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Old 01-30-2019, 09:17 AM
 
Location: New York City
5,155 posts, read 4,727,795 times
Reputation: 2429

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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyb01 View Post
There was never a MFL stop at 22nd St afaik.
Bypasses the station (my bad), but would be great if a full stop could be retrofitted (huge undertaking).


Quote:
Originally Posted by BK_PHL_DEL View Post
I pretty much always agree with your posts and mindset and I think what you are saying is a good idea too. We can take the progression of the NYC region as an example. When I was growing up, Manhattan was the epicenter of the jobs and economic activity. Over the years, it has increased tremendously, with activity bleeding into Hoboken, Jersey City, downtown Brooklyn, and now to LIC.

It is fortunate to have such a major employer right now in the Philly region such as KOP but it might have been better if jobs were created and brewing in Philly first and THEN spill out to the nearby areas. The migration could at least be planned for, infrastructure-wise. As it is now, KOP competes with Philly for jobs and the reactionary planning like this rail extension is super expensive.
That needs to change. I think the suburbs do a much better job at attracting business, expansion, satellites, etc. than the city.

The city needs to take notes and stop commiserating about its problems and take action. The focus of some city council members makes my eyes roll back into my head. Making Philadelphia an economic center is really not that difficult of an undertaking if you have the right minds taking the lead.

But regardless, I think connecting the regions two largest economic centers via a rail line is huge for the region.
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Old 01-30-2019, 10:16 AM
 
Location: The mountain of Airy
5,209 posts, read 5,125,337 times
Reputation: 3462
Quote:
Originally Posted by BK_PHL_DEL View Post
I pretty much always agree with your posts and mindset and I think what you are saying is a good idea too. We can take the progression of the NYC region as an example. When I was growing up, Manhattan was the epicenter of the jobs and economic activity. Over the years, it has increased tremendously, with activity bleeding into Hoboken, Jersey City, downtown Brooklyn, and now to LIC.

It is fortunate to have such a major employer right now in the Philly region such as KOP but it might have been better if jobs were created and brewing in Philly first and THEN spill out to the nearby areas. The migration could at least be planned for, infrastructure-wise. As it is now, KOP competes with Philly for jobs and the reactionary planning like this rail extension is super expensive.
Fully agree. And other top-tier cities had the same dynamic as Manhattan (to a lesser degree of course). The problem with Philly is that employers purposefully skip the city. And our high poverty rate in the city is a testament to our business climate. The rail project is now so expensive that we could probably have paid for our reverse commuting by limo for the next 10 years in place of it.
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Old 01-30-2019, 10:57 AM
 
Location: New York City
5,155 posts, read 4,727,795 times
Reputation: 2429
Quote:
Originally Posted by AJNEOA View Post
Fully agree. And other top-tier cities had the same dynamic as Manhattan (to a lesser degree of course). The problem with Philly is that employers purposefully skip the city. And our high poverty rate in the city is a testament to our business climate. The rail project is now so expensive that we could probably have paid for our reverse commuting by limo for the next 10 years in place of it.
But to play devils advocate, its not the suburbs fault they are a more attractive option for good jobs... 60+ years ago during de-industrialization many cities were over their heads trying to heal/ prevent wounds, but in 2019, the city is its own enemy in this game.
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Old 01-30-2019, 11:21 AM
 
Location: USA
14,838 posts, read 7,919,891 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyb01 View Post
Decades wrt the Blue Route. You do know why it was labeled "blue", right?
It was blue colored on the maps when I was a kid. We used to race motorcycles on it until they put up the concrete barriers.
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Old 01-30-2019, 11:59 AM
 
6,437 posts, read 6,827,192 times
Reputation: 9001
Quote:
every collar county of Philadelphia is an employment hub,
I don't think of DelCo as being an employment "hub." But do a lot of people work there? Sure it has Wayne, Concordville, Glen Mills, and Media -- and heaven help us -- Chester)... but is there some obvious big employer with a LOT of employees that I'm missing?

DelCo in general seems not to get the same kind of love and attention and props that MontCo gets. Heck, Bucks County and Chester Co.seem to be better thought of than DelCo. Or is that just me projecting.
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Old 01-30-2019, 12:19 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
286 posts, read 130,336 times
Reputation: 268
Quote:
Originally Posted by AJNEOA View Post
Fully agree. And other top-tier cities had the same dynamic as Manhattan (to a lesser degree of course). The problem with Philly is that employers purposefully skip the city. And our high poverty rate in the city is a testament to our business climate. The rail project is now so expensive that we could probably have paid for our reverse commuting by limo for the next 10 years in place of it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpomp View Post
But to play devils advocate, its not the suburbs fault they are a more attractive option for good jobs... 60+ years ago during de-industrialization many cities were over their heads trying to heal/ prevent wounds, but in 2019, the city is its own enemy in this game.
The wage tax is a huge reason for Philly's unattractiveness to employers and to the harsh business environment. That's why I think that $1.2 billion could be better used to gradually lower the tax rate while keeping it revenue neutral. Lowering and eliminating the wage tax is the key to expanding our tax base. It's already stupid to tax something that can leave city limits and provide revenue instead to the suburbs. More tax burden has to be shifted to what STAYS in the city, aka property and land. There's significant uproar from the attempted property tax hike and assessment fiasco, but not enough attention on the wage tax. Ideally I would welcome increases in property tax rate IF the wage tax is reduced in tandem.
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Old 01-30-2019, 12:24 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
286 posts, read 130,336 times
Reputation: 268
Quote:
Originally Posted by selhars View Post
I don't think of DelCo as being an employment "hub." But do a lot of people work there? Sure it has Wayne, Concordville, Glen Mills, and Media -- and heaven help us -- Chester)... but is there some obvious big employer with a LOT of employees that I'm missing?

DelCo in general seems not to get the same kind of love and attention and props that MontCo gets. Heck, Bucks County and Chester Co.seem to be better thought of than DelCo. Or is that just me projecting.
Boeing, SAP, Vanguard are some that come to mind.
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Old 01-30-2019, 12:56 PM
 
347 posts, read 324,187 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpomp View Post
This is a problem I have with many viewpoints on here and from Philadelphians. Stealing jobs from King of Prussia and moving them to the city does absolutely nothing to improve the Philadelphia region. If people want more jobs and companies, then the city needs to lure them from New York, DC, Chicago, Houston, etc.

Also, KoP is far more than a mall. Between King of Prussia, Wayne, Radnor, and Montgomery County in general, that is a huge employment center (one of the largest in the state). A good chunk of the regions highest paying jobs are within 15 minutes of King of Prussia. There are also no signs that the KoP region is a temporary employment. Read the PBJ, there are dozens of companies and satellites opening out that way monthly.

This whole city vs suburbs thing doesn't make sense to me, and people on here should realize that Philadelphia is one of the few US cities that has an extremely healthy metropolitan area, every collar county of Philadelphia is an employment hub, that is not the case for most major cities.

Where Philadelphia needs to step up is luring corporate affairs and satellites from other major cities not King of Prussia.

Company XYZ in San Fran should be opening their East Coast hub in Philadelphia, not NYC or DC. That is what needs to change.

Also, I am not yelling or getting upset with you or any poster, I am just thinking about this plan in a different way.
Yeah, I completely agree that the best case scenario is to pull companies and jobs from other areas of the country/globe.

However, hypothetically, if the city were to dramatically reduce wage tax and provide competitive scenarios for company relocation, I think pulling some suburban companies into the city would benefit the entire region much more than hurt it. There are two main reasons for this IMO...

1. There is already enough wealth captured in those suburbs. If you have a 500k house in KOP or Wayne and have kids in the local school districts, I doubt you're going to up and move to avoid an hour commute. You'll still shop locally, go to KOP mall, belong to local fitness center, etc... Sure, the decreased corporate tax income will not be great for that burb, but I just don't see our affluent burbs getting crushed by the above scenario. I mean look at it now. I know literally hundreds of people who work in the city and opt to live in KOP, the Main Line, Collegeville so they can take advantage of those school districts and other QOL benefits. I think people would remain and figure out a way to commute - thousands already do this everyday.
2. The relocation of a couple major companies might just put Philly over the tipping point. The city is close now and a Vanguard and local satellites of a big pharma company or two could be that influx of money and people that is needed. This is turn might change the viewpoints' of other major companies outside of the Philly region to consider Philly where previously Philly has not seriously been in the running. We have to ramp-up the city big business momentum somehow and if slightly cannibalizing one or two affluent suburbs is the answer, then ultimately I think the entire region will benefit greatly from it, including those one or two suburbs.
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Old 01-30-2019, 01:01 PM
 
Location: USA
14,838 posts, read 7,919,891 times
Reputation: 10931
Quote:
Originally Posted by BK_PHL_DEL View Post
Boeing, SAP, Vanguard are some that come to mind.
Vanguard is in Malvern which is Chester County.
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Old 01-30-2019, 02:47 PM
 
Location: New York City
5,155 posts, read 4,727,795 times
Reputation: 2429
Quote:
Originally Posted by selhars View Post
I don't think of DelCo as being an employment "hub." But do a lot of people work there? Sure it has Wayne, Concordville, Glen Mills, and Media -- and heaven help us -- Chester)... but is there some obvious big employer with a LOT of employees that I'm missing?

DelCo in general seems not to get the same kind of love and attention and props that MontCo gets. Heck, Bucks County and Chester Co.seem to be better thought of than DelCo. Or is that just me projecting.
Delco is more than Chester and Sharon Hill.

It includes several extremely affluent communities and healthy employment centers in the Media area, Newtown Square, Radnor, Wayne, etc.

SAP, Boeing, Brandywine, Lincoln Financial, Wawa, a good amount of pharma / chemical companies too, etc.

Montco is by far the leader of the collar counties in employment, but I think people associate the term Delco to the entire county, when in reality, the "Delco" portion is along the Southeastern section of the county. I hate the term Delco btw.

The stats show for themselves, even with the issues of Chester (poverty, unemployment, crime) Delaware County is still quite high in strong employment numbers, affluence, real estate values, etc. Remove Chester, "Delco" would flirt with Montco for the healthiest overall county in PA.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pennsport View Post
Yeah, I completely agree that the best case scenario is to pull companies and jobs from other areas of the country/globe.

However, hypothetically, if the city were to dramatically reduce wage tax and provide competitive scenarios for company relocation, I think pulling some suburban companies into the city would benefit the entire region much more than hurt it. There are two main reasons for this IMO...

1. There is already enough wealth captured in those suburbs. If you have a 500k house in KOP or Wayne and have kids in the local school districts, I doubt you're going to up and move to avoid an hour commute. You'll still shop locally, go to KOP mall, belong to local fitness center, etc... Sure, the decreased corporate tax income will not be great for that burb, but I just don't see our affluent burbs getting crushed by the above scenario. I mean look at it now. I know literally hundreds of people who work in the city and opt to live in KOP, the Main Line, Collegeville so they can take advantage of those school districts and other QOL benefits. I think people would remain and figure out a way to commute - thousands already do this everyday.
2. The relocation of a couple major companies might just put Philly over the tipping point. The city is close now and a Vanguard and local satellites of a big pharma company or two could be that influx of money and people that is needed. This is turn might change the viewpoints' of other major companies outside of the Philly region to consider Philly where previously Philly has not seriously been in the running. We have to ramp-up the city big business momentum somehow and if slightly cannibalizing one or two affluent suburbs is the answer, then ultimately I think the entire region will benefit greatly from it, including those one or two suburbs.
I do agree with your logic. Moving operations to Philadelphia wouldn't result in catastrophe, but I still think if the city is going to make an effort like that, then why not create a committee to essentially poach employment from our neighbors rather than the suburbs.

Because in most cases Vanguard isn't going to just pick up and move to Philadelphia because the city asked. That would likely cost the city millions of dollars to make that possible or even attractive enough for Vanguard to move..
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