Denver Or Phoenix (Scottsdale, Chandler, Flagstaff: to live in, pollution, swimming pool)

[vegaspilgrim]

Originally Posted by twiggy

If you do have kids I would pick Denver. Air quality and schools are better. Skin cancer risks are less. My kids swim here all summer and I have a great worry about their skin. But, if they didn't swim they wouldn't get any exercise, so, they swim and I worry.

Nope, incorrect. As I've said before, given the same temperature, and being outside in the same time of the day, your risk of getting sunburn and eventual skin cancer is GREATER in Denver than in Phoenix, not lesser. You can get burned badly in Denver in no time if you're out in the middle of the day with no sunscreen on-- even if it's only 80 degrees out. You can get sunburn even if it's 30 degrees out if the sunlight is reflecting on the snow. No joke. Colorado has one of the highest rates of skin cancer, as well as high rates of people with dry skin problems. If you want to move to a place with less intensity of the sun's rays, think Portland or Seattle. That being said, most people in Colorado ARE very physically active and outdoorsy. CO was just rated the least obese state in the nation. I'm not sure if it has more to do with the weather itself, or the culture of the populace.

Originally Posted by londonbarcelona

Phoenix has little water, and absolutely no beach. Denver has more water, but still, no real beach.
People don't really "swim" in the Phoenix "lakes" in Denver they do. In Chicago, we called them quarrys.
However, both cities have very large populations of past residents of Chicago.

Come on, this is a silly comparison. Denver gets about 16 inches of rain a year, Phoenix gets 8 (not this year, of course). That is still really low, Denver is still considered "semi-arid." Moving to Denver for the water is like moving to Fargo, ND, for the big city. Sure, there are reservoirs like Cherry Creek Dam, Chatfield, and Aurora Reservoir, and a lot of people take their boats on it, which is nice, and some people do swim in the water, but those people are absolutely gross. If you want to move to Denver so you can swim in e-coli infested water, go right ahead. Actually, the few lakes that do exist within an hour's drive of Phoenix, like Saguaro Lake, Bartlett, Lake Pleasant, Roosevelt Dam, are gorgeous, with a beautiful contrast of water with desert mountains and scenery. All the dams in the Front Range are in flat plains with no scenery.

[synapse]

Originally Posted by diamontesareforever

If you had a choice of either Denver or Phoenix with all reasons aside that keeps you on one place over the other such as your family, your friends, your job, whatever it might be what would you prefer? You can take your family, friends, and your career with you. Would you stay or go? Intangibles like schools, weather, crime, economy, nightlife, recreation all matter. Answers from those who've spent time in both would be appreciated. I have to take on a job that requires relocation from Chicago to one of the two.

I'd go with Denver. Denver has some similarities to Chicago in that it has a fairly vibrant, walkable downtown; a light rail, that in its hub downtown, functions a bit like the "L"; a vibrant sports scene; nice museums; and walkable areas along the river. Phoenix has a lot of Chicago transplants, and the Cubs play there in the sumnmer, but the downtown of Phoenix is less developed; it's more a sprawling than walkable city (though only downtown Denver is really walkable); light rail is just starting; and the weather is considerably different, with no snow. I think if you're moving from Chicago you'll find more similiarities in Denver than you would in Phoenix.

[Steve-o]

Originally Posted by vegaspilgrim

Nope, incorrect. As I've said before, given the same temperature, and being outside in the same time of the day, your risk of getting sunburn and eventual skin cancer is GREATER in Denver than in Phoenix, not lesser. You can get burned badly in Denver in no time if you're out in the middle of the day with no sunscreen on-- even if it's only 80 degrees out. You can get sunburn even if it's 30 degrees out if the sunlight is reflecting on the snow. No joke. Colorado has one of the highest rates of skin cancer, as well as high rates of people with dry skin problems.

Absolutely not. AZ has the worlds 2nd highest skin cancer rate, second only to Australia. Protect yourself, people. That sun down there is brutal and relentless. All you sun-worshippers may end up paying for it with your lives.

Arizona Cancer Center :: Cancer Prevention and Control Programs

[mortimer]

Steve-o corrected:

> Originally Posted by vegaspilgrim
> > Nope, incorrect. As I've said before, given the same temperature, and
> > being outside in the same time of the day, your risk of getting sunburn
> > and eventual skin cancer is GREATER in Denver than in Phoenix,

> > Colorado has one of the highest rates of skin cancer, ...

> Absolutely not. AZ has the worlds 2nd highest skin cancer rate, ....

Everything quoted above by vegaspilgrim is true. He didn't say
"higher (than AZ)" he said "one of the highest."

AZ probably has a higher rate because it's hotter and people strip off
their clothes more.

Denver is about 4000 ft higher than Phoenix and therefore there is less
atmosphere shielding your skin from the sun, so all things being equal
(70-90 degree day & sunny ...) ...

[steve22]

I feel I'm pretty qualified to comment on the subject of skin cancer, considering that I make a living diagnosing it. Statistically, Phoenix is the #2 major city in the world in terms of skin cancer diagnoses, behind only Sydney, Aus. There are different kinds of skin cancer, keep in mind; by far and away the most common is basal cell, which can be locally destructive but generally will not metastasize or kill. Basal cells are caused by higher exposure to UVB rays, which can be filtered by sunscreen. Melanomas, though much less common, are deadly. They will metastasize, and once they do, you're good as gone. Melanoma is caused by UVA ray exposure (the higher wavelength), which penetrate more deeply and sunscreen will not protect you against them.

It's true that the higher elevation in Denver causes a greater exposure to higher levels of radiation; it's estimated that the intensity of the sun's radiation at 6000 feet of elevation is about twice what it is at sea level. The difference in incidence of skin cancer between the two places is probably more due to the fact that in Denver, people are less likely to sit out by the pool all year and deliberately expose every inch of their body to the sun's rays the way that people do in Phoenix. Just a guess.

But anyway, all things considered, I always felt in Denver that I was part of a community, there was just so much more of a sense of "place". There is no sense of community or place in Phoenix. L.A. used to be known as "The Big Nowhere"; I believe the term is better applied to Phoenix, b/c that's exactly what it is. Denver felt cosmopolitan, exciting, and vibrant; similar to Chicago, but smaller. Phoenix felt like living in the world's biggest, hottest Wal-Mart. Just my take from experience.

[Steve-o]

Good post Steve22 (nice name too ). While the sun in Denver might affect you more, youre also subjected to less of it, also while having to cover yourself with long sleeves from the winter temps for several months of the year. When in Denver, I never got the impression that people were sun-worshippers like they are in Arizona. Strolling around Phoenix and Scottsdale and people-watching is quite disgusting. Ive never see such a high concentration of destroyed skin as I do when in the Valley, its grotesque, especially on older women. Do they seriously think they look good looking like a piece of chewed leather? Really, people, get out of the sun.

[nitram]

Winter in Phoenix, summers in Denver. You get the best of both worlds that way.

[steve22]

Originally Posted by nitram

Winter in Phoenix, summers in Denver. You get the best of both worlds that way.

No way. You can ski in Denver, and it's very sunny and pleasant down in the city most of the time excepting the occasional snowstorm. Daytime highs in Phoenix aren't really that much warmer than Denver in the winter, at least not nearly enough to make me want to give up the great outdoor activities in CO. At the start of the Rock n' Roll marathon this year in PHX, the temp was 30! That race was damn cold, let me tell you. Lots of folks from out of town were shivering and pretty disappointed. Contrary to popular belief, winters in Phoenix are hardly balmy. So no thanks, think I'll keep Denver, year round.

[nitram]

Well Steve you can stay in Denver. I don't ski and sure as heck don't care for the winter slushy snow and the winter snow blackouts, cars sliding all over the slick roads and the freezing cold weather. Phoenix winters have everyone beat. They are mostly balmy and ideal. why do you think the area in Phoenix more than doubles in population in the winter. 30 degree weather in Phoenix is usually only for a few days.

[tscrilla]

Originally Posted by diamontesareforever

If you had a choice of either Denver or Phoenix with all reasons aside that keeps you on one place over the other such as your family, your friends, your job, whatever it might be what would you prefer? You can take your family, friends, and your career with you. Would you stay or go? Intangibles like schools, weather, crime, economy, nightlife, recreation all matter. Answers from those who've spent time in both would be appreciated. I have to take on a job that requires relocation from Chicago to one of the two.

Denver all the way!!! I lived in Phx for 5 too long years before I moved out last summer. Denver actually has warmer daytime high temps than you'd think in the winter, it's the night time low that dips due to the high, dry air.

Never understood why Phx news stations had meteorologists since the forecast is the exact same everyday...hot, sunny, no rain because of the expansive heat island. You're lucky to get in 2-3 good months out of the year in AZ, Denver will give you about 9 good months.