Who pays for the helicopter if you get stuck on a mt.?

[locolobo13]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

Of course we rescue all of the above ... nothing wrong with that. The issue is: who should pay for these rescues? Let tax money pay for the fire departments to put out fires and rescue those who are trapped in burning structures. The inexperienced bozos who hike these mountains and wander off to become lost or stranded are taking up valuable time from firefighters to tend to more essential needs. Therefore, they should flip the bill for their own stupidity. Ignorance often comes with a pricetag, and it shouldn't rest on the backs of taxpayers.

Thing is EVERY accident somebody did something stupid. Instead of providing free rescue service perhaps we should ALWAYS charge the offending party? What if the offending party is unable to agree to pay for it? I've seen people rescued who were in distress, who were talked into going to the hospital, who probably would have been OK if they just went home on their own.

Originally Posted by Valley Native

Not only that, but the idiots who take leisurely hikes in the middle of summer when it's 110+ degrees. Even with water, they're putting themselves at risk for heat stroke. These urban mountains are still wildnerness areas, and too many people take them for granted. That's why there are so many incidents.

I don't agree with this. In that case just close the parks in the summer. Make it a crime to enter the parks. Take those people directly to tent city.

But think about this. Are you saying we should make it illegal to go outside when it's 110+ degrees? Old people gardening? Construction workers? College football teams are out there practicing too. No rescue for them? Charge them for the service?

I ride my bicycle to work year round. Last August, when everbody was complaining, I was riding my bicycle past Phoenix College. Guess what? Their football team was out there practicing, at 5:30 in the afternoon.

I'm for the stupid motorist law. People should be responsible for their actions true. But I don't want to see us go overboard either. Rather than that just drop rescue service all together. Let private enterprise pick it up. I'm not sure I'm for that either.

[Ponderosa]

Originally Posted by locolobo13

Thing is EVERY accident somebody did something stupid. Instead of providing free rescue service perhaps we should ALWAYS charge the offending party? What if the offending party is unable to agree to pay for it? I've seen people rescued who were in distress, who were talked into going to the hospital, who probably would have been OK if they just went home on their own.



I don't agree with this. In that case just close the parks in the summer. Make it a crime to enter the parks. Take those people directly to tent city.

But think about this. Are you saying we should make it illegal to go outside when it's 110+ degrees? Old people gardening? Construction workers? College football teams are out there practicing too. No rescue for them? Charge them for the service?

I ride my bicycle to work year round. Last August, when everbody was complaining, I was riding my bicycle past Phoenix College. Guess what? Their football team was out there practicing, at 5:30 in the afternoon.

I'm for the stupid motorist law. People should be responsible for their actions true. But I don't want to see us go overboard either. Rather than that just drop rescue service all together. Let private enterprise pick it up. I'm not sure I'm for that either.

Compassion must be a profit center in 21st century America for some. I doubt it would ever be profitable to run a rescue service. The incidents are too few and the overhead too high. We could try to recover a part of the cost of a publically funded service, I suppose. But I fear the expense of three bureaucrats in every agency to administer the cost recovery policies would far exceed the amount recovered.

[FadedGlory]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

Of course we rescue all of the above ... nothing wrong with that. The issue is: who should pay for these rescues? Let tax money pay for the fire departments to put out fires and rescue those who are trapped in burning structures. The inexperienced bozos who hike these mountains and wander off to become lost or stranded are taking up valuable time from firefighters to tend to more essential needs. Therefore, they should flip the bill for their own stupidity. Ignorance often comes with a pricetag, and it shouldn't rest on the backs of taxpayers.



Not only that, but the idiots who take leisurely hikes in the middle of summer when it's 110+ degrees. Even with water, they're putting themselves at risk for heat stroke. These urban mountains are still wildnerness areas, and too many people take them for granted. That's why there are so many incidents.

It was the Fire Departments idea to begin doing this. As I stated there was a system in place and working. I'm not going to knock the FD for the job they do. I do know for a fact that while they are on these calls there are procedures in place so that ALL fire related areas are still covered. If you don't like the system that's currently in place then maybe talk to the city leaders to have it changed.

[ReadyFreddy]

I'm a little afraid of the slippery slope. I don't want to go back to bodies in the streets, because no one stepped up to pay for burial/disposal.

We pay for so many other silly things for the indigent. Their cigarettes and antidepressants and chocolate covered cherries. I figure their rescues are at least somewhat justified. Though I'm all for a stupid hiker law. I figure the stupid hikers wouldn't know it existed, so would still call for help. Do people stupid enough to drive past a barricade into a flooded gully really think about laws and consequences first?

[tripper76]

Originally Posted by locolobo13

I don't agree with this. In that case just close the parks in the summer. Make it a crime to enter the parks. Take those people directly to tent city.

But think about this. Are you saying we should make it illegal to go outside when it's 110+ degrees? Old people gardening? Construction workers? College football teams are out there practicing too. No rescue for them? Charge them for the service?

I ride my bicycle to work year round. Last August, when everbody was complaining, I was riding my bicycle past Phoenix College. Guess what? Their football team was out there practicing, at 5:30 in the afternoon.

I'm for the stupid motorist law. People should be responsible for their actions true. But I don't want to see us go overboard either. Rather than that just drop rescue service all together. Let private enterprise pick it up. I'm not sure I'm for that either.

Well, there is a difference between going about your normal, daily life while the weather is bad...and making a decision to hike a mountain in 110 degree heat. The scenarios you mentioned lean more towards medical emergency rather than rescue.

With that said, I haven't made up my own mind about the whole issue. I think its a case by case basis, which is also hard to judge. For example, should all hikers who need rescue be charged? Or only the ones who's decision was deemed to be the cause of their problem? At what point does the "risk" of hiking, biking, swiming, boating, etc cross over from normal risk to negligent?