility.
It just takes the right mix of investors, developers, politicians, etc. They built a stadium in Chester so you never know.
For the sake of argument(as I agree there is virtually no chance of it happening) The Pa suburbs would have to be the second location not South Jersey. The 4 connecting PA counties to Phila have a population of 2.5 M. Their neighbors add another 1.6 M(Lehigh Valley- Lancaster) That would bê the epicenter.Perhaps Plymouth Meeting or King of prussia where 276+ 476 meet.
Combined with Philadelphia that's 5.6 M people
On the otherside of the river South Jersey (Camden-Burlington-Gloucester-Salem) have a population of 1.5 M. You can add another 500 k if you include the Trenton area which is technically part of NYC.
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Originally Posted by LHM
It just takes the right mix of investors, developers, politicians, etc. They built a stadium in Chester so you never know.
Comcast's Brian Roberts would have been the guy to bring a 2nd franchise to Philadelphia. If he were a huge sports fan he may be the only person who could pull that off. He has more than enough capital and power to pull it off. Could have used a 2nd team to fill programming on Comcast.
I recently read a story that one of Baltimores leading tourist industries is the Orioles who bring in fans from NYC-Bos-Dc-lesser extent Phila.
Same deal with the concept of an AL East team in Philadelphia. You are pretty much guaranteed 40 home sellouts a year with NYY-Bos-Philadelphia Phillies interleague play- and perhaps Baltimore.
It actually makes a lot of sense to have an AL East team in the Philadelphia region but MLB probably from a marketing standpoint wants the product more spread out to another part of the country or even Canada,Mexico,Puerto Rico. etc etc..So if MLB decides that they need to move Tampa Rays out they would most likely end up in Puerto Rico or Portland not Philadelphia.
For the sake of argument(as I agree there is virtually no chance of it happening) The Pa suburbs would have to be the second location not South Jersey. The 4 connecting PA counties to Phila have a population of 2.5 M. Their neighbors add another 1.6 M(Lehigh Valley- Lancaster) That would bê the epicenter.Perhaps Plymouth Meeting or King of prussia where 276+ 476 meet.
You don't think Trenton or Wilmington would be a better location for a 2nd team instead of some town in PA outside of Philly?
For the sake of argument(as I agree there is virtually no chance of it happening) The Pa suburbs would have to be the second location not South Jersey. The 4 connecting PA counties to Phila have a population of 2.5 M. Their neighbors add another 1.6 M(Lehigh Valley- Lancaster) That would bê the epicenter.Perhaps Plymouth Meeting or King of prussia where 276+ 476 meet.
Combined with Philadelphia that's 5.6 M people
On the otherside of the river South Jersey (Camden-Burlington-Gloucester-Salem) have a population of 1.5 M. You can add another 500 k if you include the Trenton area which is technically part of NYC.
Eh I guess I see what you're saying but the epicenter of the region is Center City and the closest place to CC would be a location in for example Camden. Of course, a "rivalry" as far as team support would be more fun if the two stadiums weren't so close to each other. If a new team went to your location, I can see some interesting divisions forming between Montco/Bucks/Lehigh Valley/some of Chester (new team) vs. Delco/some of Chester Co./Philly/SJ (Phillies).
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Originally Posted by rainrock
I recently read a story that one of Baltimores leading tourist industries is the Orioles who bring in fans from NYC-Bos-Dc-lesser extent Phila.
It's the only way a lot of Yankees fans can afford to go to Yankees games.
I recently read a story that one of Baltimores leading tourist industries is the Orioles who bring in fans from NYC-Bos-Dc-lesser extent Phila.
I can't see Philly gaining another pro sports team.
But since you mentioned Baltimore which is very close to our region, I could possibly see Baltimore gaining an NBA team, although maybe not anytime in the near future.
Aside from NFL tickets that aren't affordable to middle income residents, Baltimore is imbalanced without any pro sports tickets available in the winter.
NBA would offer the city of Baltimore affordable pro sports events in the city during the winter, when the Orioles games are not available.
Similarly sized Pittsburgh has balance of summer and winter, with summer: MLB, winter: NHL.
I can't see Philly gaining another pro sports team.
But since you mentioned Baltimore which is very close to our region, I could possibly see Baltimore gaining an NBA team, although maybe not anytime in the near future.
Aside from NFL tickets that aren't affordable to middle income residents, Baltimore is imbalanced without any pro sports tickets available in the winter.
NBA would offer the city of Baltimore affordable pro sports events in the city during the winter, when the Orioles games are not available.
Similarly sized Pittsburgh has balance of summer and winter, with summer: MLB, winter: NHL.
Though I would like to see the Baltimore Bullets come back, I'm not sure if the NBA would put a team in Baltimore. Don't forget that some parts of Maryland are loyal 76ers fans.
This has me thinking. If Josh Harris does indeed buy the NJ Devils franchise, is there a chance that he could relocate the NJ Devils franchise to the Philly sports market in the near future? If so than Philly would finally have two pro-sports teams in the same league.
It's the only sport that enough people support it in this area and where there's an opening for another team. You can make an argument for a second NBA team but the market just isn't there for it. Cities shouldn't have two NBA teams unless they're New York. Period. Same goes with NFL.
The idea that LA or Chicago should get another team in any sport is just laughable. They don't support the teams they have, minus the Cubs, White Sox, and Bears. LA especially only supports the Lakers, and only because they've won so much. The Dodgers do well because they're one MLB team and they've done well over their history.
And the Bay Area isn't a real place. It's a bunch of suburban places combined with San Francisco and Oakland and a sprawled out "city" in San Jose. Half of them are nowhere near each other. Considering the problems Oakland has had, as well as the Warriors, it's pretty funny to hear anybody suggest the Bay Area should ever get another team in any sport.
I always thought it made perfect sense to move the Miami Marlins to Boston and the Tampa Bay Rays to Philadelphia. You kill 2 birds with 1 stone. You get baseball out of Florida where its not supported. And Then arguably the 2 best baseball cities(Bos-Phil) would have teams in both the NL and AL.
Tampa brings in about 7,000 fans a game. You could build a 32,000 seat stadium in say King of Prussia or Cherry Hill and they would probably sell the season out. The only problem is the Phillies owners would never allow it.
Boston could never support another MLB team. They're an AL city.
Philadelphia would only support one other team besides the Phillies and that is the A's. If it isn't the A's, it won't happen.
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Originally Posted by rainrock
Do we really want or need to highlight Camden+ Wilmington in the year 2013? ???
Yes. They're the major cities in the metro.
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Originally Posted by Phil A. Delphia
I know there's a movement to bring MLB back to Montreal, but it ended in such a disaster (and not that long ago); so I can't see that happening for decades, if ever. Brooklyn certainly has enough going for it to support a MLB franchise, but I can't see the Yankees and, especially, the Mets agreeing to this. The last few years I've been a proponent of having the Oakland A's move to North Jersey. The NYC market could support another franchise, and the A's would almost have a homecoming as they were originally a Philly franchise.
North Jersey is nowhere near big enough to support an MLB franchise.
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Originally Posted by soug
At some point I remember reading an analysis which found that, in economic regards (market size, GDP, GDP per capita, etc), Philly is one of the only markets that could support another MLB team. Of course, this isn't taking into account the cultural aspect of it all. People are diehard Phillies fans.
Not everybody. There are plenty of people who would have no problem becoming A's fans. If you put the A's in North Philly where they belong, around Broad and Lehigh, and you built a legitimately urban baseball stadium there centered around public transportation, plenty of people would ditch the Phillies in a heartbeat for that. You'd have a North vs South Philly rivalry, and urban AL team vs NL team that plays in an area that is perfect for tailgating and very accessible to suburbanites.
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Originally Posted by rainrock
If you added up all the minor league/independent league teams in the region I believe their avg home attendance is over 45,000.
Lehigh Valley
Reading
Lancaster
Wilmington
Camden
Trenton
Lakewood
Atlantic City
That's with the Phillies avg 43,000 alone the past 5 years.
The region could support a 2nd MLB team but probably at the expense of the minor league teams.
Would Reading, LV,Lancaster fans sacrifice their teams for a mlb ball park in a centrally located area, say Montgomery County?
I doubt it.
Why on Earth would anybody ever put a baseball stadium in Montgomery County? Do people not understand how running a baseball team works? If you put it in the middle of nowhere, it will fail.
Also, I disagree that independent cities, at least one of whom isn't even really in Philadelphia's sphere of influence, would lose their minor league teams if Philadelphia added a 2nd MLB team.
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Originally Posted by pman
its a crime that brooklyn has no team and they certainly deserve one. as for philly, it possible. perhaps some place that couls draw from the lehigh valley as well..maybe fort washington ? or bring the as back to north philly. i agree its not likely, dc only got one becaise its the nations capital. the league desperately needs another west coast team.
basletball doesnt do well enough here.
Fort Washington? So only the least dense, populated half of the metro will go there?
And the league desperately needs less West Coast teams, not more.
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Originally Posted by phillies2011
The Yellow Jackets were not a second team. The Yellow Jackets went into financial trouble and were taken over by the league. The team was not active for a couple of years before the franchise was then awarded to a group that would create the Eagles. Thus the Yellow Jackets are arguably the same franchise as the Eagles and even if you count them as separate and distinct franchises they did not exist concurrently. Just like the Quakers (NHL) and Warriors (NBA), the Yellow Jackets preceded Philly's current sports teams but never operated as a second franchise within the city at the same time.
Actually, the Eagles are technically the original Steelers. They swapped franchises decades ago.
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Originally Posted by rainrock
Keep in mind when the A's moved from Philadelphia to Kansas City in I believe 1947 the Philadelphia regions population was only 3 M. Though still big enough to be the third largest in the USA behind NYC-Chi.
Its a shame they couldn't survive here at that time as the metro population is now 6 M and I would argue closer to 8 M with the close ties with Lehigh Valley/Trenton/Shore which aren't including in the cmsa.
Undoubtedly imo that this region could and would support 2 baseball teams. It could support 2 NFL and 2 NHL teams as well. Now THE NBA I dont think they can support 1 NBA lol. This area just doesn't support professional basketball.Even the few times the Sixers were good it was always a tough sell.
Try 1954. The A's succeeded just fine, but then alienated the fan base and pissed away their team. The Yankees and other AL teams conspired to get them moved before but this time it actually worked. The person who bought the team lied to the fans.
This area supports professional basketball just fine when the city makes an attempt to connect with the fans and with the actual basketball culture, which it hasn't in a long time. The Sixers are a new team, relatively speaking.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LHM
Unlikely we would get a second team in any sport, especially within the city limits. But maybe if they built a stadium in south Jersey... it's not out of the realm of possibility. It just takes the right mix of investors, developers, politicians, etc. They built a stadium in Chester so you never know.
They built a stadium in Chester because Delaware County got them to, and because Chester is central to all states in the metro.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rainrock
So if MLB decides that they need to move Tampa Rays out they would most likely end up in Puerto Rico or Portland not Philadelphia.
This has me thinking. If Josh Harris does indeed buy the NJ Devils franchise, is there a chance that he could relocate the NJ Devils franchise to the Philly sports market in the near future? If so than Philly would finally have two pro-sports teams in the same league.
This is very interesting.
If he does buy the franchise and move it, I hope he moves it to Trenton so it would finally be New Jersey's team. Either that or New Brunswick. Having the Nets not even move to Newark until right before they moved to Brooklyn was incredibly stupid as well.
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