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Old 01-03-2013, 04:58 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia
3,074 posts, read 3,154,225 times
Reputation: 1599

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
I know a lot of women who hate shopping, and prefer small-town quasi-rural living. As lawyers, professors and businesswomen, they have excellent concentration. Something tells me you don't know women very weil.
Ha been studying them my whole life;
Though like I said maybe it just has to do with the respective areas we're in where we hear these things.
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Old 01-03-2013, 05:24 PM
 
Location: The Other California
4,255 posts, read 4,711,975 times
Reputation: 1527
Quote:
Originally Posted by ParallelJJCat View Post
The singular neuter 'they' has been used as far back as the 1500s.
Well, sure. Using plural pronouns as singular neuters has been around as long as bad grammar - i.e., forever. Insofar as these usages were deliberate they were motivated by prudence, not ideology.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ParallelJJCat View Post
It appears in Shakespeare, Twain, and Orwell.
Twain doesn't count, as his characters always butchered the language. And why shouldn't writers of fiction have a few characters who butcher the language?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ParallelJJCat View Post
Many grammar guides offer it as an alternative to he/she.
Do any of these grammar guides pre-date the modern feminist movement? I didn't think so. Today the usage is political and that's another reason why it should be avoided.

Last edited by WesternPilgrim; 01-03-2013 at 05:41 PM..
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Old 01-03-2013, 06:44 PM
 
2,873 posts, read 4,744,883 times
Reputation: 4291
Quote:
Originally Posted by WesternPilgrim View Post
Well, sure. Using plural pronouns as singular neuters has been around as long as bad grammar - i.e., forever. Insofar as these usages were deliberate they were motivated by prudence, not ideology.



Twain doesn't count, as his characters always butchered the language. And why shouldn't writers of fiction have a few characters who butcher the language?



Do any of these grammar guides pre-date the modern feminist movement? I didn't think so. Today the usage is political and that's another reason why it should be avoided.
Why? Because you say the politics involved are bad? Again, it is just as political to insist that using 'he' is the only acceptable option.

And yes, the singular 'they' was found in grammar guides before the feminist movement. Indeed, in the 19th century there was a movement to make 'he' the default neuter pronoun in Britian because 'they' was in more common usage at that time. So 'he' as the default neuter is actually newer than 'they' in some English-speaking cultures.

To add...you're assuming I avoid the gendered pronoun as a political statement. I do, but not the one you think. I don't avoid the gendered pronoun because I find 'he' as the default offensive to women. If I did, I would use 'she' as my default when gender was unknown. I avoid gendered pronouns because, being differently gendered myself, I dislike assuming pronouns for men OR women. Really, it isn't so much a statement as it is something I consider common
[SIZE=3]courtesy[/SIZE].

Also, your short attention span is showing again

Last edited by ParallelJJCat; 01-03-2013 at 07:23 PM..
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Old 01-03-2013, 10:38 PM
 
Location: The Other California
4,255 posts, read 4,711,975 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ParallelJJCat View Post
I avoid gendered pronouns because, being differently gendered myself, I dislike assuming pronouns for men OR women.
"Differently gendered"? I'm sorry, but what in the blazes does that mean?
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Old 01-03-2013, 11:39 PM
 
2,873 posts, read 4,744,883 times
Reputation: 4291
Quote:
Originally Posted by WesternPilgrim View Post
"Differently gendered"? I'm sorry, but what in the blazes does that mean?
You're welcome to PM me. I don't mind discussing it, but it is off topic for the thread
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