Who are neither theist nor atheist, but religious?

[Royalite]

Originally Posted by NOTaTHEIST

I could also have missed your definition.


Excellent, now we're getting somewhere. It's possible for a non-believer to be religious, however, it would be very difficult for one to be scrupulously and conscientiously faithful to a philosophical position, which is simply antithetical to another and especially when that position involves belief.

I ask this in all sincerity. How would one go about being scrupulously and conscientiously faithful to non-belief in something? It's certainly possible for a non-believer to apply those qualifiers to something else in their life (family, friends, non-god-based religions like Buddhism or work for instance), but it seems there's little if nothing to be scrupulously and conscientiously faithful about atheism. This becomes very clear when you consider most atheists reject faith (believing in something without demonstrable evidence) altogether.

Well I was saying that you can be scrupulous and conscientiously faithful to playing a sport, a community, etc and it isn't about the existence or the nonexistence of a deity. You don't have to believe or not believe in a God in order to be faithful to those things. Those might be the things that that individual is scrupulously and conscientiously faithful to.

[geekie]

Similar question: what if it's neither false nor true but is affirmative?

[NOTaTHEIST]

Originally Posted by Royalite

Well I was saying that you can be scrupulous and conscientiously faithful to playing a sport, a community, etc and it isn't about the existence or the nonexistence of a deity. You don't have to believe or not believe in a God in order to be faithful to those things. Those might be the things that that individual is scrupulously and conscientiously faithful to.

I don't disagree with the idea here, only the word you again choose to describe the phenomenon. I would use the word commitment instead of faithful, but it's a very minor nit-pick. So yes, people can be "scrupulously and conscientiously committed" to just about any activity. I like writing for instance, so using that definition, you could say I write religiously.

What I'm not however is theistically religious. And generally when a person says, "I am religious", they're actually saying, "I am theistically religious", because that's the common usage of the word. To say you're religious about something other than god belief requires further clarification.

[Royalite]

Originally Posted by NOTaTHEIST

I don't disagree with the idea here, only the word you again choose to describe the phenomenon. I would use the word commitment instead of faithful, but it's a very minor nit-pick. So yes, people can be "scrupulously and conscientiously committed" to just about any activity. I like writing for instance, so using that definition, you could say I write religiously.

What I'm not however is theistically religious. And generally when a person says, "I am religious", they're actually saying, "I am theistically religious", because that's the common usage of the word. To say you're religious about something other than god belief requires further clarification.

notatheist, you would use the word "commitment" as opposed to "faithful" because you have a dislike for the word "faith". But the two can easily be used interchangeably.

I can tell you're not theistically religious. lol But connotation doesn't always represent denotation but the question does ask who here is religious (irrelevant of theism or atheism) and the examples I used are the reasons as to why i think it's possible to be.

[NOTaTHEIST]

Originally Posted by Royalite

notatheist, you would use the word "commitment" as opposed to "faithful" because you have a dislike for the word "faith". But the two can easily be used interchangeably.

I don't dislike the word so much as I dislike what faith generally represents in our population; believing in things without demonstrable reasons. As such, I would not use it when describing myself or my activities.

I can tell you're not theistically religious. lol

I would hope so as it's right there in my forum name

But connotation doesn't always represent denotation but the question does ask who here is religious (irrelevant of theism or atheism) and the examples I used are the reasons as to why i think it's possible to be.

From the loosest possible definition of the word, we are all religious. But then, doesn't the word loose any real meaning if it's applied freely to everyone? I'm going to assume something here, so please correct me if I'm wrong, but you're probably a Christian god believer? Now, I could call you "atheistic". Would you like that? Probably not even though it's true, because you've probably rejected countless god concepts only to arrive at one. Rejecting those concepts makes you atheistic towards those gods just as I'm atheistic towards all gods.

[Basiliximab]

Originally Posted by NOTaTHEIST

Now, I could call you "atheistic". Would you like that? Probably not even though it's true, because you've probably rejected countless god concepts only to arrive at one. Rejecting those concepts makes you atheistic towards those gods just as I'm atheistic towards all gods.

That's really interesting, I've never thought about it that way before: that probably most people are atheisitic in some sense because they're atheisitic towards either all gods or towards all except the one they believe in [I suppose this would exclude pantheists perhaps--my understanding (which is limited since I've done hardly any research on it) is that they believe in all of them?]. It definitely makes sense to me.




I enjoyed reading what you said here:

Originally Posted by NOTaTHEIST

Not knowing if something exists is not the same thing as believing something does exist. If you are willing to hold open the possibility that a god could exist (I am one of these people, but the word needs to be specifically defined first) and yet do not hold an active belief that a god does exist, then your are not a theist (atheist).


Ask yourself this simple question. Do I actively believe a god exists?

Yes = theist
No = atheist

It's pretty simple stuff.

I might add, most (perhaps all) people don't actually know if a god exists, although many claim they do. They believe a god exists and have faith in that belief in spite of having no evidence to support it. Most (perhaps all) god belief exists because of internal experience (emotions/feelings/psychosis) they're interpreting to be the influence of a god.

This is very much the way I feel about it. It's nice to see someone else have such a similar perspective; sometimes I feel I'm much alone out here (though I'm sure that's probably not true).

[NOTaTHEIST]

Originally Posted by Basiliximab

That's really interesting, I've never thought about it that way before: that
probably most people are atheisitic in some sense because they're atheisitic
towards either all gods or towards all except the one they believe in [I suppose
this would exclude pantheists perhaps--my understanding (which is limited since
I've done hardly any research on it) is that they believe in all of them?].

I'm happy you find what I write interesting. Pantheists generally think of nature as a god. Polytheists hold a belief in multiple gods. The most notable, modern polytheistic religion would be Hinduism. Some theists (I've been hearing this a ton from Christians lately) want to suggest all god concepts point to the same god. I don't believe this is even remotely true, even though I would suggest all god concepts are anthropogenic (human created).

I can't take complete credit for my comparison above. It was actually derived from this quote.

“I contend we are both atheists, I just believe in one less god than you do.
When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will
understand why I dismiss yours.” —Stephen F Roberts

This is very much the way I feel about it. It's nice to see someone else have
such a similar perspective; sometimes I feel I'm much alone out here (though I'm
sure that's probably not true).

You are not alone