New tallest building FINALLY coming to Phoenix! (lofts, condominiums)

[ptbrennan]

Originally Posted by Magnum Mike

Don't we have a place in Phoenix called The Desert Botanical Gardens right by the Phoenix Zoo and Papago Park?

Don't forget Pueblo Grande, also nearby. Tack on a 5-minute drive to downtown Phoenix and enjoy the Science Museum, Art Museum, Heard Museum, Heritage Square, Irish Cultural Center, Japanese Gardens, and the private art galleries downtown. On the way there, one could stop for lunch at the Chinese Cultural Center. But that seems like a long day.

Nonetheless, why not demand more museums downtown? I don't have anything against adding to what we have, but people shouldn't so readily discount what is there - or within a short drive.

[Valley Native]

Originally Posted by CheyDee

Am I the only one who thinks this may not be a great idea, due to the state of current events? Building a brand new high rise, which in essence will scream, "Look at me!", and will house thousands of people at any given time, seems to me to be in poor judgment.

I think that's being paranoid. Saying that we shouldn't build skyscrapers for fear of another 9/11 is like telling the terrorists that they've beaten us. We must be stronger than them, and keep building highrises, roads, bridges, etc. To hell with what the radical Muslims or other terrorist networks think of us. Chances are, if they're going to plan another attack on the U.S., it won't be hijacking airplanes and crashing them into buildings again.

Originally Posted by Ponderosa

I would guess that the conservative libertarian leanings only extends to being critical of government handouts that do not benefit your pet causes. If the government were not supporting the nonsense directly with tax dollars (light rail) and multi-million dollar tax subsidies to developers, the whole city-scape (and all the other ill-conceived downtown projects we have had to dig into our pockets for over the years) would fall on its financially indefensible butt. Get government out and let the market decide how Phoenix should develop.

I beg your pardon, but most of the vertical development under way, or being planned in the Phoenix area is by PRIVATE developers, and that includes CityScape. The only exception is the Sheraton, which is being constructed with public funds. I would have preferred that the Sheraton be financed by private dollars as well ... but the hotel is needed for many reasons, mainly the new convention center.

Also, the market IS deciding how Phoenix should develop. The vacancy rate in downtown Phoenix is the lowest it has been in decades. There's sufficient demand for more vertical development in the central city. As for the light rail, I'm not crazy about the concept of it either, but it was passed by the voters TWICE (first phase in 2000, and the second phase in the 2004 general election). That being said, it's unconstitutional for government to overturn something which is approved by a majority public vote.

[Ponderosa]

You need to do some research. Phoenix is subsidizing RED and Collier to the tune of some 100 million. The CityNorth project is getting similar public assistance. Left to true market forces, Phx metro would probably disappear from the earth or at least downtown would be tract houses like everywhere else. Downtown development is economic BS that you and I pay for to make a few rich people richer.

[HX_Guy]

Yes, the city is giving them $100 Million but getting $900 million invested back. I don't know about you, but I would take that deal.

As for the Sheraton, it was built with public funds but will be paid back to the city from the revenue.

[CheyDee]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

I think that's being paranoid. Saying that we shouldn't build skyscrapers for fear of another 9/11 is like telling the terrorists that they've beaten us. We must be stronger than them, and keep building highrises, roads, bridges, etc. To hell with what the radical Muslims or other terrorist networks think of us. Chances are, if they're going to plan another attack on the U.S., it won't be hijacking airplanes and crashing them into buildings again.

I agree that another attempt may not be by hijacking more airplanes, which I have already stated. However, I also believe that building new high rises, or anything which will hold such massive amounts of people at one time, without the advantages of security measures similar to which many stadiums now use when they are full of people (which would be 24/7 in a high rise), such as a moderate police presence, metal detectors, dogs, etc., is a sign of the times, not an admission of defeat. If you do not think anything could happen or nobody is out to cause mass American casualties, you only have to look at what happened in New Jersey a few months ago, with the people who were planning to attack Fort Dix. Or you can look at what happened in Queens, NY, with the people who were going to attack Kennedy airport. There are many other examples, as well. If you think I am exaggerating this, please feel free to check the FBI's website and look under "Domestic Terrorism". Since these attempts are occurring quite often, I feel we should be on the offensive against it. IMHO, building a high rise such as this is not prudent. As I said before, I certainly do hope and pray I am wrong and am, as you say, just "being paranoid".

I appreciate your input though.

[Magnum Mike]

Originally Posted by CheyDee

I agree that another attempt may not be by hijacking more airplanes, which I have already stated. However, I also believe that building new high rises, or anything which will hold such massive amounts of people at one time, without the advantages of security measures similar to which many stadiums now use when they are full of people (which would be 24/7 in a high rise), such as a moderate police presence, metal detectors, dogs, etc., is a sign of the times, not an admission of defeat. If you do not think anything could happen or nobody is out to cause mass American casualties, you only have to look at what happened in New Jersey a few months ago, with the people who were planning to attack Fort Dix. Or you can look at what happened in Queens, NY, with the people who were going to attack Kennedy airport. There are many other examples, as well. If you think I am exaggerating this, please feel free to check the FBI's website and look under "Domestic Terrorism". Since these attempts are occurring quite often, I feel we should be on the offensive against it. IMHO, building a high rise such as this is not prudent. As I said before, I certainly do hope and pray I am wrong and am, as you say, just "being paranoid".

I appreciate your input though.

Terrorists will not be looking to Phoenix to plan a massive attack like that of September 11th, 2001, they'll more than likely to look at bigger cities. I also don't think they have the financial resources to plan an attack or buy the materials for it.

[HX_Guy]

Here are the new renderings for CityScape. Also, they have filed for FAA height clearance which gives the actual planned height.


Study (ASN): 2007-AWP-5520-OE
Status: Work In Progress

Work Schedule: 10/01/2007 to 12/15/2009
Other Description: 45 Story Hotel/ Condo Tower

Structure Height: 510 ft.



Study (ASN): 2007-AWP-5521-OE
Status: Work In Progress

Work Schedule: 10/01/2007 to 12/15/2009

Other Description: 27 Story Office Tower

Structure Height: 375 ft.

[calzonan3517]

This all looks splended. What I want to know is will there be as many trees planted as shown in these preleminary plans??

Believe it or not we need more trees downtown. There are plenty of smart trees that are water conservers, great cleaning the air, and best of all...provided need shade!!

I really hope they are planted and not just planned. Ya know!

[vegaspilgrim]

Originally Posted by calzonan3517

This all looks splended. What I want to know is will there be as many trees planted as shown in these preleminary plans??

Believe it or not we need more trees downtown. There are plenty of smart trees that are water conservers, great cleaning the air, and best of all...provided need shade!!

I really hope they are planted and not just planned. Ya know!

I agree that we need more trees... however, not more dinky paloverdes, please! Unfortunately, that's all they are planting these days. Paloverdes are great in the open desert, or for drive-by landscaping. For pedestrian environments, they just don't cut it. I agree, there is a time and place for xeriscaped plants and trees-- but downtown is NOT the place. We need huge, leafy trees that provide real shade-- the kind you can find in old neighorhoods around the valley.

[HX_Guy]

Most likely it will be Paloverdes. I agree that they aren't the best for shade, but they are a desert tree and do very well with little water.

I would love to see Ficus trees, they have an excellent green color and provide very good shade...but they love water!