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Old 10-28-2009, 08:41 AM
 
24 posts, read 64,707 times
Reputation: 12

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Quote:
Originally Posted by solibs View Post
It's actually funny that you should mention that b/c SEPTA has a really hard time keeping people behind the controls on the regional rail because the free market is pulling them all to NJTransit and to a lesser extent, MARC, VRE and MBTA.

Do you really want some guy making $9/hr behind the controls on your train? Sorry, I don't. I don't want them flying my planes either but, unfortunately, a lot of them are and it's ridiculously dangerous. Nor do I want some 19 year old guy who didn't make it past the 10th grade and barely speaks english driving my bus for $8/hr.

That said, there is no free market in transportation. It's not a profitable venture when taxpayers are not paying for, at the very least, the infrastructure. Even the Romans subsidized "highways" not just in building roads but in maintaining a huge army to protect them. Anyone who has ever visited any Roman ruins in France or Spain has probably seen for themselves what lengths the Romans went to to keep the economy moving - literally.

All privatization in transportation means is that the private company reduces wages and eliminates benefits and reduces scheduled maintenance to skim a profit. Thanks but no thanks.



What cashier? If you want to tell me that a 32-year SEPTA veteran who works 55 hours a week is making that much money, OK . . . so what? If you want to tell me that some 5-year chump is working 37.5 hours per week and bringing home that kind of pay . . . BS!
I was referring to the comment above me about the "medically disqualified" employees making what they made previously in their new role as a cashiers, and were not subject to performance reviews, etc.

How do you propose they fix SEPTA and make all parties happy?
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Old 10-28-2009, 08:47 AM
 
24 posts, read 64,707 times
Reputation: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by solibs View Post
Was I? In what context? I don't know, refresh my memory.



I think that's what they call a "straw man" argument.



If you don't have all of the facts you can't have an informed opinion.

If they didn't get a raise this year, who cares? Not me! I've been laid off twice in the last 18 months. But if, for the last 7 years you took cuts in benefits and then lost wages to inflation because management kept telling you "just give us 'til next contract, we'll make it up to you, we promise" then you'd probably be a little upset. But, from my understanding, for the rank and file, it's more about working conditions and healthcare than a pay raise . . . and if that's that case, then I support them on that.
You were actually attacking me with that line in another post when I strongly cautioned a girl from no where Texas not to move here without a job and nothing but a High School education.

Finally, who is the chump then? If they've been told that for 7 years and stayed...good to be loyal but use common sense! If the economy was booming, which during the past 7 years there were periods of economic growth and they were being told the same line over and over again, then they could have left and found a different more fulfilling job with better benefits (theoretically), correct? You can't play the victim if you've allowed yourself to be victimized, at least for that long.
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Old 10-28-2009, 12:36 PM
 
Location: South Philly
1,943 posts, read 6,957,403 times
Reputation: 658
Quote:
Originally Posted by MBlueR View Post
I was referring to the comment above me about the "medically disqualified" employees making what they made previously in their new role as a cashiers, and were not subject to performance reviews, etc.
OK. But is it true? What are the particular circumstances? They do stick people they don't know what to do with in the cashier booths but SEPTA does it. SEPTA is supposed to conduct performance reviews on their employees and SEPTA decides where its members work. It has nothing to do with the union. Ask the management what the heck is going on.

Quote:
How do you propose they fix SEPTA and make all parties happy?
First, the funding mechanism needs to be straightened out. The state made a good first step last year in funding transit statewide but the amount of money can fluctuate wildly from year-to-year. If it were just money for capital programs it wouldn't matter much, you build a lot when you have the money and you hold tight when you don't. But since about 40% of the operating costs are also funded through state and local money it becomes an issue. That part needs to be straightened out.

Transit ridership is tied to the economy, the price of gas and the concentration of people/jobs near its stations. Since SEPTA doesn't have any control over any of those things I can see their reluctance to sign long-term contracts and, in the PR war, if the TWU is coming back to renegotiate a contract every other year it gives SEPTA the upper hand in the media and in negotiations. There are people smarter than I when it comes to labor contracts but it seems to me that some middle ground could be found. 4 year contracts maybe? With raises pegged to inflation and anything beyond that tied to performance . . . and something that smoothes out the healthcare contributions - a 5% increase every year or something to that effect. Like I said, i'm not an expert, these are just ideas.

Now, clean house with SEPTA management. The board and top level executives are not transit people and most of them are not regular users of the system. They're bean counters and pols connected to politics in the suburban counties. Not saying that we don't need good accountants but we should have transportation experts running our system. It's a problem that's not unique to SEPTA - take the PPA for example - You know how they recently got rid of all the meters in Center City and replaced them with those green, electronic boxes that print you a receipt? That technology has been around for 15 years. So instead of just moving to it 5 or 10 years ago after the technology had been proven they shifted to digital meters and then went from the single meter to the double-headed meter. Then they came out with all this smartcard BS that's now obsolete because you can use an atm card at the new machines.

Sorry to digress but SEPTA has been doing the same thing. Perhaps you've seen the new smartcard/RFID system that PATCO has? That technology has also been around for about 10 years now. SEPTA is still 3 years away from implementation. It would eliminate the need for cashiers altogether. They could move all of them to maintenance or housekeeping or security. Same thing on regional rail trains. Having people board from all of these low-level platforms in the suburbs slows the trains down to the extent that, system-wide, they're running 2 extra trains per day on every line to provide the same level of service. Sure, platforms cost money but they would pay for themselves in 7 years. Regional rail should be proof-of-payment and you can spread the conductors around when you add service. Get more suburbanites using regional rail by offering off-peak discounts and day-passes.

Right now you have an executive board which is only interested in maintaining the status quo - and the status quo is expensive. I could go on at length but perhaps that's for another thread.

Last edited by solibs; 10-28-2009 at 12:56 PM..
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Old 10-28-2009, 12:46 PM
 
Location: South Philly
1,943 posts, read 6,957,403 times
Reputation: 658
Quote:
Originally Posted by MBlueR View Post
You were actually attacking me with that line in another post when I strongly cautioned a girl from no where Texas not to move here without a job and nothing but a High School education.
attacking you? that's a tad dramatic, no? Anyway, you seem to know how to use the quote feature. don't take what I said out of context then paraphrase it. Show us the post.

Quote:
Finally, who is the chump then? If they've been told that for 7 years and stayed...good to be loyal but use common sense! If the economy was booming, which during the past 7 years there were periods of economic growth and they were being told the same line over and over again, then they could have left and found a different more fulfilling job with better benefits (theoretically), correct? You can't play the victim if you've allowed yourself to be victimized, at least for that long.
Well, if you've followed the story over the last 5 years you would know that SEPTA had an extended budgetary crisis because of where their revenue comes from and the state of the overall economy. To a large degree, those problems were fixed by the state last year but some issues still persist.

but I think that's what a strike is about, right? Saying, "i've had enough. Fix this or i'm going to work somewhere else." And to a large extent, a lot of the mechanics and drivers do go to work somewhere else. Holding on to skilled workers is a major problem over there and it has everything to do with wages, benefits and work structure.
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Old 10-28-2009, 01:10 PM
 
24 posts, read 64,707 times
Reputation: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by solibs View Post
attacking you? that's a tad dramatic, no? Anyway, you seem to know how to use the quote feature. don't take what I said out of context then paraphrase it. Show us the post.
Ask and you shall recieve:
I'm a 21 y.o. single female who's considering relocating to Philadelphia (coming from TX). I want to travel more, but I'm a little (ok, a lot, lol) nervous about moving there as I don't know anyone there. My main concern is safety and affordable housing. Don't wanna end up homeless nor do I want to get shot (lol). Like I said, I'm a single, 100lb female. I can tolerate thefts, burglaries, and OCCASIONAL murders (lol). But... Well, I think you all get the point. In my current town you can find a 1 bd room for a little under $500. Is that even possible in Philadelphia? The most I'm willing to spend is $600. What about Darby, PA? It's pretty close to the city and the cost of living there seems to be lower.

I tried checking out apts. on apartments.com but they were all really pricey ($800-$1,000 for 1bd room). Oh yeah, I don't have a car. But I most likely won't need one there, right? Anyway, I have about $4,500 saved up but I don't know how far that will get me, especially sense I don't know how long it will take for me to get a job. Soo, I kinda came up with a plan on how I can save money. But please, don't laugh. I'm serious. I was thinking about living in a self-storage until I get a job and an apt. (so I'm not just spending $$$). I even picked out my storage, lol. Port Richmond Self-storage located on 2625 Wheatheaf Ln. Is anyone familiar with this storage and this area? (still worried about my safety, but I guess I could always dress up like a bum? lol).

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!



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file:///C:/DOCUME~1/B87984/LOCALS~1/Temp/msohtml1/01/clip_image003.gif (broken link)10-03-2009, 06:04 PM
solibs
Senior Member
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Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: South Philly
1,045 posts, read 664,405 times
Reputation: 206
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Quote:
Philly is a tough town to live in than a smaller town in Texas, especially when you're from that smaller town. It still has a blue collar underbelly, the weather is not as nice and Philly also has its problems with crime and the availability to advance here for individuals without higher education is severely limited vs. what you can achieve in other places in this country.
Opportunity to advance is tougher here? Why don't you take a look at the poverty rates for metro Philly and metro Dallas and get back to me.



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Quote:
Originally Posted by solibs file:///C:/DOCUME~1/B87984/LOCALS~1/Temp/msohtml1/01/clip_image010.gif (broken link)
Just because you're not cut out for living outside your comfort zone doesn't mean that other people can't handle it.

Why are you always making comments like this? Just because I give my 2 cents about someone moving here with no job, no college education (she said she's 19, so unless she's a genius, she hasn't graduated from college), and no stated immediate plans, etc does not mean I'm "not cut out for living outside my comfort zone." If she was moving to Boston, I'd probably try to sway her as well, not because I think she'd be scared of the big bad city, but the place is expensive and opportunities for people without higher educated are limited regardless of where you live, more so in the Northeast where a lot of people have attended college and graduate school vs. a place where someone can at least be "middle class" without a college degree. At my law firm, our paralegals and even normal run of the mill secretaries and admins all have 4 year college degrees. The company my father works for has admins that have nothing beyond a high school degree. Plus, other people have also commented on this thread and others that Philly isn't known for its warm & welcoming attitude. However, I've made plenty of friends since moving here along with making a life. So please stop assuming things you don't know to be true. I could also tell you things I don't like about Texas/Dallas and then contrast with all the reasons I like Philly.
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Old 10-28-2009, 03:22 PM
 
1,261 posts, read 2,013,764 times
Reputation: 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by solibs View Post
OK. But is it true? What are the particular circumstances? They do stick people they don't know what to do with in the cashier booths but SEPTA does it. SEPTA is supposed to conduct performance reviews on their employees and SEPTA decides where its members work. It has nothing to do with the union. Ask the management what the heck is going on.



First, the funding mechanism needs to be straightened out. The state made a good first step last year in funding transit statewide but the amount of money can fluctuate wildly from year-to-year. If it were just money for capital programs it wouldn't matter much, you build a lot when you have the money and you hold tight when you don't. But since about 40% of the operating costs are also funded through state and local money it becomes an issue. That part needs to be straightened out.

Transit ridership is tied to the economy, the price of gas and the concentration of people/jobs near its stations. Since SEPTA doesn't have any control over any of those things I can see their reluctance to sign long-term contracts and, in the PR war, if the TWU is coming back to renegotiate a contract every other year it gives SEPTA the upper hand in the media and in negotiations. There are people smarter than I when it comes to labor contracts but it seems to me that some middle ground could be found. 4 year contracts maybe? With raises pegged to inflation and anything beyond that tied to performance . . . and something that smoothes out the healthcare contributions - a 5% increase every year or something to that effect. Like I said, i'm not an expert, these are just ideas.

Now, clean house with SEPTA management. The board and top level executives are not transit people and most of them are not regular users of the system. They're bean counters and pols connected to politics in the suburban counties. Not saying that we don't need good accountants but we should have transportation experts running our system. It's a problem that's not unique to SEPTA - take the PPA for example - You know how they recently got rid of all the meters in Center City and replaced them with those green, electronic boxes that print you a receipt? That technology has been around for 15 years. So instead of just moving to it 5 or 10 years ago after the technology had been proven they shifted to digital meters and then went from the single meter to the double-headed meter. Then they came out with all this smartcard BS that's now obsolete because you can use an atm card at the new machines.

Sorry to digress but SEPTA has been doing the same thing. Perhaps you've seen the new smartcard/RFID system that PATCO has? That technology has also been around for about 10 years now. SEPTA is still 3 years away from implementation. It would eliminate the need for cashiers altogether. They could move all of them to maintenance or housekeeping or security. Same thing on regional rail trains. Having people board from all of these low-level platforms in the suburbs slows the trains down to the extent that, system-wide, they're running 2 extra trains per day on every line to provide the same level of service. Sure, platforms cost money but they would pay for themselves in 7 years. Regional rail should be proof-of-payment and you can spread the conductors around when you add service. Get more suburbanites using regional rail by offering off-peak discounts and day-passes.

Right now you have an executive board which is only interested in maintaining the status quo - and the status quo is expensive. I could go on at length but perhaps that's for another thread.
It probably could be a good topic for a thread, I certainly would be interested in it.

It seems like the place is so far behind the Washington Metro system which is much younger.
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Old 10-28-2009, 03:53 PM
 
Location: South Philly
1,943 posts, read 6,957,403 times
Reputation: 658
Quote:
Originally Posted by MBlueR View Post
Ask and you shall recieve:
I don't know what that mess was all about but where's the part where I talk about "all the opporunity" here in Philly?
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Old 10-28-2009, 04:09 PM
 
711 posts, read 1,506,931 times
Reputation: 740
Quote:
Originally Posted by solibs View Post
I don't know what that mess was all about but where's the part where I talk about "all the opporunity" here in Philly?

Who cares. Anyway I do hope septa goes on strike. Septa should be sold to the Japanese so it can be revamped and turned into a profitable entity.
Septas workers aren,t worth their weight anyway. Most of them are bums and scam artists.
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Old 10-28-2009, 04:11 PM
 
Location: South Philly
1,943 posts, read 6,957,403 times
Reputation: 658
Quote:
Originally Posted by waltlantz View Post
It seems like the place is so far behind the Washington Metro system which is much younger.
The Metro is nice because it's still relatively shiny and new. It was also built as one system. SEPTA is the cobbling together of two suburban railroad systems, two lightrail/interurban companies, 3 different bus companies and the subways and trolleys of the PTC. It's basically what would happen if you merged VRE, WMATA, all of Maryland MTA including MARC and all of the smaller county and municipal operators in Maryland and NoVa.

Anyway, underneath the shine WMATA has a massive maintenance bill coming due as they've put off a lot of work (fixing viaducts, tracks, buying new trainsets, etc) over the years. Good luck with that.

If I can say one good thing about the SEPTA leadership is that they've taken one of the oldest rail systems in the country, one that had been severely neglected for 30+ years, and have really brought it up to modern standards - I'm talking about the rail beds, tracks, catenary, vehicles etc.

The Metro is from the same era and uses the same technology as our PATCO system (or BART or MARTA) - you have to swipe your card to get in and out of the system because you pay according to how far you're going.

What I don't like about Metro is, because the DC area has an underdeveloped regional rail system, Metro tries to be both subway and regional rail and, IMO, doesn't do a good job at either. Now, to make up for that, DC is working on $1.5 billion streetcar plan to alleviate the strain on Metro from all of the suburban commuters and to reach all of those parts of the District that aren't anywhere near a Metro station.
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Old 10-28-2009, 06:00 PM
 
1,261 posts, read 2,013,764 times
Reputation: 373
Well I live in Mt. Vernon which a 60s sprawl underbelly of Old Colonial Alexandria VA, which is the at the terminus of the Metro Yellow Line.

My County of Fairfax is similar to say, Montgomery County of PA in terms of how far the Metro penetrates into the inner ring counties (maybe about halfway).

I don't think that Metro fails necessarily at either function. I do agree that it is inadequate as of now. I am also aware of deferred maintenence costs as they have been brought to light after the terrible Red Line crash.

I like it due to the frequency at which it runs, while being able to carry a large amount of people. I cannot speak for MARC, but the VRE isn't able to gain a larger foothold because it seems to only run on two fixed lines which like the SEPTA were originally used by only frieght after the rail industry collapse. NoVa is gogo modern but VA as a whole is hometown small time Dixie in mindset, so it's a HUGE hassle to fenagle with them for money to fund even road construction, let alone transit.

Also as you know Metro is strewn across 3 jusridictions and has to bug the FEDS for primary spending. I believe SEPTA has a better position due to only have to deal with one state government. But aside from whatever alleged mismanagement on part of SEPTA or it's unions, (youll have to elaborate cause I only have heard second hand accounts) Philly seems like it's in tough barganing position because as opposed to NOVA which is probably the largest money MAKER in the state, Philly despite it's prominence is a large CONSUMER of state money.

On the whole though, even if our metro transit systems right themselves in terms of management, you'll have to deal with legislatures and feds who really (and shorsightedly) only care about roads. Until this changes, it'll always be twice as harder as it needs to be.

Getting back to the strike, it seems like they are in talks. I hope everything goes well, because I don't think a lot of union workers necessarily wanna be *******s during the World Series just to be so, still which side is to be believed is another matter altogether.
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