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My son and his roommates are looking at a couple of rentals in the neighborhood which stretches from 11th and Parrish to 13th and Watts. They were originally looking for something in Northern Liberties but this looks to be a bit out of that area, but more affordable for them. Would this neighborhood be considered high-crime or undesirable for a few 20-something boys? They are white, if that matters (one would always hope it doesn't). Thanks.
My son and his roommates are looking at a couple of rentals in the neighborhood which stretches from 11th and Parrish to 13th and Watts. They were originally looking for something in Northern Liberties but this looks to be a bit out of that area, but more affordable for them. Would this neighborhood be considered high-crime or undesirable for a few 20-something boys? They are white, if that matters (one would always hope it doesn't). Thanks.
That area would probably be too undesirable for them right now.
There will be some big changes coming but not soon enough to be advantageous to them.
Northern Liberties' westernmost boundary is 5th Street. NoLibs' boundaries are, to the best of my knowledge, Front Street to the east, 5th Street to the west, Girard Avenue to the north, and Spring Garden Street to the south. If you are walking westward on Girard Avenue, the area starts to get shady west of 9th Street near the SEPTA Main Line viaduct.
The neighborhood you described sounds like Youngstown, which, as kyb01 mentioned, is pretty undesirable right now; however, it is poised to get better. Northwest from 11th and Parrish at the intersection of North Broad/Fairmount/Ridge, things are getting interesting. The Divine Lorraine, a previously abandoned hotel, is about to undergo renovations and be converted into apartments. Along Fairmount Avenue near 13th Street, a development called 1300 Fairmount is set to happen. With the success of NoLibs combined with the development opportunities at the aforementioned intersection, the neighborhood is poised to get better in a few years. I know that you are more concerned about now, but I thought that I should let you know about the future.
As a black guy, I wish it didn't matter either. In Philadelphia, it seems like people of different colors won't be bothered too much in ethnic neighborhoods (from my experiences); however, I would advise that they be street-smart no matter what. People who are not used to the city and city life get targeted because they do not have street-smarts. When walking through a neighborhood, be sure to be walking with a purpose. Valuables should not be displayed. Finally, one has to be more alert of their surroundings at night. This really applies to any city.
Good luck with their search! This is a really exciting point in time to be residing in Philly.
Thanks very much to you both. Just to clarify, they are looking a bit North of the Fairmount/N. Broad intersection - above Parrish St. but yes, clearly it's not Northern Liberties!
Is the SEPTA Main Line viaduct that you talk about the one that runs along Broad - or is there something East of that but west of 9th St. that you were referring to PhilliesPhan? (I couldn't find Ridge on the map for some reason.)
Kind of wondering how they will get downtown from this neighborhood, or wherever 20-somethings go for nightlife...and how easy or dicey it will be to walk to the bus or subway or whatever they would be using. (They will actually be driving to their jobs, which are in Jersey.)
Thanks very much to you both. Just to clarify, they are looking a bit North of the Fairmount/N. Broad intersection - above Parrish St. but yes, clearly it's not Northern Liberties!
Is the SEPTA Main Line viaduct that you talk about the one that runs along Broad - or is there something East of that but west of 9th St. that you were referring to PhilliesPhan? (I couldn't find Ridge on the map for some reason.)
Kind of wondering how they will get downtown from this neighborhood, or wherever 20-somethings go for nightlife...and how easy or dicey it will be to walk to the bus or subway or whatever they would be using. (They will actually be driving to their jobs, which are in Jersey.)
Thanks very much!
The SEPTA main line is local lingo for a portion of the regional rail (commuter rail) - he's specifically referring to the 9th street viaduct - the trains run elevated over 9th street on this portion of the line.
Getting downtown is quite easy, with the BSL or 23 bus. Even walking if they have the spirit for it, it's not far away.
If they're not happy with the neighborhood...
I think a lot of folks find driving to NJ from South Philly pretty manageable - and there's also Port Richmond to the north/northeast of Fishtown. A solid neighborhood, especially closer to the river. Cheap too. No cool factor though, a pretty blue color neighborhood with a significant eastern European population.
They are actually happy with the neighborhood and are getting ready to sign a lease on a rental, but as the mom, I was a bit worried based on what I'm hearing from some friends who "used" to live in Philly. That's why I figured I would come here and ask the experts!!
I did a Google street view of the area and it seems okay with well-kept houses, etc. They will obviously be in the racial minority in the neighborhood but they don't care about that. (I guess part of the question is whether others will care and whether they will stand out in a bad way.) They like the fact there there is quite a bit of parking available, and the location works for them. (I think South Philly was more expensive and had less parking options, and they didn't find anything in Fishtown that they liked.) My question is completely about safety.
Thanks very much to you both. Just to clarify, they are looking a bit North of the Fairmount/N. Broad intersection - above Parrish St. but yes, clearly it's not Northern Liberties!
Is the SEPTA Main Line viaduct that you talk about the one that runs along Broad - or is there something East of that but west of 9th St. that you were referring to PhilliesPhan? (I couldn't find Ridge on the map for some reason.)
Kind of wondering how they will get downtown from this neighborhood, or wherever 20-somethings go for nightlife...and how easy or dicey it will be to walk to the bus or subway or whatever they would be using. (They will actually be driving to their jobs, which are in Jersey.)
Thanks very much!
Unfortunately the Vine St Expressway "cuts" off the area from downtown(Center City) so that's a reason why development has been delayed. Just past south of it is Old City and Chinatown which are Center City neighborhoods.
Another thing, there some clubs around there. The Electric Factory and Union Transfer.
The "Septa Main Line viaduct" ,aka the Reading Viaduct , is slated to become an elevated park similar to the
High Line in NYC. The initial segment to be developed is west of 9th St.
The nearest subway stations to Center City are the Broad St Line's Fairmount and Spring Garden and the Market Frankford Line's Spring Garden station which is just east of 2nd St. in Northern Liberties.
If it were just a bit better, they could actually walk south on 9th, 10th, 11th Sts to Chinatown and the eastern part of Center City. There's a great music club, the Trocodero, at 10th and Arch Sts. in Chinatown.
The SEPTA main line is local lingo for a portion of the regional rail (commuter rail) - he's specifically referring to the 9th street viaduct - the trains run elevated over 9th street on this portion of the line.
Getting downtown is quite easy, with the BSL or 23 bus. Even walking if they have the spirit for it, it's not far away.
If they're not happy with the neighborhood...
I think a lot of folks find driving to NJ from South Philly pretty manageable - and there's also Port Richmond to the north/northeast of Fishtown. A solid neighborhood, especially closer to the river. Cheap too. No cool factor though, a pretty blue color neighborhood with a significant eastern European population.
Sorry about that! I do fall into the habit of using my local lingo sometimes.FamousBlueRaincoat is absolutely correct: I'm referring to the 9th Street Viaduct. There is a station at 9th and Berks called Temple University, and you can pretty much infer where that name is derived from. Although it is local lingo, let me explain to you why it's called the SEPTA Main Line; it may help your son in his search.
The SEPTA Main Line extends from Lansdale, through Center City, and up to Zoo Junction, although 30th Street Station is the western extremity. All branch lines enter the Main Line at some point. This is a plus, especially at points north of Center City. Especially at Temple University and Wayne Junction (only the Manayunk/Norristown and Lansdale/Doylestown Lines serve North Broad), you will have subway-like headways at peak hours. You may see trains arrive and depart every 5-10 minutes between Temple and Glenside.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyb01
Unfortunately the Vine St Expressway "cuts" off the area from downtown(Center City) so that's a reason why development has been delayed. Just past south of it is Old City and Chinatown which are Center City neighborhoods.
Another thing, there some clubs around there. The Electric Factory and Union Transfer.
The "Septa Main Line viaduct" ,aka the Reading Viaduct , is slated to become an elevated park similar to the High Line in NYC. The initial segment to be developed is west of 9th St.
The nearest subway stations to Center City are the Broad St Line's Fairmount and Spring Garden and the Market Frankford Line's Spring Garden station which is just east of 2nd St. in Northern Liberties.
If it were just a bit better, they could actually walk south on 9th, 10th, 11th Sts to Chinatown and the eastern part of Center City. There's a great music club, the Trocodero, at 10th and Arch Sts. in Chinatown.
I was referring to SEPTA's current viaduct that emerges at 9th and Spring Garden, but kyb01 brings up a great point.
North Philly contains an old portion of the ex-Reading Viaduct. It was disconnected from the system when the ex-Pennsylvania Railroad and ex-Reading systems were unified through a tunnel in Center City. It has sat dormant for a long time, but that is about to change. Friends of the Rail Park is armed with funding to convert this abandoned segment of viaduct into a vertical park, similar to New York's High Line. It will be interesting to see how this project progresses!
My son and his roommates are looking at a couple of rentals in the neighborhood which stretches from 11th and Parrish to 13th and Watts. They were originally looking for something in Northern Liberties but this looks to be a bit out of that area, but more affordable for them. Would this neighborhood be considered high-crime or undesirable for a few 20-something boys? They are white, if that matters (one would always hope it doesn't). Thanks.
Race matters in most Philadelphia neighborhoods ... Personally, I wouldn't want my son living back there.
They are actually happy with the neighborhood and are getting ready to sign a lease on a rental, but as the mom, I was a bit worried based on what I'm hearing from some friends who "used" to live in Philly. That's why I figured I would come here and ask the experts!!
I did a Google street view of the area and it seems okay with well-kept houses, etc. They will obviously be in the racial minority in the neighborhood but they don't care about that. (I guess part of the question is whether others will care and whether they will stand out in a bad way.) They like the fact there there is quite a bit of parking available, and the location works for them. (I think South Philly was more expensive and had less parking options, and they didn't find anything in Fishtown that they liked.) My question is completely about safety.
There have been white artistic types living around there for decades because it was close to Center City and cheap.
Director David Lynch lived there when he was a student , at the really nearby, PA Academy of the Fine Arts.
He had some brutally honest things to say about it, lol, but it didn't actually affect his, overall, attitude about the city because he says it gave him a lot inspiration in his work. He did end up moving from it to the Fairmount neighborhood. The neighborhood, in question, which is Poplar or Callowhill is , sometimes, affectionately called Eraserhead, in Lynch's honor.
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