U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Philosophy
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 10-14-2016, 09:32 AM
 
6,040 posts, read 4,409,396 times
Reputation: 16753

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by bg7 View Post
Its BS. Its a BS as excessive optimism as a "realism." Depression is a pathological state of the mind. Its basically impossible for the pathological mind to have a non-pathological viewpoint as to "reality". You'd do well to shirk self-justifying pseudo-rationality.


OP - your many postings show that you are depressed and using your intellect to indulge a self-amplifying negative.
Spot on.

Deep depression masquerading as philosophy just because you have a soapbox here.

This is like when a drunk thinks he's just had the most brilliant idea for a novel...yeah, no. Burroughs could pull that off...maybe...but your average drunk? Nope.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 10-14-2016, 12:51 PM
 
717 posts, read 473,078 times
Reputation: 1792
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy-Cat-Lady View Post
I suspect privilege
Poor thing, wrong again. Art major college drop out with college loans, married at age 20, from a small rural community in north-western PA. Even used to blame others like yourself for others success. Then I had my first child and woke up. Realized it really is all entirely up to me if I want my family to have what I want for them. Within 12 years went from earning $40k a year to 6 figures (Even still a horrible speller). All I did was set a course and 5 year plans for myself and just did it. I would ask my managers what do I need to do in the next year to get at a certain point. Then I would do them. It's not an accident.

Less then 15% of all millionaires inherited their money. The other 85% just set out and did it.

So the question is, where do you want to be in 5 years. It's not going to happen unless you set out to do it. Whether you want to believe it or not, we all want you to succeed. What are you doing to get there?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-14-2016, 01:26 PM
 
Location: Birmingham, Alabama
2,056 posts, read 1,961,003 times
Reputation: 3533
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagardener View Post
The boomers were more successful for exactly 1 reason: Good economy.

Uh no. I am a middle-boomer and when I graduated college there was 15% unemployment in my state. I had to move 1,000 miles to get a waitress job, then a clerk job. My boomer generation had 10 people competing for every one job. And you had to have "experience". I said many times "How can I have experience if I can't get a job?"

I became self-employed because if I was gonna make very little money at least I'd be doing something I wanted to. My partner and I worked 10 years before we made any decent money. Our friends (also boomers) that made money were in real estate or joined their parents business.

As far as your other complaints about work: Yes, rich kids have it a little easier than poor kids when it comes to getting started in the world. Yes, attractive people also have it a little easier and studies show they make more money. Yes, talented people can be more successful but not all talented people are successful.

You have to decide whether your goal is to "get rich" or "be successful". They are not the same thing. Success means different things to different people. It could be easy to get rich if you are willing to do anything to get there, even die or go to jail.

My idea of success is working at something I really enjoyed and was good at. I did that. If money was my goal I would have quit because it was many, many years before money came. I agree with you that hard work is not enough. You also need a fair playing field, which in the US many people of color do not have due to poverty, poor education and the difficulty of breaking out of generations of defeat. But even with all our problems the US is where the world wants to come to achieve success.

Some people in the world may be unable to achieve their dreams due to the circumstances they are born into. You however are not doomed. You are educated, well-spoken, technologically literate and bi-lingual. You are so far above "doomed" it isn't funny.

Stop complaining about what you don't have and see all that you do have. Use your gifts, find out what you would do if no one paid you one dollar and figure out how to do that and make a life for yourself. It's your money or your life. Nice if you can get both and worth trying for.
really love this post. There is little gained by complaining, though I mostly agree with the original poster. And I can see why he might determine that hard work isn't something he wants to be a part of anymore. THAT may be the secret to happiness for him, and if he doesn't go into a Luby's and shoot the place up, because he's not angry or depressed, we all win!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-14-2016, 01:53 PM
 
332 posts, read 190,035 times
Reputation: 524
Maybe decades ago it meant something, and was actually encouraged among people in society. But in today's times, people who work hard (ie. work horses, married to my job/career etc.) rarely get compensated for their hard work, dedication, loyalty, etc. instead they get taken advantage of and used. Kind of like group work in high school where there is that one person who actually does the work and the rest don't give a flip. In fact, it's not what you know, but who you know that can help get you a good job...you know, when you don't have to BS, bribe or sleep your way to the top. I also feel that some things go a little too far when you place it as a career and symbiotically what also passes as "entertainment", for example: being on a reality show, being a youtuber, etc.

Also, what another poster said as they listed a bunch of topics that have to do with your place in life:
Luck
Genetics
The family you're born into
Where you're born
Your sexual orientation
Your face (sadly, racism still exists)
Your gender (sexism still exists)
Mental and physical health

I feel these things do matter to an extent, but it really depends on your own happiness, life, and where YOU want to be. Are people working to get out of their comfort zones or do they like being stuck in a job they hate or have a "ehh it's a job" mentality about? If they hate their job, do they try and leave? Do people live in an area where they can be more successful work-wise where some of the above listed can be at play to benefit them? I think it would be easier if we could all be our own boss at something lol. Maybe it's just what you are getting paid to do as for your job vs. what you have to put up with while at your job. Life is give and take.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-14-2016, 02:48 PM
 
15,714 posts, read 9,212,783 times
Reputation: 14155
Quote:
Originally Posted by hakkarin View Post
Yes it will. How do you think most people succeed in the corporate world? By being backstabbers and schemers.
Says the person that has never had a corporate position, and has no idea how corporations really work.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-14-2016, 02:50 PM
 
15,714 posts, read 9,212,783 times
Reputation: 14155
Quote:
Originally Posted by IamDot View Post
Stroke of luck happened with the above bolded. Imagine if the pro from IBM showed up for the job. You would have been out, no questions asked, and no one would care how hard you worked. Luck has to be involved for anything good to happen.

You can never gain luck by hard work, because the definition of luck is "good fortune; advantage or success, considered as the result of chance." Now people always say "if you work hard enough luck happens." Nope. Luck is happenstance and can occur with the laziest of people. Then people will say "if you are there at the right time because of your hard work... luck happens more often." Nope. Luck is happenstance and can occur once in someone's life through no work or effort on that person's part. If luck resulted from hard work, then why aren't there millions of lottery winners working in the rice fields of China. Those people work hard every day, luck should be shining its light on them. Nope. Luck is completely distinct from hard work.
That's not luck, it's "life". Things happen randomly, sometimes in our favor, sometimes not.

Luck is nothing more than the excuse lazy people give for their lack of success in this world. They spend their whole lives waiting for their luck to change, all the while ignoring life that is happening, that if grabbed, would change their lot.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-14-2016, 02:52 PM
 
15,714 posts, read 9,212,783 times
Reputation: 14155
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy-Cat-Lady View Post
Hard work doesn't often necessarily equal success. These things are just as much part of it (if not more so):

Luck
Genetics
The family you're born into
Where you're born
Your sexual orientation
Your face (sadly, racism still exists)
Your gender (sexism still exists)
Mental and physical health

When it's a level playing field, maybe I'll believe accusations of laziness and poor decision making, usually aimed at those who were born with some sort of disadvantage or are part of a marginalized group.
Looky there, a list of ready-made excuses for why someone can't become successful.

Life is never a level playing field - we are not machines. For all those obstacles you listed, there are millions that have overcome them to become successes.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-14-2016, 03:06 PM
 
15,714 posts, read 9,212,783 times
Reputation: 14155
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy-Cat-Lady View Post
Boomers are so out of touch with how it is to adult now that I can't even be bothered to argue. Different world *sigh*.
You're so right. Oh, to go back to 15% unemployment and 18% mortgage interest rates. Good times......

You're confusing "generation" with "age". Anyone in their 20's in most certainly living a different life than someone in their 60's. Guess what, when these 20 year olds are in their 60's, they will be out of touch with how it is to "adult" compared to those in their 20's.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-14-2016, 03:08 PM
 
15,714 posts, read 9,212,783 times
Reputation: 14155
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy-Cat-Lady View Post
I suspect privilege
Of course you do. How else can you justify your own lack of success than to assume someone else got dealt a better hand than you did.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-14-2016, 05:37 PM
 
Location: Northeastern US
14,191 posts, read 9,037,089 times
Reputation: 6077
The whole Horatio Alger, rags to riches, anyone can be President schtick is even less true today than it ever was.

However the OP seems to be focusing on attainment of wealth and fame, which are not necessary to feel accomplished, successful, content, etc.

I have worked hard, or at least diligently, all my life. I feel it has not only been worth the effort, but that it is the area of my life that has worked better than most. I'm not wealthy or famous, but I have accomplished useful, meaningful things that in some small way have made the world a better place.

I come from a lower middle class blue collar family with no particular advantages apart from it being a loving, supportive, intact family.

Yes there has been, as there always is, an element of luck. But nothing extraordinary.

So ... no, it isn't always true that hard work is bunk.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Philosophy
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top