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Old 08-17-2013, 06:37 PM
 
143 posts, read 272,681 times
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No, not selfish - it is called being smart. Selfishness itself implies that there exists a victim. In the case of CF, since no children are created, it really makes no sense to call one selfish for denying the said imaginary children a life, and thus the concept of selfishness cannot come to form. Now if someone argues that CFs are being selfish for denying their parents their desire to have grandchildren (a very valid claim)... well maybe they can adopt a grandchild or two.

What I don't understand is, why is the question "are CFs selfish" the default assumption? And is "selfishness" an inherently bad thing in this case? For example, most people probably want to be better off financially. Is it a bad thing to want more money then?
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Old 08-18-2013, 09:45 AM
 
Location: Earth Wanderer, longing for the stars.
12,408 posts, read 16,473,051 times
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Originally Posted by christina0001 View Post
I don't think not wanting children makes you selfish. I think our society puts way too much emphasis on having children. Due to health issues, I cannot have children without major medical intervention, and even then, I would be putting the child at risk for health issues. So I am not going to have children. People are always asking me if I plan on having children, and even when I give the brief explanation I just wrote above, they still act like I'm this poor pitiful thing and that I should at least try to have biological children. It's very hurtful. Ten years ago I might have had the same attitude so I try not to be judgmental of people who have been blessed with a life that prevents them from seeing things from my perspective. I wish we could all just respect each other's choice on the matter, regardless of the person's reasoning for having children or not having children.
In today's day and age, people still treat you that way? I think you might seriously consider getting a new bunch of friends. Times have changed.
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Old 08-18-2013, 09:54 AM
 
10,115 posts, read 6,991,237 times
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Originally Posted by longnecker View Post
Ah yes teens. That is where the saying I hope you have a kid just like you comes from.
I'm lucky--I have 5 kids between the ages of 14 and 21 (including a set of twins) and they've never been a minute of serious trouble--they're very good people and students. Still, it's a good thing you get them when they're babies, because if you didn't love your teenagers with all your heart, there would be days when you'd be tempted to strip naked, set your hair on fire, and run screaming out into the woods.
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Old 08-19-2013, 01:13 AM
 
1,938 posts, read 2,857,017 times
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Originally Posted by The Dissenter View Post
Yahoo!

Thoughts?
I think people without kids are really missing out & that they don't really understand what is so profound about raising children. I never understood this until I had kids. You just can't see it from the outside, even as an aunt or teacher.

That said, I hope that people who doubt they could be anything but selfish once parents choose to NOT have kids. The last thing this world needs are more unloved, neglected children.
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Old 08-24-2013, 08:20 PM
 
518 posts, read 1,383,012 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by west seattle gal View Post
I think people without kids are really missing out & that they don't really understand what is so profound about raising children. I never understood this until I had kids. You just can't see it from the outside, even as an aunt or teacher.

That said, I hope that people who doubt they could be anything but selfish once parents choose to NOT have kids. The last thing this world needs are more unloved, neglected children.


I have kids--they're great, fun, annoying, inspirational, etc. However, I think having kids is a tradeoff. I'm not sure those without kids "don't really understand what is so profound about raising children." Perhaps this is because my kids are not fully grown. I don't think there's anything profound about raising kids. They do become the most important priority. However, this comes at a cost. I could be having a very, very good time going on trips, owning multiple properties is various locations around the world, doing what we want as we please, but kids constrain this option. So, folks that don't have kids have much more freedom to enjoy life at a certain level. Of course, I'm glad I had kids, but I don't think there's some profoundity about raising them. It's a tradeoff.
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Old 08-25-2013, 12:15 PM
 
Location: Northeastern US
14,191 posts, read 9,079,084 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NexgrillSucks View Post
No, not selfish - it is called being smart. Selfishness itself implies that there exists a victim. In the case of CF, since no children are created, it really makes no sense to call one selfish for denying the said imaginary children a life, and thus the concept of selfishness cannot come to form.
Maybe it's selfless to deny your primal impulse to have children in order to spare potential human beings the suffering of existence. People who never exist do not suffer any harm from not existing, even if the potential is there for their existence to have been (mostly) pleasant. However, any person who exists must accept the crap shoot that is life, including the possibility of extreme suffering (incurable illness, terrible maiming or crippling, horrible personal losses, heartache and heartbreak in all its forms, etc). Every person who has children is rolling the dice with their children's lives, in an environment where there are zero guarantees. We all imagine our children will be happy and thankful for their existence but we actually have no basis for that. It's a hope, to be sure, but nothing more.

A less extreme example: the biological mother of my children became progressively mentally ill during our marriage (paranoid schizophrenia AND borderline personality disorder). I taught my daughter from her early teens on that the risk of madness jumping a generation to her children made it irresponsible to have children of her own. If she must have children, adopt; there are plenty of needy children. Instead she went ahead and had 3 (and counting) children of her own. One of them is mentally unstable and clearly suffering. At least if she had adopted a child like that she could rationalize that the child would have existed anyway. Now what she has done is to introduce more suffering into the world, a world that already has far too much of it.

Of course what she does at the age of 34 is her business, not mine, so I zip my lips and refrain from "I told you so". I'm just advocating for people to bring awareness to having children and not use my daughter's rationalization, which was, literally, "it would have happened sooner or later anyway". That's actually more thought than most people bother to bring to the topic. That level of unawareness is child abuse, as far as I'm concerned.
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Old 08-26-2013, 10:23 AM
 
Location: Toronto, ON
564 posts, read 877,804 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by west seattle gal View Post
I think people without kids are really missing out & that they don't really understand what is so profound about raising children. I never understood this until I had kids. You just can't see it from the outside, even as an aunt or teacher.

That said, I hope that people who doubt they could be anything but selfish once parents choose to NOT have kids. The last thing this world needs are more unloved, neglected children.
This could easily be rewritten as "...they don't really understand what is so profound about climbing a mountain like Everest. I never understood this until I stood at the summit."

I can still appreciate the video and pictures that others have taken from that vantage, admire the effort it took to get there, and perhaps for a few moments, even imagine myself standing there. But then I go back to doing what I do, and what gives my life meaning. What is "profound" to me (or you) might not mean anything to someone else, and that's ok.
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Old 08-26-2013, 10:53 AM
 
2,759 posts, read 3,422,038 times
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Children would bring me misery - and vice versa - because I don't like them (but some of them gravitate toward me - go figure). Yes, it's being selfish; I LIKE attention - and don't want to share it. I sacrifice enough (money, time, etc.) in life; I don't need to sacrifice more for a child.

I love babies and dogs. I'd sacrifice for them in a minute.

When (some) children reach a certain age, they are smart-alecks, imho. They justifiably crave more attention, too, and a good parent should drop everything to see about them. I'm not the one for that.

Life has denied me enough already (tune the violins ), and I will obtain much more from life than what it has so far given me. I'll try harder and attain more. There's better things in store for me. With children, it would be impossible for me to reach certain goals.

I couldn't have traveled nearly as much had I been a parent. Children are expensive. Traveling solo is expensive enough. Thankfully, I've seen so much of this country - alone - and have treasured every moment of it.

The world needs more good parents. My heart told me that I would have been a horrible parent. I listened to it, and that's one of the wisest things I've ever done.
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Old 08-27-2013, 07:30 AM
 
Location: Westchester, NY
191 posts, read 280,257 times
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I don't think anyone has the right to call you selfish if you decide not to have children. Who are they to judge you? They don't know anything about you or your situation and feelings.

If someone is not ready to bring a child into this world and care for them, then why would you call them selfish?

What I think is a smart move, is realizing that children are not for you and not having them. Why on earth would you bring a child to this world and not be 100% in it? That's selfish! The only person that will suffer is the poor child.

If you don't want kids, then more power to you. Live your life however you want to live it. It's call free will!

If you want kids, then more power to you as well. Enjoy them! They will bring happiness into your life. I have a 15 month old daughter and I couldn't in a million years picture my life without her.
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Old 08-27-2013, 09:43 AM
 
Location: Westchester, NY
191 posts, read 280,257 times
Reputation: 225
You want to know what's selfish???

This is selfish!

Pa. woman gives birth in sports bar, suffocates newborn and hides body in toilet tank: police - NY Daily News


How can anyone do that?!?!
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